@Devs: Please allow us to travel at will between servers.

I suggest that you have made your point by now after addressing every poster here. I also suggest, as you suggested, lets now leave it up to SE. You really don't need to have a comeback for everything posted here, do you?

http://theconfusedhomemaker.com/wp-c...n-internet.png

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

I suggest that you have made your point by now after addressing every poster here. I also suggest, as you suggested, lets now leave it up to SE. You really don't need to have a comeback for everything posted here, do you?

http://theconfusedhomemaker.com/wp-c...n-internet.png

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It's a tad early for bed.

But yeah, it's my own thread, if you don't mind I'll respond to whomever I please? :D

I don't really need a secretary to regulate my online interactions and writing schedule, but if you really are hell bent on taking the role, tell your people to contact my people.

That the Industry will go their is just yur assumption. TSW isn't going really well so it's not the best example...

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Originally Posted by Abriael

It's a tad early for bed.

But yeah, it's my own thread, if you don't mind I'll respond to whomever I please? :D

I don't really need a secretary to regulate my online interactions and writing schedule, but if you really are hell bent on taking the role, tell your people to contact my people.

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For sure, I'm not telling you what to do or trying to regulate your online interactions. I was just making a "suggestion", not "demanding" it, you do know there is a very big difference right?

Not trying to offend, just to get you to loosen up a little. Apparently it was the wrong thing to do and I apologize.

The issue with your cross server instant transfer aka 1 server to rule them all idea is the complexity and sheer size. Cross server communication is very different then moving an entire characters data at will. Is it possible? I think so. Will it provide the best fastest smoothest gameplay? absolutely NOT.

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

For sure, I'm not telling you what to do or trying to regulate your online interactions. I was just making a "suggestion", not "demanding" it, you do know there is a very big difference right?

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Only, to whom I respond has no real bearing on the topic at hand.

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Originally Posted by Splice

Will it provide the best fastest smoothest gameplay? absolutely NOT.

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Might want to try and check how fast and smooth gameplay is in The Secret Worold before writing "not" in all caps.

The servers of most MMORPGs (including FFXIV) already move an entire character's data at will. That's how external applications and websites access that data via API.

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

That the Industry will go their is just yur assumption. TSW isn't going really well so it's not the best example...

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No, that the industry will go there is a fact that you can see by looking at most AAA MMORPGs released lately and that will be released in the foreseeable future. The large majority of them features mechanics designed to skip or mitigate server segregation, as it's convenient for all parties involved (both players and developers).

By the way, to those worried that this kind of system is "too much work" (for some reason), Square Enix has an entire team of network engineers working on ARR. When the game will be launched that team won't be just laid off and won't go on extended leave. They won't also spend all of their time (or even the majority) babysitting the servers in day to day maintenance.

Like in every MMORPG they'll continue working on the server technology to improve it and add new features, that will be added in server-side patching from release on. Server technology is never a monolith set in stone after a game's launch, and they have a whole team to ensure that evolution and improvement is ensured.

Ya its implemented in some games that don't run really well. Just cause some F2P or B2P games offer something it's not obligatory for the future. And like I allready mentioned in a few other threads, the Friendlist System that lets you switch for some activity which Blizzard uses would be the best way. But transfering all the time and where you wan't will just cause Problems.

Do you really think all those engineers working on ARR now will stay for maintenance. There is just no need to change the Server technology again (they just did that) and for maintnance you need way less and the rest will go on work on other projekts.

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

Ya its implemented in some games that don't run really well. Just cause some F2P or B2P games offer something it's not obligatory for the future. And like I allready mentioned in a few other threads, the Friendlist System that lets you switch for some activity which Blizzard uses would be the best way. But transfering all the time and where you wan't will just cause Problems.

Do you really think all those engineers working on ARR now will stay for maintenance. There is just no need to change the Server technology again (they just did that) and for maintnance you need way less and the rest will go on work on other projekts.

