Going on 2 hours of radio silence after logging in to find my character in GM jail

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

This will never happen. Why? Because FFlogs ultimately keeps Savage alive and the devs know it. Without FFlogs, what purpose does clearing Savage multiple times have? Why even care about obtaining i400 gear? It's wholly irrelevant since it only helps clear an encounter faster yet you can longer actually see any improvements. So what's the point? Furthermore, if parses were somehow banned to the point literally no one could gather that information—a highly unlikely scenario—you effectively kill raiding. Why? How are statics supposed to recruit when they have no way of knowing your performance? Ultimate not only demands mechanical awareness but overall high DPS. Without a tool to read this information, people couldn't decipher whether that Black Mage they picked up was pulling 9,000 DPS or 5,000.

"Well, they boss isn't dying! That's how you know." Okay... but how do you know who isn't contributing enough? And therein lies the problem. You wouldn't, which makes recruitment a nightmare.

Regardless, the aforementioned will not happen because even if FFlogs were banned tomorrow. People will simply make an underground tool they don't publicly spread. I suspect the dev's approach is "better a devil you know than one you don't."



People would simply demand you post your numbers publicly, and refusal would be taken as a sign you were lying. Furthermore, as Valkrie said, you need a point of reference for a parse to matter. I cannot improve my DRG or WAR numbers without directly comparing them against better DRGs and WARs. I can't "trim" mistakes unless I know I'm making them, which a solo parse will not tell you.

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To contest this, Coil was a pretty popular raiding cycle, and FFLOGS wasn't around for that, that I know of. Parsing wasn't even really a thing for much of it. I don't remember it being a big deal. Also, Most raiders I know don't raid for competing against other peoples numbers. They raid for the fun and enjoyment of it. The people competing for "speed clears" is a very small subset of the overall raiding community.

As for how you can determine how good a player is without a parse? Its pretty easy. When you are trialing players, you do content you know. That way you can put yourself mostly on autopilot so you can watch them. If all other players are a known quality, then you can judge how things go based on how long the fight takes. Also, SSS kill times. Theres lost of ways to judge a persons skill without parsing.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

To contest this, Coil was a pretty popular raiding cycle, and FFLOGS wasn't around for that, that I know of. Parsing wasn't even really a thing for much of it. I don't remember it being a big deal. Also, Most raiders I know don't raid for competing against other peoples numbers. They raid for the fun and enjoyment of it. The people competing for "speed clears" is a very small subset of the overall raiding community.

As for how you can determine how good a player is without a parse? Its pretty easy. When you are trialing players, you do content you know. That way you can put yourself mostly on autopilot so you can watch them. If all other players are a known quality, then you can judge how things go based on how long the fight takes. Also, SSS kill times. Theres lost of ways to judge a persons skill without parsing.

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That's because the performance gap between different players for that time period appears to have been quite small, so people did not care as much in those days. The encounter design in those days appear to have reflected this as well. Did hard enrages even exist in ARR either? I started playing at the beginning of HW, so I'm not sure. Parsers probably only exploded in popularity among the raiding scene precisely because of how absurdly strict the DPS checks in the Gordias tier was. Actually, a lot of things that caused problems in the raiding scene and the devs' responses to said problems can be traced back to that complete train wreck of a raid tier. (Necessitating the creation of the cross world party finder, for one.)

From what I've observed (and this may not be accurate due to skill changes since then), high DPS in level 50 content was considered to be around the 400-600 range with high end ilvl gear, and most people averaged 200-400. Meanwhile, in Stormblood, you see people with a massive range anywhere between 2k-7k+. The higher the stat/damage gap becomes between players, the harder it is for developers to properly balance new content, especially content tailored towards high-end players.

