More viera hair (And the ability to use modern Aesthetics hair)

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Originally Posted by Avidria

Was nice to have them acknowledge that this isn't a good situation in the art stream, with a clear statement that development cost is a challenge with this. Even if that wasn't really anything new. Here's hoping we'll get more than that soon.

You can be happy the races exist and still disagree with and criticize SE's decisions. The "you should be grateful to have anything" argument as I've seen it usually comes off as more of a "stop complaining" argument than anything else. Who says all of the people complaining aren't grateful for having the races at all? I've said more than once they're my favorite race in the game, but SE clearly bit off far more than they could chew in adding them, and evidently making them so limited was far more a resource management decision than an artistic choice. The resources here apparently being memory and development time/money. Which is extremely unfortunate and something I'll continue to be disappointed by, no matter how good the bunny girls look.

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Nah

It was an artistic choice to do something new and different and unique that would require sacrificing things. It's not a case of biting off "more than you can chew", they went in knowing that they would have to sacrifice things to make these happen this way. They could have made a bunny and cat men race that had all the bells and whistles ... they just wouldn't look like what we got at all. Hrothgar wouldn't have beast shaped heads, they wouldn't have the ability to change their fur color or have fur patterns. Bunny race wouldn't be "Viera" the way we know them to be, they would look like longer eared cat girls without ear style options (so that their ears could be built into their hair styles) cause that's what would work in the game's system.

They decided to say fuck it, lets make something unique. They were successful in that (with Hrothgar at least. I personally don't think bunny ears is worth the trade offs). They made it clear that they made the decision to cut helms and hats from early on.
With what the devs do with this game it's easy to forget that its built on a dumpster fire of a game code ... I don't see them ever having the time or money to treat heads like these the way every other race's heads are treated given the way the game works. Next MMO, sure! Not in this one though and they knew this going in.

Biting off more than you can chew would be going "Yay, we completed these races! Oh shit, how we gonna put head gear and hair on them?"

That's what people are saying, if you LIKE what you got then know and accept that there was no chance of you getting what you got with any less limits.

As for the stop complaining stuff I think it's more along the lines of "whats the point?". What's done is done, the ball has been thrown, the bullet has left the chamber ... no amount oh whining is gonna change a design decision made that far back that lead to core features for these races. Understand what happened and hope you get what lil they said they would deliver on.

Perhaps they just need to take both races out and be done with it.

I dont know how these developers maintain their sanity.

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Originally Posted by Avidria

Was nice to have them acknowledge that this isn't a good situation in the art stream, with a clear statement that development cost is a challenge with this. Even if that wasn't really anything new. Here's hoping we'll get more than that soon.

You can be happy the races exist and still disagree with and criticize SE's decisions. The "you should be grateful to have anything" argument as I've seen it usually comes off as more of a "stop complaining" argument than anything else. Who says all of the people complaining aren't grateful for having the races at all? I've said more than once they're my favorite race in the game, but SE clearly bit off far more than they could chew in adding them, and evidently making them so limited was far more a resource management decision than an artistic choice. The resources here apparently being memory and development time/money. Which is extremely unfortunate and something I'll continue to be disappointed by, no matter how good the bunny girls look.

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some people just like the taste of boot in their mouth

There are a ton of threads on here complaining/criticizing/whining (whatever term fits your agenda) about issues that have already come to pass. The great thing about the dev team is they tend to take into consideration these issues and work their best to find solutions when there are solutions available. They do look to the community to see what we are dissatisfied with-look at the 2B butt nerf debacle.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with or ungrateful about using the official forums to ask for these things, and to express disappointment with the current state of customization for these races in hopes the dev team listens.