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care to elaborate?

http://elderscrollsonline.info/mega-server

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Originally Posted by Sartori

http://elderscrollsonline.info/mega-server

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That sounds pretty good, but unfortunately it's Bethesda, so it will be glitchy as all hell.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

By the way, to those worried that this kind of system is "too much work" (for some reason), Square Enix has an entire team of network engineers working on ARR. When the game will be launched that team won't be just laid off and won't go on extended leave. They won't also spend all of their time (or even the majority) babysitting the servers in day to day maintenance.

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You got to stop defending your points with something you know nothing about. The way you make it sound that everything begins and ends with ARR. Square-enix is a large company that develop many games. SE wouldn't hire network engineers and administrators just for a single game and lay them off when it's complete. You hire network engineers to design, configure and manage a network for a given data center. SE would reuse/upgrade existing network infrastructure and to it for ARR servers since it's already in place for the Japanese servers. These people are constantly working on tasks for different projects.

You overestimate the amount of work a network engineer would have to configure to allow for server to server communication. Most likely it's just opening network flows.

In my VMWare cluster at work, I can move the processing responsibilities of an entire server from one physical box to another in a matter of seconds.

In a data center, data storage is a separate physical entity from the servers. Moving our characters from one server to another is as simple as clicking a button that tells the servers what character data it is now responsible for.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

It's a tad early for bed.

But yeah, it's my own thread, if you don't mind I'll respond to whomever I please? :D

I don't really need a secretary to regulate my online interactions and writing schedule, but if you really are hell bent on taking the role, tell your people to contact my people.

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The point he's trying to make is: You're wasting your time replying to people. You're not going to change anybody's minds, just as nobody could change yours. If you really have nothing better to do than try to prove people they're wrong on the internet, I recommend finding a new hobby.

I totally like the idea from OP.
But i dont see this as a priority. First they need to get a good game and just stick to the well known server system. Server wide Content Finder is one step into the right direction. Maybe they can create those serverless game when releasing the 2nd or 3rd Addon, would be great. But only if the serverstress is acceptable. It's no win to force such system and ruin other game aspects.

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

Ya its implemented in some games that don't run really well.

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Only, they run plenty well.

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Do you really think all those engineers working on ARR now will stay for maintenance. There is just no need to change the Server technology again (they just did that) and for maintnance you need way less and the rest will go on work on other projekts.

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Originally Posted by Pseudopsia

You got to stop defending your points with something you know nothing about. The way you make it sound that everything begins and ends with ARR. Square-enix is a large company that develop many games. SE wouldn't hire network engineers and administrators just for a single game and lay them off when it's complete. You hire network engineers to design, configure and manage a network for a given data center. SE would reuse/upgrade existing network infrastructure and to it for ARR servers since it's already in place for the Japanese servers. These people are constantly working on tasks for different projects.

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That's not how it works in MMORPGs. In any AAA MMORPG most of the network engineering team doesn't go to work on other Projects after release. They stay to continuously update the network technology, to add new server features and and optimize and streamline the existing ones.

Some of those changes won't even be visible by the players, because they're completely server side and don't translate to game features, but they're constantly worked on. Sorry Pseudopsia, but this doesn't originate from me, as you already know, so maybe you should stop making parallels with the procedures involved in operating servers that have nothing to do with MMORPGs or the videogame market, and operate in whole different markets that don't involve the need to stay abreast of trends, competition and an increasingly demanding and selective userbase.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

The point he's trying to make is: You're wasting your time replying to people.

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I know worse timewasters, besides there are a few people here that do try to enable a discussion instead of just crying tears of blood because this would take some work to implement, and god forbid the development team does some additional work (that they very possibly already put in account). Evolution is obviously a bad thing!

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Originally Posted by Abriael

That's not how it works in MMORPGs. In any AAA MMORPG most of the network engineering team doesn't go to work on other Projects after release. They stay to continuously update the network technology, to add new server features and and optimize and streamline the existing ones.