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Originally Posted by SaitoHikari

That's because the performance gap between different players for that time period appears to have been quite small, so people did not care as much in those days. The encounter design in those days appear to have reflected this as well. Did hard enrages even exist in ARR either? I started playing at the beginning of HW, so I'm not sure. Parsers probably only exploded in popularity among the raiding scene precisely because of how absurdly strict the DPS checks in the Gordias tier was. Actually, a lot of things that caused problems in the raiding scene and the devs' responses to said problems can be traced back to that complete train wreck of a raid tier. (Necessitating the creation of the cross world party finder, for one.)

From what I've observed (and this may not be accurate due to skill changes since then), high DPS in level 50 content was considered to be around the 400-600 range with high end ilvl gear, and most people averaged 200-400. Meanwhile, in Stormblood, you see people with a massive range anywhere between 2k-7k+. The higher the stat/damage gap becomes between players, the harder it is for developers to properly balance new content, especially content tailored towards high-end players.

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Hard or soft enrages were in every single fight in coil. And then even normal mode Alexander had enrage timers.

When DPS is so low, people doing half is not insignificant, just as much as it is now. I remember PLD's being #1 in alliance raids during 2.0...

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

To contest this, Coil was a pretty popular raiding cycle, and FFLOGS wasn't around for that, that I know of. Parsing wasn't even really a thing for much of it. I don't remember it being a big deal. Also, Most raiders I know don't raid for competing against other peoples numbers. They raid for the fun and enjoyment of it. The people competing for "speed clears" is a very small subset of the overall raiding community.

As for how you can determine how good a player is without a parse? Its pretty easy. When you are trialing players, you do content you know. That way you can put yourself mostly on autopilot so you can watch them. If all other players are a known quality, then you can judge how things go based on how long the fight takes. Also, SSS kill times. Theres lost of ways to judge a persons skill without parsing.

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Parsing was, indeed, around in Coil. It simply wasn't made public yet. You also have to factor in people were still learning how the game functioned. Back then, even top tier raiders were hugging tank stance and healers weren't DPSing the way they do now. It isn't about competition with other players. For many raiders, it's simply about seeing their own improvement and beating their previous best. It's a self-imposed challenge to make content more interesting. Does everyone care? Not necessarily. However, you would be very surprised at how many do.

First and foremost, SSS is almost worthless. A target dummy does not translate well into actual combat. Secondly, it's woefully inconsistent. A Bard, for example, will have a horrible time because their whole job is dependent on Crit procs which they will not have consistency solo. I know orange tier Bards who struggle on that dummy simply because RNG said no. Regardless, you've still made the recruitment a nightmare because now a group has to be at auto-pilot level and watch another player perform a rotation for a job they may not even play. To cite myself an example. I can parse whether a DRG or NIN is doing something wrong pretty quickly, especially if their Tricks aren't aligned. But I'm not going to notice a BLM messing up. Not to mention, it's much harder to pick up what's going wrong in the midst of a pull.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Hard or soft enrages were in every single fight in coil. And then even normal mode Alexander had enrage timers.

When DPS is so low, people doing half is not insignificant, just as much as it is now. I remember PLD's being #1 in alliance raids during 2.0...

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It may not be insignificant, but it's still better than the massive range you see among players in SB. Next expansion, we're likely to end up seeing ranges as wide as 3k-10k. From a development standpoint, which range of DPS will the developers use as a good balancing point? The wider it gets in terms of actual numbers (percentage-wise may be seen as rather irrelevant in such balancing dilemmas), the harder it gets for the lower end of the population to catch up (or hide their performance even from people who don't parse, really).

Anyway, I'm also in the camp that thinks there's really more to this story. When you think about the actions the GMs took, it completely contradicts their 'no off-site/outside game evidence' policy. The only way OP would have been nailed is if the report was filed under 'harassment', as no other category fits. If this is indeed the full story, 10 days is huge for a simple harassment report based purely on parsing, I believe that's the maximum punishment short of an outright permaban. (Enforcement against parsing is mostly a he said/she said sort of thing on top of that - the only way this makes sense at all if we take the OP's words at face value is if the GM in question broke standard policy and accepted off-site evidence, which would be scary as hell because it would set precedent for certain trolls on these forums to get themselves uploaded on purpose and then ask the GMs to ban them afterwards.)