While it may have been an artistic choice to make the new races the way they are as far as not being able to wear hats or use cross-race hairs, I doubt it was an artistic choice to give them extremely limited unique customizations from the get go. That’s more of a resource and time thing, and in this case comes across as being stretched too thin trying to pull everything together in time for the expansion. It’s not really a secret that the gaming industry has a serious crunch time issue. I don’t want the devs to kill themselves trying to make us some bunny hairs, but I think keeping the thread active is a good way to show them that the issue is important to some players and hopefully they can move some stuff around to pour a little extra love into viera, or the unfortunate perma-mane hroths.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

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Let me rephrase the problem I have with how these races were handled.

They set out to make something unique. Alright. I can respect that. I understand that they needed to make sacrifices to make it happen. I get it.

However. From what I've seen and heard. They were fighting with resources every step of the way. Sacrifices due to memory problems, sacrifices due to lack of developer time, sacrifices due to limitations on their race design and development capabilities. Their original artistic choice led to them full on chopping off a chunk of customization, with the result being one mostly unique race and one mostly not unique race, both of which are limited. They had to make all of those sacrifices, from what I can tell, because of both resource and capability constraints. Which is a shame.

Frankly, the only unique things about these races as they are, is Hrothgar phsyique and head shape, bunny ears evidently being harder to work around than cat ears, and the fact that they're so limited. They have nothing else to make up for their lack of options. They don't have much more in the way of unique options than anyone else (unless I've somehow totally missed something?). Several other races already have something "unique" about them even beyond their general body shape. Pointy ears, cat ears/tail, dragon scales, what have you. I have bunny ears and invisible hats.

In my opinion, Viera and Hrothgar didn't get enough uniqueness to make up for the sacrifices. I'd argue Viera very nearly got none at all, despite my personal preference for them.

As for the point of complaining... well frankly, part of it is just venting frustration. I'm frustrated that a race I absolutely love is far more limited than any other race in the game, and that they have, in my opinion, nothing that really makes up for it. That one of my favorite parts of the game, character customization and re-customization, is hindered so badly purely by a lack of options when I play Viera. The other part is to continually give feedback that this, as they've stated they agree, is not an ideal situation, and that there is still desire and demand for changes to bring the new races more in line with the others. Even to suggest alternatives to improve their customizability - though I suspect and fear the memory resource juggling they mentioned in the stream may restrict those options. I'm no game developer though, so maybe it wouldn't.

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Originally Posted by Avidria

In my opinion, Viera and Hrothgar didn't get enough uniqueness to make up for the sacrifices. I'd argue Viera very nearly got none at all, despite my personal preference for them.

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I'm gonna frame this and put it on my wall because this is really the crux of the matter to me.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

You can do that and still not be happy about everything you got. You can be thankful that something was given, understand why it couldn't be exactly what you wanted and also be disappointed with aspects of it lol.

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This, this right here. Thank you.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

I'm gonna frame this and put it on my wall because this is really the crux of the matter to me.

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They are gorgeous, but yeah the only thing truly "unique" about them is their adjustable ears - that SE sacrificed headgear for. Otherwise they are about as unique as any other race with minor racial specific features like the bunny nose, and actually a bit less, because they don't even have their own hempen set. Hrothgar however, while yes, are more unique in their overall model/heads that is at the cost of switching hairs. Requiring that fantasia.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

They are gorgeous, but yeah the only thing truly "unique" about them is their adjustable ears - that SE sacrificed headgear for. Otherwise they are about as unique as any other race with minor racial specific features like the bunny nose, and actually a bit less, because they don't even have their own hempen set. Hrothgar however, while yes, are more unique in their overall model/heads that is at the cost of switching hairs. Requiring that fantasia.

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If it was just headgear that would be 1 thing, because while disappointing I can absolutely see why that's a problem, but it's hair too. People keep saying Viera have same-face syndrome, and while it's true that face 1 is the most popular face it's mostly the hair that does it. The different ears and lengths barely even register to me as a unique identifier, "lop" bunny ears aside (but IMO those look terrible, sorry everyone that likes em but they could've been so much nicer looking than 2 half snapped twigs).

