Being Gendered Correctly

I wish I could rename my character. I'm a guy but I usually pick a female character in any game unless the males look bad ass like Dante from DMC or Chris Redfield.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by micropanther7

This. I think people who say it isn't an issue are kind of missing the point :p It IS an issue for Kimmy because she is transgender and it's important to her.

---

Because you can't change the rules for 1 person which is essentially what is being asked for. Not to mention if the rule DID change and suddenly everyone would start assuming ingame gender = real gender do you have any idea how many more creeps would pop out the woodwork harassing every female char running around or dudes playing female char just cause of free stuff?
I am sorry it hurts the OP but what she is asking is entirely selfish based on her own experiences.

This thread went full dumblr fast.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IndigoHawk

Maybe an avatar looks female, but actually the character is a pre op FTM who prefers "he". Or maybe the character is neither a man nor a woman and prefers "xe".

The OP asks people to assume that gender matches appearance stereotypes, but that's hurtful to characters with other types of gender.

It is unrealistic to expect strangers to know how who you are and what your preferences are. They don't know your IRL gender and they can't be sure of your character's gender based on appearance.

Don't be hurt because strangers don't know you. Unless you ask everyone you meet what gender they are and what pronouns they prefer, then admit that it's a bit unrealistic to expect people to go that far.
People make assumptions so they can communicate and play the game, not because they're trying to hurt you.

---

LOL whut?

They play opposite of their correct gender and then get upset for being called the gender they appear as?

Just, no.

Female character = female
Male character = male
Correct me if I'm wrong.
Seriously, I'm just going to not say anything the next time someone calls me a he, if i'm standing near them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Assirra

Because you can't change the rules for 1 person which is essentially what is being asked for. Not to mention if the rule DID change and suddenly everyone would start assuming ingame gender = real gender do you have any idea how many more creeps would pop out the woodwork harassing every female char running around or dudes playing female char just cause of free stuff?
I am sorry it hurts the OP but what she is asking is entirely selfish based on her own experiences.

---

OP had already stated she doesn't want any policy or rules change. Just that the people who read this try to stop assuming every single avatar is a guy. Either to try to call someone by their name or the gender based on their character.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Takeva

LOL whut?

They play a opposite of their correct gender and then get upset for being called the gender they appear as?

Just, no.

Female character = female
Male character = male
Correct me if I'm wrong.

---

You are partly wrong. No one should get offended if someone wrongly guesses his/her gender. If you do, you have personal issues that should be dealt outside of this, or any, online game.

I can safely assume that most of the female characters you see running around are actually males behind the keyboard, since looking at boobs and legs and asses (despite how bad catgirl asses are) is better than looking at sweaty manly muscles. At least for me, and I guess many other males who roll nekogirls. For this reason, as said "he" is still the most safe bet when referring to them.

Men usually think with their ****, myself included, and catgirls satisfy that need.

The more graphics evolve, the more males will play with female avatars - you can bet your money on it :P

y'alls males postin' in a female thread

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Takeva

OP had already stated she doesn't want any policy or rules change. Just that the people who read this try to stop assuming every single avatar is a guy. Either to try to call someone by their name or the gender based on their character.

---

I am not talking about ingame rules or policies. I am talking about general mmo "rules". Said rule is (like you saw in this thread a ton) the assumption of a male playing unless corrected otherwise.
This is exactly what the op wants to change and i say it would cause more trouble then it solves.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

... Men usually think with their ****, myself included, and catgirls satisfy that need.

---

I appreciate what you're saying but that line really rubs me the wrong way. (no pun intended)

We really need to stop downplaying ourselves like this. We're not slavering beasts.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Demetirus

I appreciate what you're saying but that line really rubs me the wrong way. (no pun intended)

We really need to stop downplaying ourselves like this. We're not slavering beasts.

---

I assume its just a a follow up for the internet meme "i rather stare at a female ass then a male ass all the time in an mmo".
Nothing more then a joke or are we seriously gonne start opening another can of worms?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kimmy_Dee

It's not a general catch because it's an assumption. If you want to go gender neutral, use "they".

---

It's pretty much this ! If someone is to blame though it would be the males playing female characters using feminine names .
It happens in just about every MMO weather it's RPG or not. Coming from RIFT / WOW ect. I will say that 70% of the female toons are male players.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Demetirus

I appreciate what you're saying but that line really rubs me the wrong way. (no pun intended)

We really need to stop downplaying ourselves like this. We're not slavering beasts.

