The great streamer Asmongold is joining FFXIV

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Originally Posted by Darksummoner

One could easily say the lore in WoW is better but then again WoW is using tactics where in order to understand that lore they make you buy their books in order to understand it better. It is money tactics like this that has pushed me away from their game among idiotic developers that literally pick what classes they want to do well in DPS and Heals.

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It is really better when it's not in the 60 buck product? What if you never go outside that product? So what the game provides is lacking and I can't call that better. :c Not when I can get that in another product and not have to step outside of said product. But yeah I do agree... it's all a money greed game there.

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Originally Posted by LisSquid

Nothing stops you from solo questing in any game that offers it. FFXIV is the only one that mandates it.

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FFXIV story is effectively a singleplayer linear storyline. Other players aren't taken into account - at all - in it's story telling. The problem with incorporating a proper co-op experience is it waters down the personal, story-driven experience, having to keep in mind other players and their role in it. Generally, co-op storytelling is awful, and co-op is only good for action games, platformers, etc. NOT a proper story-driven RPG experience, in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by LisSquid

Nothing stops you from solo questing in any game that offers it. FFXIV is the only one that mandates it.

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Exactly.

You can solo quest if you chose to, no one stops you from doing that. But FFXIV is an MMO and solo questing shouldn't be something you -have- to do. I should be able to party up with my friends and go nuts. It's the whole reason I play MMOs, to play with people. (Not judging anyone for enjoying to play alone though, just it isn't for me - and I think it's prob not for most MMO players because most people do play for the social aspect)

I'd say both games have their merits in terms of lore, though WoW wins out for me for a number of reasons.

For starters, it has a more interesting selection of playable races. Each with their own broad concept, fighting style, culture and agenda. I particularly liked the Blood Elves, Night Elves and Draenei when I played. FFXIV's options are fairly milquetoast by comparison as far as I'm concerned - and it doesn't help that any specialties that the playable races have are rendered obsolete because everyone supposedly has to be able to do everything.

The premise of many the classes intrigue me more. I'm a big fan of nature, so the lack of a druid or ranger job in FFXIV has always been disappointing. Same goes for darker jobs such as Death Knight, Demon Hunter and Warlock. Reaper is a good start and hopefully a sign that we're moving into grittier territory, though!

There's also a distinct starting zone for each playable race - so there's ample time to build them up and feel as though they're a part of the game world. FFXIV, meanwhile, just dumps new races into the game with little to no build up.

We see more boldness in terms of changes to the game world and leadership. We're still stuck with the exact same leader figures in the major city states since the days of ARR and the writers seem terrified to kill off any character who isn't an antagonist or minor character. WoW may go overboard with death from time to time, though at least it shakes things up.

The stakes are higher, generally. The losses are felt. The land is scarred. We haven't see any of that since the transition from 1.0 to 2.0 and that was done because 1.0 was considered to be such a disaster that it needed to be rebuilt from the ground up.

There's also a broader range of characters in WoW's story. FFXIV just has a bunch of jumped up self proclaimed heroes who echo each other's views and seek to kill or strong arm anybody who dares to think or act differently to themselves into doing what they want.

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Originally Posted by Gameovers

It is really better when it's not in the 60 buck product? What if you never go outside that product? So what the game provides is lacking and I can't call that better. :c Not when I can get that in another product and not have to step outside of said product. But yeah I do agree... it's all a money greed game there.

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I think Blizzard is all about money these days. They care nothing for their players. It is all a money game now. But as for this game I really feel the developers want their game to succeed and for the players to be happy while playing it. But on the topic of Asmongold...I honestly think he shouldn't play this game. His form of toxicness along with some of his toxic players just need to stay over their in WoW. I have looked at numerous videos of his and he is toxic as hell. I know he has a HUGE follower base. But seeing him and what most of his followers say in chat is just ridiculous sometimes. I honestly don't welcome him here in FFXIV...Sorry Guys.

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Originally Posted by Frienze

Exactly.