(It also says quite a lot about moderation practices when suspension length and exactly what they mean in terms of severity is common knowledge among the community.)

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Its because its sniffing the game network traffic that it is against the rules.

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I'm only replying to state that this post is incorrect as I'm reading through this thread. If someone has already pointed this out later in the thread I apologize.

Parsers look at a .log file text document which you're receiving from the server, they don't interact with server network traffic at all. They look at when incoming damage posted in the log and then do math to give you a slightly behind look at damage being done real time from the messages as they're added to the log. Technically anyone could do this without a parser if they wanted to open up a spread sheet and take the relevant information.

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Originally Posted by McChaffee

I'm only replying to state that this post is incorrect as I'm reading through this thread. If someone has already pointed this out later in the thread I apologize.

Parsers look at a .log file text document which you're receiving from the server, they don't interact with server network traffic at all. They look at when incoming damage posted in the log and then do math to give you a slightly behind look at damage being done real time from the messages as they're added to the log. Technically anyone could do this without a parser if they wanted to open up a spread sheet and take the relevant information.

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They do that only in non-network mode. And even then, that is not accurate. They either read network data, or they read the system's memory. They do not go off log files.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

They do that only in non-network mode. And even then, that is not accurate. They either read network data, or they read the system's memory. They do not go off log files.

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That's not how it works at all for any game that doesn't have a built-in plugin or support interface. A program cannot ping the game servers for data if there is no system implemented to give a response. It can only read the data coming back from the servers which is sent to that log file.

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Originally Posted by McChaffee

That's not how it works at all for any game that doesn't have a built-in plugin or support interface. A program cannot ping the game servers for data if there is no system implemented to give a response. It can only read the data coming back from the servers which is sent to that log file.

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I didn't say it was talking to the server, I said it was reading the network data. You do know how a packet sniffer works right? It reads the data without intercepting it.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

They do that only in non-network mode. And even then, that is not accurate. They either read network data, or they read the system's memory. They do not go off log files.

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Yes, they do and yes, you can make accurate calculations using a .log file because there's always a live file being generated whenever you log into the game. If you didn't realize it, the default battle tab records all combat including damage as it happens live, which is where most of the parser are getting their information from as all that information is dumped immediately into the log. It's why when I've seen people using something like ACT while streaming there is usually a few seconds delay on the damage adjusting after burst or on initial hits.

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Originally Posted by McChaffee

Yes, they do and yes, you can make accurate calculations using a .log file because there's always a live file being generated whenever you log into the game. If you didn't realize it, the default battle tab records all combat including damage as it happens live, which is where most of the parser are getting their information from as all that information is dumped immediately into the log. It's why when I've seen people using something like ACT while streaming there is usually a few seconds delay on the damage adjusting after burst or on initial hits.

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Going any further to prove it isn't worth the forum ban I'm sure I'd get after being reported, so I will stop here.

My friend was banned recently and had to go through the same experience of waiting 4-5 hours for someone to come find her, only to be told that she had to file a false harassment report in order to alert the GMs to her being there.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...lbXkAQP6cl9Oo/

As a disclaimer I agree entirely with what has been said in that Google document, and if it were not 3,000 words past the word limit I would have likely just repeated it myself. I watched the event unfold from the beginning via Discord and I was honestly somewhat surprised that SE would treat their customers like this. Breaking TOS or not, a customer is a customer. Really, the issue is that the jail exists as a way for GMs to isolate players who they perceive to have broken the rules and then communicate with them directly, but it doesn't really give the person much of an opportunity to let someone know they're there. Filing a false harassment report is absolutely not the way to do it, especially since it isn't written anywhere that it's the GM's expected mode of communication.

You know, I'd be morbidly curious to see what happens if someone actually records in video format what happens in those jails.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Going any further to prove it isn't worth the forum ban I'm sure I'd get after being reported, so I will stop here.