Some of those changes won't even be visible by the players, because they're completely server side and don't translate to game features, but they're constantly worked on. Sorry Pseudopsia, but this doesn't originate from me, as you already know, so maybe you should stop making parallels with the procedures involved in operating servers that have nothing to do with MMORPGs or the videogame market, and operate in whole different markets that don't involve the need to stay abreast of trends, competition and an increasingly demanding and selective userbase.

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You either not relaying the information well or bull shitting.

This this interview describes what the role of a network engineer is:

Source: EverQuest II News - Interview with Roger Sewell
What are your responsibilities?
As a Network Engineer, we are responsible for the security and maintenance of our entire network. That includes all of the desktop machines, game servers, web servers, development servers, switches, routers, and any other device on our network that needs connectivity. I can't get into the specifics of the network as that is all fairly secret...sorry!

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Originally Posted by Pseudopsia

You either not relaying the information well or bull shitting.

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Too bad that I was clearly and explicitly referring to the network engineers that designed the server technology. Those that physically maintain the servers and equipment are still generally referred to as "network engineer" (which is a rather generic title that encompasses both design and management of networks, as specific titles, if you didn't notice, vary from company to company), but they have an entirely different specialization and seniority.

If you think those that designed the server tech from scratch will suddenly turn themselves into simple server monkeys (IE: The people that babysit the servers and their software physicallym which your "interview" describes), I'm afraid you're quite a lot off mark.

I'm relaying the information plenty well, don't worry, you're just trying to counter it with google, which isn't a good idea.

The sole fact that you think one smallish interview to ONE network engineer in ONE company can exclusively define the this whole big area of professional expertise is kind of hilarious, to be completely honest.

You're obviously not talking about a network engineer. Sound like an architect.

"designed the server technology" what does this mean? It gets like 4 hits on google.

You would choose the server technology, not design it.

I found one interview because it's very hard to find a interview of a network engineer for MMO's. The developers are usually interviewed since they do the bulk of the work. Network engineers need to ensure the network is in place, maintained and flows are open.

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Originally Posted by Pseudopsia

You're obviously not talking about an network engineer. Sound like an architect.

"designed the server technology" what does this mean? It gets like 4 hits on google.

You would choose the server technology, not design it.

I found one interview because it's very hard to find a interview of a network engineer for MMO's. The developers are usually interviewed since they do the bulk of the work. Network engineers need to ensure the network is in place, maintained and flows are open.

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MMORPG network technology is made by hardware and software. You (mostly) choose the hardware, and you can also choose some limited elements of the software (unless you're working on a pre-existing structure borrowed from another game, but that's kind of rare and usually still requires some design to make it fit), but most of the software part and the integration with the gameplay elements has to be designed.

Professionals with the qualification of a network engineer can either have a maintenance or design role, depending on their specialization, seniority and experience. Those that design the network tech on the software aspect are fully part of the development team, and they're those that would have to design this kind of system. And yeah, in some companies they're called network architects, network designers, and a whole big variety of other titles and variations of those titles.

But hey, keep googling and nitpicking on terminology that varies from software house to software house if it floats your boat. That's what they call "grasping at straws", and you seem to be very intent on doing it (while going massively off topic in the process), like fruitlessly attacking my personal credibility could somehow disprove the validity of this system. A hint: It doesn't.

But we all know how it goes 'round here already. "Can't attack the idea, attack the person".

http://www.endingthegrind.com/wp-con...t_computer.jpg

He is talking about something he dreams at night, he try to be supersmart an make everyone think he knows everything about the technology of all those company out there at the end it's just bullshit cause he is bored because they don't let him play what he demands....

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

He is talking about something he dreams at night, he try to be supersmart an make everyone think he knows everything about the technology of all those company out there at the end it's just bullshit cause he is bored because they don't let him play what he demands....