You can solo quest if you chose to, no one stops you from doing that. But FFXIV is an MMO and solo questing shouldn't be something you -have- to do. I should be able to party up with my friends and go nuts. It's the whole reason I play MMOs, to play with people. (Not judging anyone for enjoying to play alone though, just it isn't for me - and I think it's prob not for most MMO players because most people do play for the social aspect)

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I think a lot of people’s arguments towards this is like, “WELL ITS A FINAL FANTASY FIRST AND AN MMO AFTER!” Which....no. When you call your game an mmo. That means that the mmo aspect of it should take priority. It’s the main pull of the genre, to play with others. The fact 14 forces solo question is pretty sad tbh and a major gripe i have with it. It’s why i can’t really take the story too seriously and i can’t get too involved with it.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I think a lot of people’s arguments towards this is like, “WELL ITS A FINAL FANTASY FIRST AND AN MMO AFTER!” Which....no. When you call your game an mmo. That means that the mmo aspect of it should take priority. It’s the main pull of the genre, to play with others. The fact 14 forces solo question is pretty sad tbh and a major gripe i have with it. It’s why i can’t really take the story too seriously and i can’t get too involved with it.

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100% agree.

Though, I do love the story I admit.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

We see more boldness in terms of changes to the game world and leadership. We're still stuck with the exact same leader figures in the major city states since the days of ARR and the writers seem terrified to kill off any character who isn't an antagonist or minor character. WoW may go overboard with death from time to time, though at least it shakes things up.

The stakes are higher, generally. The losses are felt. The land is scarred. We haven't see any of that since the transition from 1.0 to 2.0 and that was done because 1.0 was considered to be such a disaster that it needed to be rebuilt from the ground up.

There's also a broader range of characters in WoW's story. FFXIV just has a bunch of jumped up self proclaimed heroes who echo each other's views and seek to kill or strong arm anybody who dares to think or act differently to themselves into doing what they want.

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I agree with this so much. From what little i know of WoW and it’s community, they seem much thicker skinned than the 14 community. They can’t even kill off characters anymore in 14 because people make such a big deal out of it when they do. It really takes the feeling of loss and consequences out of the story which is something that should always be a prominent thing in such a “high stakes” story. The WoW community doesn’t seem to get as upset over character deaths as much as over here and it’s a quality i really wish would transfer over to this community because like you said yeah, we’ve had the same cast every single expansion. It’s gotten so monotonous and we’re going into the final expansion of the story arc since the beginning of the game with the same people and same prominent figures. It’s just stale imo.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I agree with this so much. From what little i know of WoW and it’s community, they seem much thicker skinned than the 14 community. They can’t even kill off characters anymore in 14 because people make such a big deal out of it when they do. It really takes the feeling of loss and consequences out of the story which is something that should always be a prominent thing in such a “high stakes” story. The WoW community doesn’t seem to get as upset over character deaths as much as over here and it’s a quality i really wish would transfer over to this community because like you said yeah, we’ve had the same cast every single expansion. It’s gotten so monotonous and we’re going into the final expansion of the story arc since the beginning of the game with the same people and same prominent figures. It’s just stale imo.

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Yeah, there's a lot of predictable melodrama. When even minor characters are encased in a thick layer of plot armour it's difficult for me to care about what happens - because we already know that in 99% of cases nobody is actually going to be threatened. It's a real shame, since ARR had a lot of moments where the stakes were high and consequences were felt such as the assault upon the Waking Sands. Ever since, there's been barely anything similar to that and all the consequences were conveniently cast onto sympathetic antagonists instead.

The story isn't without redeeming qualities, though it hasn't quite managed to surpass the likes of Final Fantasy Tactics, Final Fantasy VII or Final Fantasy XII in my eyes.

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Originally Posted by Frienze

Exactly.

You can solo quest if you chose to, no one stops you from doing that. But FFXIV is an MMO and solo questing shouldn't be something you -have- to do. I should be able to party up with my friends and go nuts. It's the whole reason I play MMOs, to play with people. (Not judging anyone for enjoying to play alone though, just it isn't for me - and I think it's prob not for most MMO players because most people do play for the social aspect)

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I notice you say MMO's but not MMORPGs. Fornite is a massive multi player online you might prefer over MMORPG's that have stories.