---

Hah well, just take it as you will.

Of course I did not mean to "downplay" our entire gender, please do not misunderstand - I just believe that, generally speaking, males have a tendency to be more "open" about their sexual desires and tastes than females. With due exceptions, of course - but I believe there is a reason that...peculiar industries were born mainly to satisfy the needs of men.

This is just survival instinct, nothing more - it's not like we managed to survive all this time by focusing our attention on the asses of other males. It's in our DNA :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

You are partly wrong. No one should get offended if someone wrongly guesses his/her gender. If you do, you have personal issues that should be dealt outside of this, or any, online game.

---

Also, like someone said in the Marriage thread (heh, btw, closed...), when you're playing a MMORPG you should keep on mind that a character is an AVATAR. Playing with a female character doesn't mean i'm a girl. Playing with a huge Roegadyn doesn't mean i'm strong in real life... NOBODY can know who you are in real life based on the appearance of your character, so is stupid to be offended because someone assumed your gender wrongly

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Assirra

Nothing more then a joke or are we seriously gonne start opening another can of worms?

---

Sorry, not sure what you mean - you think it's a joke?
I don't understand what's so odd about it - isn't it quite accepted that a gender is usually visually attracted by the opposite one?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Sorry, not sure what you mean - you think it's a joke?
I don't understand what's so odd about it - isn't it quite accepted that a gender is usually visually attracted by the opposite one?

---

Assirra was basically telling Demetirus not to take what you wrote to heart. You made a light joke about how guys tend to think with the brain between their legs.

Blame the English language for having no gender neutral terms to use. "They" is grammatically incorrect, and even if it's starting to catch on it cannot be assumed that everyone will be comfortable using it. Consider the use of "he" to be similar to the use of the word "mankind" in such cases - the speaker doesn't honestly know (or care) whether you are female or male.

They may not even know whether your CHARACTER is male or female; a commonly female name isn't a giveaway either, as many use such names ironically (such as making a big, buff Highlander Hyur and naming him "Tiffany"). When I join an instance, I rarely pay much attention to the characters around me - my eyes are on the enemy if I'm PLD or SMN, or they are on that row of HP bars if I'm WHM. That glamour set you spent 3 million to build, or that character you spent hours designing in the character editor to get just right? Lost on me. I probably won't even know what race you are. :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Takeva

Assirra was basically telling Demetirus not to take what you wrote to heart. You made a light joke about how guys tend to think with the brain between their legs.

---

Ah, ok. Sorry.

It wasn't...really a light joke but it might be better to leave it as that :P

When I approach a bunch of girls in real life I always slip out "hey guys." or something like that, by mistake, I am pretty sure none of them went and cut themselves and cried themselves to sleep because of it. It's nothing personal it's human nature to refer to things most common to us.

Like the last few have said, it's not a personal attack so stop treating it as such. There's a lot of things on the internet people shouldn't really take to heart...EVER....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Assirra

I assume its just a a follow up for the internet meme "i rather stare at a female ass then a male ass all the time in an mmo".
Nothing more then a joke or are we seriously gonne start opening another can of worms?

---

You're very correct and it's not something that needs opening. It's just very much a hot button topic for me. I wasn't being too heavy about the matter, was I?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Of course I did not mean to "downplay" our entire gender, please do not misunderstand ... -snip-

---

Of course, I understand. I do apologize and am not trying to call you out specifically but it's a topic of concern for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Takeva

Assirra was basically telling Demetirus not to take what you wrote to heart. You made a light joke about how guys tend to think with the brain between their legs.

---

Indeed and Assirra was very right! I'm not overly offended, thankfully, just somewhat passionate about the topic.

So because a lot of men play as female characters, we should default refer to them as "he" until told otherwise? If a character is male, I will refer to them as "he" unless corrected, and female as "she" unless corrected. TC isn't being outlandish at all. Telling TC to "get over it" while saying that female characters should not initially be referred to as "she" because there are males behind said characters IS what is outlandish.


If anyone is catering to anyone, it's initially referring to female characters as "he" because you give more importance to a potential male being behind the character than a female ("he" is not gender-neutral, it's "they"). Excuse the vulgarity, but you do not get to strip a gender of their identity because you enjoy "looking at hot miqo'te ass" when you play the game, and if you fail to see that, then that is privilege.

As a side note, you can't invalidate someone's feelings just because their concerns are no big deal to you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Odett

Snip

---

What.