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Yeah, no. I'm pretty sure I saw you using this argument before and ran off with the exact same response when challenged.

If it was really packet sniffing, I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have to simulate/estimate the amount of damage inflicted by DoTs, which aren't recorded in the battle log. And if it was really packet sniffing, there wouldn't be a 2-3 day period after every major patch where they simply don't work because the algorithm to properly read things from new content doesn't yet exist. If it was packet sniffing, such things wouldn't be necessary, as all the information would be grabbed server side. But it isn't, so they have to constantly update and maintain them after every patch.

Damn I made one last post to this thread and went to bed, woke up to find it doubled in size and thought I was gonna find some casual conversation coming back in @_@

https://media1.tenor.com/images/8c38...itemid=4066536

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Meanwhile, hundreds of players are busy being involved in actual cheating via DoL/H bots and hunt sniffers but the GMs can't/won't do squat about them, nor will the STF.

It's stupid as heck to get a 10 day suspension simply because you mentioned a third party program and someone decided to report you. That's deserving of a warning at worst for a first time offense.

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I have RMT bots I reported for spamming Shouts still on my Black List since day 1 of the RMT report System :\/

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Originally Posted by Causality

I have RMT bots I reported for spamming Shouts still on my Black List since day 1 of the RMT report System :\/

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They don't delete the characters. They just ban them.

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Originally Posted by Causality

I have RMT bots I reported for spamming Shouts still on my Black List since day 1 of the RMT report System :\/

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You can remove them if they've been on your BList for that long, as they're either most likely banned, or abandoned. (deleted) only appears if the user deletes their character.

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Originally Posted by SayuyuYuyu

My friend was banned recently and had to go through the same experience of waiting 4-5 hours for someone to come find her, only to be told that she had to file a false harassment report in order to alert the GMs to her being there.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...lbXkAQP6cl9Oo/

As a disclaimer I agree entirely with what has been said in that Google document, and if it were not 3,000 words past the word limit I would have likely just repeated it myself. I watched the event unfold from the beginning via Discord and I was honestly somewhat surprised that SE would treat their customers like this. Breaking TOS or not, a customer is a customer. Really, the issue is that the jail exists as a way for GMs to isolate players who they perceive to have broken the rules and then communicate with them directly, but it doesn't really give the person much of an opportunity to let someone know they're there. Filing a false harassment report is absolutely not the way to do it, especially since it isn't written anywhere that it's the GM's expected mode of communication.

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This is completely unacceptable and SE should be ashamed of their abysmal customer service. Banning someone over parsing is already stupid but treating them that way makes it that much worse.

That GM should suffer some sort of penalty and they definitely shouldn't be in any kind of customer-facing role, they're inconsiderate and not cut out for this job in the slightest.

Now I’m about to ask a question, just a question so I don’t want a big fight or anything, but how many bans have to happen because of parsing to make people not do it, or is this a hill to die on?

I mean personally if someone is parsing I think they assume the risk that they know it’s against the TOS(if they agree with the rule or not)and could be banned.

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

Now I’m about to ask a question, just a question so I don’t want a big fight or anything, but how many bans have to happen because of parsing to make people not do it, or is this a hill to die on?

I mean personally if someone is parsing I think they assume the risk that they know it’s against the TOS(if they agree with the rule or not)and could be banned.

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Why stop doing it when you can just not talk about it and keep doing it? The only people affected by it would be PS4 players.

Seeing as a fair amount of youtubers parse to show rotations in guides, they go unpunished and SE has documented proof of them, but because one person didn't like it despite them not being the one wanting to know how they did and thus were not given the info? I am well aware they are illegal but its a silly thing to ban for 10 days versus all the bots that are farming mats right now. Though I would hope the hours in jail counted toward the ban because that is a bit messed up. Especially if you were just logging in to check something and gotta leave for work or whatever, what happens then? You login a few days later to then get the ban?