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Someone doesn't have anything to say, so he'll just try the personal attack way. How novel :D

Innovation must *really* scare you.

Nope it doesn't but just cause somebody post on a forum he knows everything about the technologys of these different companies doesn't mean anybody believes him. As long you can't post any facts about what you try to tell us it's nothing worth.

It's the same like you allready did in the alpha invitation thread you post some theories without any facts tell us you have super secret informations but never post any facts. Sry but can't take you serious...

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

Nope it doesn't but just cause somebody post on a forum he knows everything about the technologys of these different companies doesn't mean anybody believes him. As long you can't post any facts about what you try to tell us it's nothing worth.

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You know what the funny part is? I don't *need* to post any facts about it at all, because it's not *you* that I need to persuade. Yoshida and his team know the facts well, and they're the ones that can to decide if my proposal is feasible, cost effective and in line with their plans.

All the rest is just idle conversation, and whether you like it or not, you believing what I say or not is completely inconsequential to the purpose of this thread, exactly like your continuous personal attacks.

No the funny part is you don't want to post facts cause you can't. You claim knowledge about Sever Technologies of multiple companies and can't proove it. You can continue to post "I know everything" but just cause of that nobody just gonna start building a new system...

No point discussing with you any more since you don't even know yourself what you talking about. All you can do is state theories as facts but not willing to proove them....

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

No the funny part is you don't want to post facts cause you can't. You claim knowledge about Sever Technologies of multiple companies and can't proove it. You can continue to post "I know everything" but just cause of that nobody just gonna start building a new system...

No point discussing with you any more since you don't even know yourself what you talking about. All you can do is state theories as facts but not willing to proove them....

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You continuing to chant "you don't know!" doesn't make it true. But do believe whatever you like. As I said, it's completely inconsequential.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

You assume that they'd need to "rebuild" their server structures to implement this, which is a rather tall assumption. For all we know (considering that they did mention "worldless server technology" in their own documentation), their server tech may very well be built purposely to accomodate something like this in the future.

You're also assuming that someone asked them to do it immediately, which no one did.



This is another assumption. Any number of games have undergone extensive server tech changes without extended downtime.

Again, I suggest to leave feasibility/cost/time assessments to Square Enix, since they're the only ones with the info necessary to make those assessments.



It's not just TSW's server style. It's where the industry is going, and FFXIV: ARR aims to be be near the top of that industry.

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I never assumed anyone wanted this now I simply said they just built the servers for ARR how they wanted them. To prepare or consider doing so again because a few people suggest it would be silly.

I like how you call all opposing posts tall assumptions when most of your arguments are based off of assumptions. I guess It's ok for you to assume but everyone else who does so is wrong.

Just because other games can do xyz does not mean it is easy or possible without extreme amounts of work for another game. You have to take into consideration the other gears in the machine before you jam one in that doesn't fit.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

You continuing to chant "you don't know!" doesn't make it true. But do believe whatever you like. As I said, it's completely inconsequential.

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You make alot assumptions, call them facts but refuse to post a source for them. You are completely unreliable!

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Originally Posted by Keith_Dragoon

never assumed anyone wanted this now I simply said they just built the servers for ARR how they wanted them. To prepare or consider doing so again because a few people suggest it would be silly.

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And that's an assumption, as you assume they'd have to do anything "again".

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I like how you call all opposing posts tall assumptions when most of your arguments are based off of assumptions. I guess It's ok for you to assume but everyone else who does so is wrong.

Just because other games can do xyz does not mean it is easy or possible without extreme amounts of work for another game. You have to take into consideration the other gears in the machine before you jam one in that doesn't fit.

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Nope. I don't assume that it does or doesn't fit. It's simply not for me or you to say it does, like it's not for you or for anyone else here. I know it's doable. I know other developers have done and are doing it (in front of everyone's eyes, in most cases) with no problem.