You can call people however you want. She, he, it, they, fish, moon, lightpole.
Who cares.

As said previously, it's just a matter of probability. It's safer to assume that behind a female avatar there is a male player because, well, that's how things have always been since the beginning of online play. We are not roleplaying in this game, character gender has nothing to do with anything in our daily in-game communication, so using the in-game sex as criteria is not that obvious or logical.

If people want to see something "deeper" than this, it's their problem - screaming "sexism" all the time is just making the word itself carry less weight than it should, and THAT is indeed a problem.

I still think that calling a female avatar "he" (without any prior knowledge, that is) is hardly the same as "stripping a gender of their identity" but whatever, carry on the drama, it's fun.

EDIT: I am not invalidating anything. I am just stating my view on this matter, as everyone else (including the OP) is doing.
You can't invalidate my observation just because of your personal feelings.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Odett

As a side note, you can't invalidate someone's feelings just because their concerns are no big deal to you.

---

Not if that "one" wants to change everyone because his/her personal concern

I have a very acute arachnophobia. Diremite kinda resemble a spider, not enough to trigger my fear, but enough to make me feel uncomfortable. Please, SE, will you remove diremites and their webs from tam-tara to let me enjoy the dungeon?

Get my point?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HumsterMKX

I guess... in order to no offend anyone by saying "he", we should use "it" instead.

Or we can use other terms like "midget", "knife ears", "generic rpg human", "stereotypical rpg muscle race", "cat", etc. Since the terms are not gender locked like "he" or "she".

---

Ok... lets end this gender thingy... From now on, we refer to everyone using gender neutral terms:

Hyur:
Generic rpg human
*insert colour*human
Dress Wearing human
Pants wearing human

Highlander:
Homeless human
Taller human
Generic barbarian rpg human
Brawny human

Lalafell:
Sand/Plains Midget
Sack of potatoes
Bite-size snack
Pedobear bait
Sacrificial offering

Elezen:
Knife ears
Token generic rpg Elf race
Self proclaim superior race
Drizzt Clone

Miqo'te:
Sun/Moon cat
Furball
Fleabag
Yarn chasers
Lalafell prehistoric predator


Roegadyn:
Stereotypical rpg muscle race
*Go work in the mines*
Not a Galka
No tail Galka


Feel free to add to the list. So ppl don;t feel gender discriminated.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Merle

Not if that "one" wants to change everyone because his/her personal concern

I have a very acute arachnophobia. Diremite kinda resemble a spider, not enough to trigger my fear, but enough to make me feel uncomfortable. Please, SE, will you remove diremites and their webs from tam-tara to let me enjoy the dungeon?

Get my point?

---

Being scared of a monster and asking to be gendered correctly are not even remotely close. Do I understand your fear of spiders? Somewhat at least, since I'm arachnophobic myself, but having a female character with a female name and asking to be spoken to as such is not "wanting to change everyone" or comparable to your example.

I'm a male playing a female character. So are you saying I should throw a hissy fit when someone assumes I'm a female and trades me a flower? No, I don't. It's the exact same situation flipped over. It's not the end of the world. Politely correct them and move on with your life.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tiggy

I'm a male playing a female character. So are you saying I should throw a hissy fit when someone assumes I'm a female and trades me a flower? No, I don't. It's the exact same situation flipped over. It's not the end of the world. Politely correct them and move on with your life.

---

No it isn't. I'm also playing a female character. People are calling me he. It shouldn't be that much to ask that people refer to female characters as she.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kimmy_Dee

No it isn't. I'm also playing a female character. People are calling me he. It shouldn't be that much to ask that people refer to female characters as she.

---

Have you even bothered reading all the replies to your own thread?

What you ask is not going to happen. In game gender has nothing to do with real life gender. And generally speaking the users of MMOs have historically been males, henceforth the more widespread use of male pronouns.

You can shout all you want, but this is not sexism by any stretch of imagination - it's just habit due to experience, since NO ONE will have a problem calling you "she" when you point out that you prefer it that way. Stop acting like a princess.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Have you even bothered reading all the replies to your own thread?

What you ask is not going to happen. In game gender has nothing to do with real life gender. And generally speaking the users of MMOs have historically been males, henceforth the more widespread use of male pronouns.

You can shout all you want, but this is not sexism by any stretch of imagination - it's just habit due to experience, since NO ONE will have a problem calling you "she" when you point out that you prefer it that way. Stop acting like a princess.