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

Seeing as a fair amount of youtubers parse to show rotations in guides, they go unpunished and SE has documented proof of them, but because one person didn't like it despite them not being the one wanting to know how they did and thus were not given the info? I am well aware they are illegal but its a silly thing to ban for 10 days versus all the bots that are farming mats right now. Though I would hope the hours in jail counted toward the ban because that is a bit messed up. Especially if you were just logging in to check something and gotta leave for work or whatever, what happens then? You login a few days later to then get the ban?

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Only form of evidence GMs and STF accept are logs pulled from their own servers.

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Originally Posted by Gralna

Only form of evidence GMs and STF accept are logs pulled from their own servers.

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Makes sense then though I still don't fully agree on the whole parser thing myself. If it is used to harass others then yeah, please ban them. Though I would like to imagine the greater percent of people who do use them are only trying to improve themselves, not gloat how they beat the BLM by X amount or whatever.

I do hope the OP does post on reddit what exactly happened, lol or maybe I will ask my friends to report me for using a parser and I will mention it in chat. Going on vacation soon anyways worth a try maybe. I doubt this is the whole story and 10 day in game suspension for first offense seems out of character. I have know someone who got three days for openly admitting to boting and rmt in FC chat when they thought it was only us.

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Originally Posted by Gralna

Only form of evidence GMs and STF accept are logs pulled from their own servers.

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Which is basically why non-RMT bots almost never get banned since the vast majority of them are operating within the limitations of a legitimate player and thus will look perfectly innocent from their perspective.

They really have no idea what they're doing if they think all bots are going exhibit quirks that are readily identifiable simply from data logs.

The whole parser thing is actually getting ridiculous.

What sort of rule is "don't ask, don't tell"? Does it mean that using a parser itself is legal and the act of mentioning it is ban worthy? If they actually saw parsing itself as bad and wanted to combat it, they know they could simply scan a few hundred savage and ultimate runs and go nuts on the ban hammer. What is their real stance on it?

This vague half-rule is tedious. You may parse, but you must sneak around like a naughty child, afraid to even discuss a single parse with fc or friends or your static incase you slip and someone else in the party decides to net you a 10 day ban and 8 hours in GM jail.

They could simply block third party software from communicating with the game, but they can't. They know full well that an outright ban on parsing would wipe out the Savage and Ultimate playerbase, which in turn gives casual players no long-term goal and ultimately deals a nasty blow to the game. So instead they've opted to pretend it doesn't exist, trying to simultaneously please the hardcore players by letting them secretly parse and the casual players by pretending no one can judge their performance and they're awesome... and the result is players like the OP get caught in the middle and booted for 10 days to maintain the farce.

It's about time they faced facts and gave us solid rules. Parsers exist. Either implement them or outright ban them. Enough is enough.

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

Now I’m about to ask a question, just a question so I don’t want a big fight or anything, but how many bans have to happen because of parsing to make people not do it, or is this a hill to die on?

I mean personally if someone is parsing I think they assume the risk that they know it’s against the TOS(if they agree with the rule or not)and could be banned.

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All at once or over time? If you're talking all at once, they'd need to ban a very, very large amount of people and then have to justify whether the lost revenue from banning such a sizeable player volume would be worth it or not (spoilers: no.) While it wouldn't be a complete hill to die on, parsers are so wide-spread that they'd be tripping on that hill and would have to make sure they don't tumble to their doom as a result.

Their "don't ask, don't tell" policy is pretty perfect as far as what needs to be done. They know how popular parsers are, they know it'll cause insane backlash if they try to do anything, so they just silently look the other way while punishing anyone who isn't very bright and mentions them in-game.

If you're talking about over time, it'll never happen. People will just get smarter on how they speak about parsers, keep discussions 100% out of game, making sure to not even mention parsers in any shape or form to avoid giving Square any sort of evidence at all.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Which is basically why non-RMT bots almost never get banned since the vast majority of them are operating within the limitations of a legitimate player and thus will look perfectly innocent from their perspective.