I do wonder if they had gone with 1 ear style and length if it would have been easier to do all or more of the hairstyles, and if Viera players would have prefered that. I know I would.

Hrothgar problems are just a big oof, even when they release more faces with hairs on them who's gonna realistically Fantasia everytime?

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Originally Posted by Yencat

If it was just headgear that would be 1 thing, because while disappointing I can absolutely see why that's a problem, but it's hair too. People keep saying Viera have same-face syndrome, and while it's true that face 1 is the most popular face it's mostly the hair that does it. The different ears and lengths barely even register to me as a unique identifier, "lop" bunny ears aside (but IMO those look terrible, sorry everyone that likes em but they could've been so much nicer looking than 2 half snapped twigs).

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Personally I chose the most popular face because two of them look like just typical models and the other has a perpetual smile. I think that one face is popular because the expression is neutral but still beautiful without looking like a fashion model.

The hair is the biggest issue though. With such a tiny choice in hair it's easy to run into a viera who looks similar. Almost half of the hairstyles are merely slight variations of another. There are 17 hairstyles...but if we are talking about how many actual unique hairstyles there are it's less than 10. That is freaking tiny.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

I do wonder if they had gone with 1 ear style and length if it would have been easier to do all or more of the hairstyles, and if Viera players would have prefered that. I know I would.

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I don't think so. The ears cover the same basic part of the head and most hairstyles don't have anything that would clip into them. Certainly the Asahi hair I used to use on my miqo would have no issues with viera ears. A lot of cross racial hair would be a pretty simple addition to the viera range.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Hrothgar problems are just a big oof, even when they release more faces with hairs on them who's gonna realistically Fantasia everytime?

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Sooner or later they will have to unlock the hair from faces. They're shooting themselves in the foot with making it more difficult to bring in more options for players with things as they are now. No one is going to be okay with needing to buy a fantasia to try out new hair. That essentially makes the new hair a mog station item.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

Personally I chose the most popular face because two of them look like just typical models and the other has a perpetual smile. I think that one face is popular because the expression is neutral but still beautiful without looking like a fashion model.

The hair is the biggest issue though. With such a tiny choice in hair it's easy to run into a viera who looks similar. Almost half of the hairstyles are merely slight variations of another. There are 17 hairstyles...but if we are talking about how many actual unique hairstyles there are it's less than 10. That is freaking tiny.

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Yeah I'm not calling anyone out on the face they use, it's all down to personal preference :D With only 4 faces there's bound to be a couple of favorites. I see Viera in all face, ear and colour combinations around hubs but with only 8 unique hairstyles it's almost impossible to stand out a bit.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

I don't think so. The ears cover the same basic part of the head and most hairstyles don't have anything that would clip into them. Certainly the Asahi hair I used to use on my miqo would have no issues with viera ears. A lot of cross racial hair would be a pretty simple addition to the viera range.

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True, some of the Miqo ears even clip into the fringe/braids/details but that's never stopped them :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Penthea

Sooner or later they will have to unlock the hair from faces. They're shooting themselves in the foot with making it more difficult to bring in more options for players with things as they are now. No one is going to be okay with needing to buy a fantasia to try out new hair. That essentially makes the new hair a mog station item.

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I'm not sure they can unlock them, but they're gonna have to do something eventually.

Would have been nice if they showed us some concept art or sketches of the hairstyles and other 'solutions' they're working on in the stream.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

If it was just headgear that would be 1 thing, because while disappointing I can absolutely see why that's a problem, but it's hair too. People keep saying Viera have same-face syndrome, and while it's true that face 1 is the most popular face it's mostly the hair that does it. The different ears and lengths barely even register to me as a unique identifier, "lop" bunny ears aside (but IMO those look terrible, sorry everyone that likes em but they could've been so much nicer looking than 2 half snapped twigs).

I do wonder if they had gone with 1 ear style and length if it would have been easier to do all or more of the hairstyles, and if Viera players would have prefered that. I know I would.