---

I'm convinced this is just a troll thread. The OP came here complaining about a problem that's honestly only a problem to them due to unique circumstances that involve being a transgender. There have been plenty of replies offering advice and trying to explain it's nothing malicious. Hell I even suggested they find the LGBT directory thread so they can join one and prevent themselves from ever being misidentified again, but they just continue arguing that it affects them specially and everyone else should change

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Marowit

I'm convinced this is just a troll thread.

---

..damn, if it is, I fell for it head first.

10/10.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

NO ONE will have a problem calling you "she" when you point out that you prefer it that way. Stop acting like a princess.

---

But if she can't pretend she's being persecuted, what will she have to complain about on the internet?

This is something that has irritated me for a lot of years now.

I was a roleplayer before I was an MMO player. I believe that people shouldn't be worrying about 'the player' and should just focus on the avatar. This game is a whole different world. Real world stuff shouldn't matter. We jump into these virtual worlds to experience a whole different kind of life, in a new place, as a new person. When you create your character, you are free to be whatever you want to be in that world. If it's a Spell caster, or an armored knight, that's your choice. If it's a plain old human, a fancy elf, or a shrimpy little gnome, that's up to you. And that goes for gender as well. You are (should be) free to be a man or a woman in that world.

It's simply not right to address female characters as "he". It does not matter if the player is actually male or female, it's insulting and disrespectful to their efforts either way. Whoever they are, they made their choices just like you did. If they chose to participate in this world as a female character, they should be treated as a female.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kimmy_Dee

It's not a general catch because it's an assumption. If you want to go gender neutral, use "they".

---

I've been remmed out enough times by RL girls to know that this is the way to go. If you are going to assume, play it safe and use They.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Remilia_Nightfall

Have you even bothered reading all the replies to your own thread?

What you ask is not going to happen. In game gender has nothing to do with real life gender. And generally speaking the users of MMOs have historically been males, henceforth the more widespread use of male pronouns.

---

Progress bad. Moving forward bad. Getting this ass-backwards society to finally treat women and men as equals and not cater to men by default bad.

If your skin isn't thick enough to handle something like this maybe console gaming is the way for you to go. I understand your situation, but it's a game, people aren't going to take the time to ponder whether you are a male or female because in the end it's not a huge deal to anyone else.

Wtf lol what does console gaming have to do with gender?

Sorry to be Devil's Advocate here but this simply is not something you will be able to address/change/expect to be different given this is the internet. My own FC thought I was female until I told them otherwise (and got on voice chat finally) but it didn't bother me in the least. This being the internet and the majority of gamers ARE male (majority counts as being anything over 50%), people go with the assumption that whom they are speaking with are male until proven otherwise.

@OP Can I understand what you may be going through? No, of course not and I'm not going to pretend to. You may just have to roll with it because you simply will not be able to change how people think.

I do have several questions though:

What happens if you're called a "he" by another female player? Does that offend you the same? More so? The female posters on the forums can all say they're innocent of this same behaviour but we all know that they can be just as guilty as males can.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Odett

Progress bad. Moving forward bad. Getting this ass-backwards society to finally treat women and men as equals and not cater to men by default bad.

---

Are you for real?
Do you plan to fight your pseudo feminist battle on the forums of a MMO?

Good luck.

The only way to avoid upsetting someone would be to start each party by saying:

"Hi all, could I just hold the run up for a minute or two and ask what sex you all are in real life? I just don't want to upset any sensitive people by calling them she when they're a he or he when they're a she".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Galliano

The only way to avoid upsetting someone would be to start each party by saying:

"Hi all, could I just hold the run up for a minute or two and ask what sex you all are in real life? I just don't want to upset any sensitive people by calling them she when they're a he or he when they're a she".

---

Join party macro go!

/p "Hihi!"
/wait 1
/p "a/s/l?"

I know I assume that other players in the game are male until being told or shown otherwise. Character gender aside, it's mostly guys playing the game, so most of the time that assumption is going to be right.

If it bothers you, just correct people. I'm sure no one means any offense by it.

Quote:

---

playing a female character with a female name should be sufficient to get gendered as female.

---

It's not, because the character you play has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the player behind the character

Quote:

---

Pretty much the only thing I could do about this beyond what I have already is start off every party with, "By the way, I'm a girl." Not only does it feel obnoxious and tedious to have to do,

---

You're def right about that one, though