How do we feel about tank damage right now?

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

To answer your first question: Apparently, you are saying that.

Have you actually looked at AOE potencies?

Healers and tanks are very close what DPS can do. Some of the potencies are even exactly the same; the difference being that DPS jobs may get some oGCDs or special procs that can put them a little above what tanks and healers can do.

In fact, tanks do out DPS a good chunk of DPS jobs in dungeons. In the 90th percentile, tanks do very well, even beating out some DPS jobs.

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Unless I am reading this chart wrong, it looks like tanks only out damage each other, SCH, and AST. GNB and WHM seem to be fighting for the top spot between Tanks and Healers. Maybe you or someone could provide me the correct instructions on how to interpret the chart.

https://i.imgur.com/O0qH5dw.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

To answer your first question: Apparently, you are saying that.

Have you actually looked at AOE potencies?

Healers and tanks are very close what DPS can do. Some of the potencies are even exactly the same; the difference being that DPS jobs may get some oGCDs or special procs that can put them a little above what tanks and healers can do.

If you want to talk dungeons in particular - In the 90th percentile, tanks are doing very well right now.

https://i.imgur.com/m0neYP1.png

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Noooobody cares about dungeons. Nobody cares about AoE. We have been talking about raiding, why are you trying to change the conversation?

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Originally Posted by BarretOblivion

Noooobody cares about dungeons. Nobody cares about AoE. We have been talking about raiding, why are you trying to change the conversation?

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I care. How else would I get those good glam items?

Mind clarifying what dungeon needs the same level of gameplay as a raid situation to warrant a massive tank change just in regards of aoe damage (as an example)? Just curious.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

To answer your first question: Apparently, you are saying that.

Have you actually looked at AOE potencies?

Healers and tanks are very close what DPS can do. Some of the potencies are even exactly the same; the difference being that DPS jobs may get some oGCDs or special procs that can put them a little above what tanks and healers can do.

If you want to talk dungeons in particular - In the 90th percentile, tanks are doing very well right now.

https://i.imgur.com/m0neYP1.png

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I was speaking mainly about WAR, because it is the job who got hit the most by the changes.
Now compare WAR DPS from stormblood and SHB, it is +/- 10 percent points lower now which makes it 15% dps nerf overall, he is second last in dps performance at the top level of play in dungeons, where in Stormblood he was next to DPS numbers above healers and other tanks.
And furthermore if we talk about the average speed, warrior dropped from 96 percentile to 80 percentile which makes it 18% speed nerf to his overall performance in dungeons, this number is HUGE.

Scaling is what they changed and they made it so war is now the weakest tank job even weaker than healers and i could feel through my own skin because i played warrior back then and right now and the difference in performance its just too big.

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Originally Posted by BarretOblivion

Noooobody cares about dungeons. Nobody cares about AoE. We have been talking about raiding, why are you trying to change the conversation?

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Because the nerf is visible in dungeons and it easier to tell that warrior got nerf hammered.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

If you want to talk dungeons in particular - In the 90th percentile, tanks are doing very well right now.

https://i.imgur.com/m0neYP1.png

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While this would obviously not work in a raid setting since why play DPS if tanks did equal damage. I still want to take a moment and bask at how evenly split virtually every job is on that chart. It's just so nice and comfy compared to looking at the laughable "balance" the DPS roles have in a single target environment.

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Originally Posted by Xtrasweettea

Unless I am reading this chart wrong, it looks like tanks only out damage each other, SCH, and AST. GNB and WHM seem to be fighting for the top spot between Tanks and Healers. Maybe you or someone could provide me the correct instructions on how to interpret the chart.

https://i.imgur.com/O0qH5dw.png

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Thanks for posting this. I'm much more into groups and dungeons than I am raiding.

For dungeons the tank DPS nerfs (relative to where they've often been over the years) matter even more than raiding. Especially using party finder - a huge number of DPS players never bother upgrading their gear past lvl 70 and either don't realise or don't care how much they are gimping the group and being carried.

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Originally Posted by Mitsubashi

Thanks for posting this. I'm much more into groups and dungeons than I am raiding.

For dungeons the tank DPS nerfs (relative to where they've often been over the years) matter even more than raiding. Especially using party finder - a huge number of DPS players never bother upgrading their gear past lvl 70 and either don't realise or don't care how much they are gimping the group and being carried.

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Tome gear will take you to 80 without issue.

It's that bad huh? Ironic that they gave wars an aoe combo while nerfing their dls. Overpower to mythril tempest spamming also is clunky as heck. Id rather go back to spamming just overpower. Or not having an aoe combo for that matter if they could retune dps to compensate.

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Originally Posted by NyneSwordz

It's that bad huh? Ironic that they gave wars an aoe combo while nerfing their dls. Overpower to mythril tempest spamming also is clunky as heck. Id rather go back to spamming just overpower. Or not having an aoe combo for that matter if they could retune dps to compensate.

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But, but, we need more buttons to press!! (Yes, even if they ultimately do nothing but devalue, and thereby make less frequently viable, choices that would have offered more fine and fluid control over our rotations, because who's got time to think for more than a half-second?)