Besides that, it's for Square Enix to assess the feasibility, cost effectiveness and fitting to their plans of this system.

But I find it funny as hell as much people here make assumptions against it despite there being absolutely no element proving or supporting those assumptions.

okay just in case i miss it over the holydays.

what are you doing if you get a Dev response
(which i doubt since the likes of post #2 are outnumbering #1)
like "sorry it's not possible with our current server structure, but thanks for your feedback!"

- Hey Dev, you lie?

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Originally Posted by Keith_Dragoon

I never assumed anyone wanted this now I simply said they just built the servers for ARR how they wanted them. To prepare or consider doing so again because a few people suggest it would be silly.

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You do assume they'd have to do anything "again".

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I like how you call all opposing posts tall assumptions when most of your arguments are based off of assumptions. I guess It's ok for you to assume but everyone else who does so is wrong.

Just because other games can do xyz does not mean it is easy or possible without extreme amounts of work for another game. You have to take into consideration the other gears in the machine before you jam one in that doesn't fit.

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Actually absolutely none of my arguments is based on assumptions.

I know that this system and similar systems works well and without visible drawbacks in other games, and that other developers are working on the same or similar features as we speak.

Other than that, I do not know if the system is feasible, cost effective or fits the plans of Square Enix for this MMORPG. And I do not assume it is. In fact I said several times that it's for them to assess. I made a suggestion that is for them to evaluate.

The only ones making assumptions here are the ones assuming it would be terribly difficult, not cost effective, or not fitting Square Enix's plans, despite not knowing anything about Square Enix's current server tech and it's room for evolution, their resources, personnel and plans.

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

You make alot assumptions, call them facts but refuse to post a source for them. You are completely unreliable!

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I call them facts because they *are* facts. The games I named are available for everyone to play, and the ones that aren't yet released are already official news.

If you don't want to try out those games and see with your own eyes because you're afraid to widen your horizons, it's your problem, not mine, isn't it?

You calling someone unreliable doesn't make it true. You continue to demand "sources" from me (when those "sources" are in front of everyone's eyes), but I don't see you posting any to disprove what I say. Wonder why?

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Originally Posted by Phe

what are you doing if you get a Dev response

like "sorry it's not possible with our current server structure, but thanks for your feedback!"

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I believe I said several times it's for them to decide. While I do believe that in a year or two the market itself (that is moving towards making server divisions obsolete, at long last) would make them change their mind if they want to stay abreast of the competition with big hitters like ESO incoming, it's their prerogative to assess and decide it.

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which i doubt since the likes of post #2 are outnumbering #1)

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You mean 28 people in a half-dead forum are going to stop them from considering a system that a sizable part of the industry adopted or is adopting? Sure mate. Believe it. :D

Mind you, considering that in their own official PDFs you can see written in big red and bolded letters:
"A Server System Built to Support a Worldless Model"

I would say that the odds are more in this system's favor than against. But again, the final word is theirs, whether they respond to this thread or not.

I think the *fact* that after all this time the Dev's have not commented on this, speaks volumes.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lgpvndJg2e1qzpgux.jpg

Yea, I was right. Your assumptions are facts and everyone else's are all just assumptions. I assume they have to do "anything" and you assume they don't how is that much much different?

You know therefore you do not assume yet all your arguments are based off a handful of games who 90% of them were built from the ground up with that server style in mind and the other 10% may or may not have implemented this in some way or form but it's nowhere as good as those who built it from the get go.

I like this man, he's the only right person on the Internets! Come on guys lets go be wrong in another thread and let him campaign against the wind. :D

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

I think the *fact* that after all this time the Dev's have not commented on this, speaks volumes.

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The devs don't comment on a ton of things, many of which are implemented anyway. The devs comment only on what they're ready to announce, or has already been announced or confirmed.

PS: Motivated pictures don't add any solidity to your argument, and "i'm just saying" is a cop out.