They really have no idea what they're doing if they think all bots are going exhibit quirks that are readily identifiable simply from data logs.

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Reminds me of the bot I tried to report long time ago in Mor Dhona. Would teleport in, walk to the crack in the road, mount up, run, stop, turn, run, gather and teleport away. Same time, same distance, never moving from it. Only reason I know is because I was there gathering between the trees for clusters to sell. Bout of a month of this going on (I worked from home so only thing I could do) and he was always there.

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

Now I’m about to ask a question, just a question so I don’t want a big fight or anything, but how many bans have to happen because of parsing to make people not do it, or is this a hill to die on?

I mean personally if someone is parsing I think they assume the risk that they know it’s against the TOS(if they agree with the rule or not)and could be banned.

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The problem with parsing is in its widespread use of players flagrantly ignoring the TOS. Square can't ban enough people to make a difference without hurting their bottom line, their community, and their content.

This is why prohibition fails; if enough flatly ignore a law, it becomes unenforceable due to the logistics of policing so many people at once. Same with TOS violations: if it would hurt Square more (in subs, retention, or participation rates) to enforce their TOS to the letter than just let it slide, then it slides.

Seriously, can you imagine how much damage content creators like Happy or Work to Game or Larry could do to this company if Square straight-up banned them all for using a parser? Square might be "justified" by their TOS, but there's still significant extralegal risk for them in going up against people that are this important in the community. And that's just three off the top of my head, not all of which I personally consider important.

Of course I would never parse, myself. That would be naughty.

This thread is depressing.

If what OP is saying is true, this ban is way too long for someone who is only using a parser. If they were being abusive towards other players then fair enough, but if this is not the case the ban should at the very least be lighter.

SE really need to do something about this. We need something better than the dummies to gauge performance. Give players a rating, that only they can see, based on their equipped gear at the end of an instance, or have it up as a damage meter throughout the instance. That way players are given an idea as to how well they're playing for the gear they have on, without having it displayed in front of everyone and having potential drama over it.

As long as we have nothing resembling the above players are going to continue to use third party software. It's not going to go away.

You really think people will stop using parsers if SE give us personnal ones ? More like they will continue to use them anyway to judge the performance of other players in their party XD

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Originally Posted by Penthea

This thread is depressing.

If what OP is saying is true, this ban is way too long for someone who is only using a parser. If they were being abusive towards other players then fair enough, but if this is not the case the ban should at the very least be lighter.

SE really need to do something about this. We need something better than the dummies to gauge performance. Give players a rating, that only they can see, based on their equipped gear at the end of an instance, or have it up as a damage meter throughout the instance. That way players are given an idea as to how well they're playing for the gear they have on, without having it displayed in front of everyone and having potential drama over it.

As long as we have nothing resembling the above players are going to continue to use third party software. It's not going to go away.

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Agreed, we need something more useful (and required for entry) than SSS. At bare minimum.

Unfortunately, any information SE doesn't provide players will find out for themselves. As has been the case since the dawn of time.

If it's not a parser, then it's an OCD interpretation of HP bars or heaven knows what else. Not to mention all sorts of things like datamining and such. Never underestimate a playerbase's desire to understand the goings-on, whether they're given a door or not.

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Originally Posted by WaterShield

The rules are indeed the rules. They are not however a divine decree from the heavens. Perhaps the rules should be changed? It seems to myself (along with several others) that this incident was incredibly unfair.

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But that just the thing. Life isnt fair look while I feel for the player getting a ban the fact of the matter is THEY CHOSE to use third party software in direct violation of the Terms of Service was the punishment harsh absolutely. However what you as people are saying is that if someone breaks rules knowingly they shouldnt be punished by that logic string nobody should be punished for anything they ever did knowingly.

Can you see the problem with that line of thinking? That said Maybe I'd have gone with time served since they could do nothing anyways for four hours.

