Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

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Originally Posted by Anvaire

I actually don't think they are likely to add another limited job until the Blue mage experiment is concluded. Yoshi P has already said that its not complete yet, which is why they haven't taken on the feedback given around it. As for Eureka, i still suspect it is responsible for or at the least has contributed to the races being locked in the first place. That thing had to be adjusted and fixed so many times during SB and that's before we consider how late it was in the first place. Makes me think that maybe it ate up a lot of development time and the rest was perhaps caused by them not realising quite how much work a race would be. I know Yoshi P has provided a response. But i do see a lot of that as a PR/ Damage limitation exercise. Not saying he's outright lying, just that the truth he has presented isn't necessarily the whole truth.

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I know I will get called out for saying this, but I think that the glasses were doen much before they were revealed plus I think that theym ight be doing this so they can save some work for themselves this expac and then release the missing genders on 6.0 and say: It has been so hard but we listened!

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Just make a max height male midlander, or miqo'te and pretend you are a viera, by buying ears. Same thing.

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Bro why are you even playing an Au Ra? Just make a min height Midlander or Miqo'te and put on some horns. Same thing.

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

Not to mention the amount of gear, emotes, housing items, and such locked behind Eureka. I recognize there's a subset of players that actually like it, but let's be fair, if there weren't so many carrots behind it, it wouldn't be played near as much. I mean, if we're talking about eating dev resources for content that only a small amount of players are going to use... :D

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I wouldn't consider the number of people engaging and genuinely enjoying Eureka to be 'small'. Especially when it has been consistently active across all four maps at peak times ever since its implementation. Which is more than what can be said of things like ranked PvP and Ultimate battles. Neither of which I would want to see removed from the game just because they happen to appeal to a niche audience.

As for carrots on a stick, that applies to pretty much every aspect of the game.

Either way, I don't think asking for content to be delayed/scrapped so that bunny men can be added is going to go down well with the broader community, let alone those of us who want bunny men but also enjoy the game and want new content to sink our claws into.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I wouldn't consider the number of people engaging and genuinely enjoying Eureka to be 'small'. Especially when it has been consistently active across all four maps at peak times ever since its implementation. Which is more than what can be said of things like ranked PvP and Ultimate battles. Neither of which I would want to see removed from the game just because they happen to appeal to a niche audience.

As for carrots on a stick, that applies to pretty much every aspect of the game.

Either way, I don't think asking for content to be delayed/scrapped so that bunny men can be added is going to go down well with the broader community, let alone those of us who want bunny men but also enjoy the game and want new content to sink our claws into.

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Unless you can conduct a survey on how many people are enjoying it and not just queuing up to afk farm fates or get some lootboxes to turn into emotes/glamour/whatever, it is a small set of the playerbase. If you can bring raw numbers of people "enjoying" Eureka compared to things like Omega, RtI, housing (this will likely be smaller thanks to the housing issues), hunts, etc., then you'd have a point.

You greatly took my carrot comment out of context, as well, since it relates to the amount of items locked behind Eureka: every content has its minions and orchestrion rolls and whatever, but not to the extent that Eureka does, both on volume and RNG. Take primal crafting items, for example: I can't sell a Scarlet Feather for close to a million gil 'cause Suzaku drops it semi-regularily and a lot of people farm her, but Eureka has items that would regularily hit above 30 million on the MB, 50 for the ring my ex-bf wanted (and of course, other items that are normally "only" on the 100k range). The point is: there's little way of knowing how many of the people you see at peak times are there because they enjoy it, or because they want x or y item out of it. I've actually seen less drama over Primal mounts.

I'm not asking to "delete BLU" or to cancel Eureka 5.0 (I've resigned myself that it's happening and just pray it's not the only way to get the relic), I'm hoping there's an in-depth review of that type of content and at least on the "limited jobs" front, that BLU was the end of the experiment, it reaches the level cap of the other jobs and that's it.

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Originally Posted by Corue

Bro why are you even playing an Au Ra? Just make a min height Midlander or Miqo'te and put on some horns. Same thing.