Hrothgar problems are just a big oof, even when they release more faces with hairs on them who's gonna realistically Fantasia everytime?

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The hair is definitely the biggest issue. That and no headgear of course. They have like the same variety as anyone else, but end up looking similar because of this. Other races have multiple hairstyles, and hats to differentiate their look from others - though somehow they also suffer from massive same face syndrome.

If they had gone one ear style and length? Yeah, probably. The ears enlarge and have really varied shapes. Like the bent ears or the ones that lay more back on the head. If there was only one ear style and length to work with obviously the devs would have an easier time if they ever decided to implement headgear and certain hairstyles. I would prefer we were able to have varied ears, unique modeled headgear, and all my purchased hairstyles, but we don't live in a perfect world.

I can live without head gear, it's the lack of hairstyles that really bothers me.

At the very least add more Viera specific hairstyles.

They are limited, but they look good, so no doubt the team can make some good looking hair for Viera.

Bump to support!

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Originally Posted by Rasikko

At the very least add more Viera specific hairstyles.

They are limited, but they look good, so no doubt the team can make some good looking hair for Viera.

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This would go a long way toward improving the situation really. I mean, 8 general styles with a variation or two each only gets you so far.

Heck, even adding more in a similar style but with bigger variations would be better than what we've got now. I'd love like, a shorter/neater version of the long ponytail we have. Without the little bang bits in the front. I could use that for a lot.

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Originally Posted by Avidria

This would go a long way toward improving the situation really. I mean, 8 general styles with a variation or two each only gets you so far.

Heck, even adding more in a similar style but with bigger variations would be better than what we've got now. I'd love like, a shorter/neater version of the long ponytail we have. Without the little bang bits in the front. I could use that for a lot.

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Yes! I LOVE that ponytail style. The front side bangs are like solid rock, and they clip like crazy with collared tops.

Seeing Viera run around in bright pink hair is incredibly obnoxious- but I get why people to it; so they don't look like the other Viera, even at the cost of looking like a clown.
I'd love Frans actual lush ponytail & Mjrn's cute Bob (even with the pretty diadem around the ears) Viera lack cute hairstyles
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...3/mjrnfran.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/564x/3d/80/c4/3...85a70350a3.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7415/viiii.jpg

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Originally Posted by HeyMcFly

Seeing Viera run around in bright pink hair is incredibly obnoxious- but I get why people to it; so they don't look like the other Viera, even at the cost of looking like a clown.

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Excuuuse me...?!
I for one chose rosy strands because I have a weakness for characters with that haircolor in general alias since I was a schoolgirl! I just say: #HarvestMoonPopuri

And I go with these odd-eyes- / tattoo- / facepaint-settings because I like to have a Viera who reflects my personality, since I physically don't appear like anything noteworthy in RL.

Also, if you tell me my Anemone looks like a clown, then you fail to remember how true circus-clows look like. x<

https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca88...14tnyORxlozhCQ

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Originally Posted by HeyMcFly

Seeing Viera run around in bright pink hair is incredibly obnoxious- but I get why people to it; so they don't look like the other Viera, even at the cost of looking like a clown.
I'd love Frans actual lush ponytail & Mjrn's cute Bob (even with the pretty diadem around the ears) Viera lack cute hairstyles
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...3/mjrnfran.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/564x/3d/80/c4/3...85a70350a3.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7415/viiii.jpg

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Says the Miqo'te with pink hair...

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Originally Posted by HeyMcFly

Seeing Viera run around in bright pink hair is incredibly obnoxious- but I get why people to it; so they don't look like the other Viera, even at the cost of looking like a clown.
I'd love Frans actual lush ponytail & Mjrn's cute Bob (even with the pretty diadem around the ears) Viera lack cute hairstyles
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...3/mjrnfran.jpg
https://i.pinimg.com/564x/3d/80/c4/3...85a70350a3.jpg
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7415/viiii.jpg

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I would die for Mjrn’s bob, and will ignore the rest of this post as certainly you cannot be serious.