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Originally Posted by kidalutz

But that just the thing. Life isnt fair look while I feel for the player getting a ban the fact of the matter is THEY CHOSE to use third party software in direct violation of the Terms of Service was the punishment harsh absolutely. However what you as people are saying is that if someone breaks rules knowingly they shouldnt be punished by that logic string nobody should be punished for anything they ever did knowingly.

Can you see the problem with that line of thinking? That said Maybe I'd have gone with time served since they could do nothing anyways for four hours.

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Oh yeah, they had it coming and should have known the risks. If I were a GM I probably would have let it slide but...rules are rules. And we agree to them when we start up this game and pay a subscription. Just because it's "don't ask don't tell" doesn't mean that every GM believes in that. They were caught and they were punished. Hopefully it was a learning experience for them.

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Originally Posted by kidalutz

But that just the thing. Life isnt fair look while I feel for the player getting a ban the fact of the matter is THEY CHOSE to use third party software in direct violation of the Terms of Service was the punishment harsh absolutely. However what you as people are saying is that if someone breaks rules knowingly they shouldnt be punished by that logic string nobody should be punished for anything they ever did knowingly.

Can you see the problem with that line of thinking? That said Maybe I'd have gone with time served since they could do nothing anyways for four hours.

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What people are asking for is consistency. Yoshida himself watched the World First progression of both Ultimates where every single group had parsers displayed. So why weren't any of these players issued a ten day ban? Now if the OP harassed someone about their numbers or was an all around jerk, you could justify a lengthily reprimand. But if we take them at their word, they were banned for merely saying they would upload logs when someone else in the group asked. Why is this worth a ten day ban but the Director and Producer of the game itself outright watching raiders parse live isn't?

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

What people are asking for is consistency. Yoshida himself watched the World First progression of both Ultimates where every single group had parsers displayed. So why weren't any of these players issued a ten day ban? Now if the OP harassed someone about their numbers or was an all around jerk, you could justify a lengthily reprimand. But if we take them at their word, they were banned for merely saying they would upload logs when someone else in the group asked. Why is this worth a ten day ban but the Director and Producer of the game itself outright watching raiders parse live isn't?

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Well, what he says and what the company does may be 2 different things regarding this issue. He may not care, but the policies the company put in place prohibits third party software from being used. At the end of the day the terms of service are what matters. Hey may not have a say since he isn't the company.

You did something... you know what it is downright... if NOT you have a few choices...
Wait it out.
Quit the game.
Contact a 3rd party to deal with this injustice.

The last one isn't really an option.


Wait are you the reason there is maintenance tomorrow?

i don't see the problem of not letting people see there own numbers in game and make it against the rules to demand them or abuse people because of them problem solved (sigh)

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Originally Posted by Aurelius2625

Bruh. There's an EASY solution to this. a SOLO parser built IN GAME for EVERYONE to use. No one would be in the dark again, everyone would be on an even playing field. And no one would have to know anyone else's damage since everyone would just use that instead of fflogs or w/e. Jesus.

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I agree with you, even though I dont much care either way. Ive nothing against parsing assuming that folks keep it out of chat. That said, if you are discovered to have used it well its on you and you broke the ToS so deal with it. Doesnt matter WHEN the offense was. If twitch streamers are actively recording their stream with parsers up thats also on them should SE take action, but likely they dont get action taken against them because they havent "stated in game" that they were using it and none of those twitch streamers have clearly been reported for it and given the GMs the proof.
Its a ridiculous thing all around and wholly unfair, but SE cant monitor every website, but they can monitor their own game. The only real solution is as you say, create an in-game parser and be done with the damn thing. However, It should remain personal to you and only you, and not visible to other players to avoid the inevitable friction having a parser would cause.

This goes to show that SE should at least add a true combat logging to file so people can upload them to a web site and see their performance. There is ZERO harm in this. It would prevent people like OP from getting reported for doing no harm to the community in any way. In fact I think reporting in this situation causes MORE harm to the community than good. Now OP might be less likely to join learning parties and helping complete strangers. I know I would stop and just stick to my FC and friends.