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Don't give it a response.

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

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There's plenty of people who are passionate about Eureka and engage it because they enjoy it. The evidence is in the people who are there consistently and who form bonds of friendship and their own little micro-communities within the content itself, much in the same way as how a lot of people engage in A and S Rank Hunts even after they've acquired all the associated rewards. Obviously I can't provide hard data - though the same can be said of the opposing argument. Still, the developement team clearly consider it to be a success as they're bringing it back in some form alongside 5.0. Hopefully more along the lines of Pyros and Hydatos than Anemos and Pagos, though.

Either way, I don't believe it is a good idea for this thread to move in the direction of discussing what content should and should not be developed or considered valuable if it means getting male Viera. All it really serves to do is alienate those of us who desire them to be added but also wish new and existing content to be developed/expanded. Hypothetical or not, it's a slippery slope.

There actually are figures on Eureka, to be found here. It has comparable engagement to savage mode clears in each respective region, if not higher.

I have made the point before that there is content and then there is "content", but Eureka already compares favourably to raids... granted, you can question whether it's been deployed efficiently, but it isn't a total niche, like PVP or even Ultimates, and a good chunk of Gold Saucer content.

Of course, this only measures whether players have done the content, and not whether they like it... but the same applies to raids. The missing piece of the puzzle here for SE is whether it's created a sustained rise in subs relative to where the game was in HW at the same point. Unlike BLU, it doesn't simply fizzle out once players reached cap.

I have no issue with them rationalising content on a value-for-money basis, especially when it's competing for resources that could, for example, go to improving graphics/character customisation, or completing the two new races; however, I am not convinced Eureka will fare as poorly on this as, for instance, PVP, BLU etc. would. Gear output in general at its current pace could even fail such a test.

Hence, if you want to argue that some content ought to be cut - which is probably the case - the way to preface this is by saying SE should undertake some manner of evaluation of what content is good value for money and adding to the game, versus that which is not, and cut the latter. We all have our guesses as to what that might be, but only they possess the data to accurately gauge this.

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Originally Posted by MrKimper

Don't give it a response.

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"It"? That's a little bit harsh for just wanting to have a little bit of fun at male viera's expense!

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I don't believe it is a good idea for this thread to move in the direction of discussing what content should and should not be developed or considered valuable if it means getting male Viera. All it really serves to do is alienate those of us who desire them to be added but also wish new and existing content to be developed/expanded. Hypothetical or not, it's a slippery slope.

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I think beyond the subset of people who were asking for childlike Viera (which seems to mostly have stopped since Yoshida called them out and said no) the idea of losing content for the sake of male Viera is the last big obstacle to broader support for their implementation. I know personally it's the one thing that still makes me hesitate - the thought of "but what might the game be losing for this?"

That being said I think it's defintely important that this thread doesn't turn into "guys this thing is what we can give up!" because that's not going to bring anyone on board. Look at the reaction to the suggestion that we add two weeks to every patch in the cycle; people who aren't themselves planning on playing male Viera would then be "paying" for this change and I think that's when it starts to get unfair and unpopular.

Tl;dr- don't suggest what shiny toys someome has to give up for you to get your own shiny toy, that's just rude.

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Originally Posted by Veis_Alveare

I think beyond the subset of people who were asking for childlike Viera (which seems to mostly have stopped since Yoshida called them out and said no) the idea of losing content for the sake of male Viera is the last big obstacle to broader support for their implementation. I know personally it's the one thing that still makes me hesitate - the thought of "but what might the game be losing for this?"

That being said I think it's defintely important that this thread doesn't turn into "guys this thing is what we can give up!" because that's not going to bring anyone on board. Look at the reaction to the suggestion that we add two weeks to every patch in the cycle; people who aren't themselves planning on playing male Viera would then be "paying" for this change and I think that's when it starts to get unfair and unpopular.

Tl;dr- don't suggest what shiny toys someome has to give up for you to get your own shiny toy, that's just rude.

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This. All of this.