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Originally Posted by Keith_Dragoon

Yea, I was right. Your assumptions are facts and everyone else's are all just assumptions. I assume they have to do "anything" and you assume they don't how is that much much different?

You know therefore you do not assume yet all your arguments are based off a handful of games who 90% of them were built from the ground up with that server style in mind and the other 10% may or may not have implemented this in some way or form

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I'm quite sure that since those games exist (since, you know, you can play em), so I'm quite entitled tho "assume" that they do, in fact, exist, making the process possible in theory.

I assume nothing, as everything else is for the development team to assess and decide. But it's funny how you try to warp my argument because you can't counter it in its original form.

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but it's nowhere as good as those who built it from the get go.

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And where did this come from?

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and you assume they don't

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Nope. I don't. I don't know, so I don't assume one way or another. Maybe they do, maybe they don't. It's for them to assess. Not for me, nor for you.

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If you don't want to try out those games and see with your own eyes because you're afraid to widen your horizons, it's your problem, not mine, isn't it?

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actually, no. When you make a claim, the burden of proof is on you. It's not up to everyone else to play the games you mentioned and read the news you vaguely mentioned to verify what you said is true. YOU have to prove to everyone else that what you are saying is a "fact', not the other way around. Your credibility is zero if you don't back up your statements with cited sources.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

actually, no. When you make a claim, the burden of proof is on you. It's not up to everyone else to play the games you mentioned and read the news you vaguely mentioned to verify what you said is true. YOU have to prove to everyone else that what you are saying is a "fact', not the other way around. Your credibility is zero if you don't back up your statements with cited sources.

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LOL. This is the most laughable claim I ever read. "the burden of proof is on you" is a massive cop out used by those lacking arguments to try and avoid acknowledging publicly available facts.

Obviously, I can't buy games for everyone in order for them to experience them. If they want to remain in their little world, that's their choice. Them believing me or not is inconsequential anyway, as the choice to implement or not this system is not theirs. By now it's obvious that they (and you) are just grasping at straw to avoid acknowledging that the MMORPG market is evolving.

Well, welcome to 2012 (almost 2013). The MMORPG world is moving ahead, and despite that the world didn't end. Careful not to be left behind on your obsolete servers.

You telling someone "your credibility is zero" doesn't make it true. We aren't in a courtroom, and "burden of proof" doesn't exist.

Mind you, even if we were in a courtroom, citing existing situations is quite enough to provide proof, as the court will verify them on its own. Go right ahead and do that. Don't want to? Then don't complain.

You can stay locked in your bunker as much as you want if you don't want to believe that the world didn't end. I don't need to prove it to you when you can just walk out and see.

Abby lives in his own strange world where everything is a fact he supposes, discussing with him is pointless he will never understand that there is a difference between facts and his suggestions. He is allready unreliable for most ppl anyway.

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Originally Posted by moriandrio

Abby lives in his own strange world where everything is a fact he supposes, discussing with him is pointless he will never understand that there is a difference between facts and his suggestions. He is allready unreliable for most ppl anyway.

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Oh, and you can talk for "Most people" now?

Of course there is a difference between facts and my suggestions, suggestions are by definition not facts, as they didn't happen yet.

Suggestions can be based on facts, and mine are based on the fact that other games implemented this or similar systems and more are working on it, and on the fact that Square Enix promised servers "built to support a wordless model".

What facts is what you say based on again?

Do keep living in the bunker, buddy. You're the one missing out. :rolleyes:

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LOL. This is the most laughable claim I ever read. "the burden of proof is on you" is a massive cop out used by those lacking arguments to try and avoid acknowledging publicly available facts.

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You calling it a cop out and not furnishing information you should be furnishing to back up your point is the real cop out. If your facts are "publicly available, then LINK US TO THEM FOR GOD SAKE! how hard is that? The fact that you are refusing to do so is a sign to others that your facts aren't really facts. If you want to call it a cop out, go right ahead. But it's what anyone who reads what you're saying will think.