I want that str8 bob from the Viera on the right ♥

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20100506192346

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Originally Posted by BunniEclair

I would die for Mjrn’s bob.

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It looks so nice! If we get it I hope we get the option to have it with and without the matching head gear.

Personally I too would like to see more hairstyles as a Viera main, but as long as they keep them "Viera-like" for the most part

Bumping the thread

I've been really struggling to find a look I'm happy with with so few options lately. I think I've tried three different colors in this style now and this is the closest I've got to something that works with all of my glamours. Reeealllly want some more short hairstyles or updos. Really hoping they'll sneak some into one of the upcoming patches soon...

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Originally Posted by Avidria

I've been really struggling to find a look I'm happy with with so few options lately. I think I've tried three different colors in this style now and this is the closest I've got to something that works with all of my glamours. Reeealllly want some more short hairstyles or updos. Really hoping they'll sneak some into one of the upcoming patches soon...

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Something like this would be great, but without the bangs
https://i.imgur.com/qCnvrKa.jpg

I also want Jote's and Mrjn's hairstyles. As well as a racial hat for viera similar to Mrjn.

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Originally Posted by Amnmaat

Something like this would be great, but without the bangs
https://i.imgur.com/qCnvrKa.jpg

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I need it :(

Here to also voice my support for more hair options. I love being a bun. But not having access to the hairstyles I unlocked when I was a Xaela during Stormblood, and the unlockable hairstyles added in Shadowbringers hurts.

Did SE even say anything about unlocking more hairstyles besides *look forward to it*?

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Originally Posted by Miracle_Diva

Did SE even say anything about unlocking more hairstyles besides *look forward to it*?

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No.
/10char

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Originally Posted by Arngrim_Greyashe

No.
/10char

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Awesome.
Gonna *look forward to it* then.

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Originally Posted by Miracle_Diva

Awesome.
Gonna *look forward to it* then.

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Well at least unlike Male Viera and Female Hrothgar YoshiP said more new and Unique Hairstyles Is Happening for the Hrothgar and Viera.
So...just gotta wait to find out WHEN

I am also a bun waiting for some hairstyles.
How much longer must I look forward to it, I’m getting eye strain.

I need Mrjn's hairstyle and I will be happy for eternity. Kind of took me by surprise that they didn't add it. We _sort of_ got Jote's hairstyle, I guess. But Mjrn's is short and would've been easy for them to implement I think. And would've made a nice addition to the one and only short hairstyle available.

At this point the next expansion is going to have six MSQ quests and be completely about new hair, hat compatibility, and the opposite gender. You know it to be true!

Make more Viera specific hair that aren't split into 4 variants of a base hair style.

Adding viera hairs and hrothgar hairs will take 2+ years- I think it's something on the far backburner that keeps getting turned off since there hasn't been much transparency recently regarding this issue. Last I had heard, they were having problems due to viera ears being the same slot as hats. That's why you don't rush something imo. Viera should have been released only for ShB then in a later patch, release Hrothgar. That way, viera wouldn't have gotten such terrible hairstyles & hat limitations & even moreso for Hrothgar. The Ronso in FFX are way better looking due to the time put into their design, while Hrothgar are just copies of Roegadyn & it's meme-worthy.
SE is known for players presenting problems to them, and either acknowledging it & giving the typical "we are aware of the issue but it's a technical limitation" so they never have to deal with it again, Or just ignoring the NA threads simply because there are too many troll threads & threads that ask for personal QoL changes like better Character Customization/ better housing/ viera & hrothgar changes etc.

Even a short bob style would be nice I’m sure they could do easy. Or a shoulder length one. I seen some pics of Vieras with that hair from ff12. Couldn’t figure out how to post a pic via mobile though.