You don't have to buy people games to prove things to them. You can proide URL links to reliable soruces on the internet. How hard could it be? If it really is a fact, you must have gotten the information SOMEWHERE.

You initiated this discussion, it is your responsibility to convince others of your position and otherwise accept their disagreement with it. You will not succeed in doing so if you do not back up your statements. Whether you are factually right or not, you can not make anyone agree with or believe you if you don't prove your points. I'm not telling you this to be mean or angry or spiteful, its just the way things are. Prove what your telling people, or be ignored. It's your choice. I'm certainly not going to bend over backwards to prove *your* position when I don't believe it's actual fact. YOU have to show us that it's fact. Not me, not anyone else here. As someone once said, "Put up, or shut up." This discussion will fizzle out and die with nobody's opinions changed or perspectives altered if you do not make the effort to do so. I'd LOVE to be convinced of your opinions- I really would. But YOU have to prove them to be accurate and reasonable. Not me.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

You calling it a cop out and not furnishing information you should be furnishing to back up your point is the real cop out.

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And who, pray tell, decides what I "should be furnishing" in order for my point to be valid? I'm not exactly sure who you think made you referee of this discussion, but let me give you a hint. You aren't.

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You don't have to buy people games to prove things to them. You can proide URL links to reliable soruces on the internet. How hard could it be? If it really is a fact, you must have gotten the information SOMEWHERE.

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Of course I did. I played those games, since I'm not spending my time locked in my little Final Fantasy bunker. The same information can be found in the game's official sites, and it's not really my responsibility to dig it up for the lazy.

here are a couple example: It took a second to find them, and everyone can.
http://www.thesecretworld.com/news/b...e_secret_world
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=KxJTsq2XeKY

This means that those that aren't lazy or just unwilling to look at the information, will have them.

And anyone actually interested in the future of the game or of the MMORPG market, would be very interested in making that research, especially since Square Enix officially announced that they're working on servers able to "support a worldless model".

What does it mean? What can it mean? How far can it go?

If you aren't asking yourself those questions by now, you're plugging your own ears and screaming "lalalalalal!"

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You initiated this discussion, it is your responsibility to convince others of your position and otherwise accept their disagreement with it. You will not succeed in doing so if you do not back up your statements. Whether you are factually right or not, you can not make anyone agree with or believe you if you don't prove your points. I'm not telling you this to be mean or angry or spiteful, its just the way things are. Prove what your telling people, or be ignored. It's your choice. I'm certainly not going to bend over backwards to prove *your* position when I don't believe it's actual fact. YOU have to show us that it's fact. Not me, not anyone else here. As someone once said, "Put up, or shut up." This discussion will fizzle out and die with nobody's opinions changed or perspectives altered if you do not make the effort to do so. I'd LOVE to be convinced of your opinions- I really would. But YOU have to prove them to be accurate and reasonable. Not me.

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As a matter of fact, whether you or anyone else on this thread is convinced is absolutely inconsequential. Given the humongous amount of grasping at straws and personal attacks, it's obvious that some people prefer to remain locked into their obsolete world and disbelieve whatever is said.

Convincing any of those, you included, is not my responsibility. The thread isn't aimed at you (as the @Devs clearly states in the topic). It's a suggestion to Square Enix, and they know the "facts" better than me, you or anyone else here.

I provided plenty facts here, but I don't have any responsibility to find for you further information that you can read just by going to a game's official site and reading its description, or by reading its reviews. I don't really endorse lazyness.

I do find it massively funny though, that you claim I should provide further evidence of what I say, but you don't claim the same about those that continue to assume that it's impossible, not cost effective, not in line with SE's plans and all that. Looks like someone's idea of "burden of proof" is a tad one-sided and biased.

Oh, and by the way "put up, or shut up" my rear, buddy. You're no one to tell anyone to shut up. Come to terms with the idea, please. :D