2.0 battle system will depend on rotations like in WOW?

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Originally Posted by Colino

And people really seem to forget about that. Barrage outside of combo is almost useless and has a massive cooldown to boot, there's plenty of other good examples but of course haters will continue to hate as expected.

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Raging strike -> light shot -> light shot - > barrage -> light shot -> quelling strike -> light shot = 3k TP aprox.

Barrage is useful as hell.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

The new video up said combos will now consume TP. Also they added a 3 second global cool down on all abilities.

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Say hello to Klaus, Dargoth.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

Did you ever play at a high level in those "so called MMO"? Maintaining a rotation != spamming skills. But if you only know XI and XIV, this concept may be a bit harder to understand.

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For starters, I've probably played more MMOs through Endgame than you can name. It's my Job. More importantly, if you want to convince someone that the way you like things is better, you should probably not start out by being a complete bitch.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

On top of having an order to execute spells/abilities, like A > B > C > A > D... You also have a priority order list to follow. A/B/C/D may be the four "damage" abilities you will use the most, on top of that you will have other things to manage. Like refreshing DoTs, refreshing Buffs, etc.

This can become extremely complex because of procs that doesn't occur in a steady manner (i.e. : X% chance of your next cast to be instant). And also because of battle mechanics that will force you to skip certain spells and will disrupt you in your rotation.

Here is an example of a 32 seconds rotation in Rift, for a Mage DPS. You don't know the spell names/abbreviations, but it doesn't mater.

(IC) (/IC) is an ability that consume charge over time (see it like if you were depleting your TP in XIV, gradually over time). When it's on, you do more damage. Since the supply of charge is limited, you have to keep activating/deactivating it only at specific part of your rotation to maximize DPS.

The rotation is so complex that DPS between two mages, having the exact same gear can vary by up to 30%, and that's on a battle dummy (so with no external factor disturbing them). This is a typical example where skill > gear. Someone with gear that's 1 tier lower could out-parse someone with better gear.

Maintaining a perfect rotation in a "real" situation (in raid) will be even more trickier. Only experienced players who know an encounter perfectly well can maintain a high DPS.

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No matter how overly complicated you want to go out of your way to make it sound, there is not currently, nor will there ever be, anything difficult about clicking a series of buttons in a specific pattern with a mouse as fast as possible. The simple fact of the matter is, that is just repetition. Anyone can do it and in systems set up for it, it never changes.

You can claim your Elite status all you want, but I'll take actual Strategic combat over Mindless Repetitive Rapid Clicking any day.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

blablabla

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Stay bad, keep spamming :D

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Originally Posted by Laughlyn

Say hello to Klaus, Dargoth.

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I think someone's confused pretty badly.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

No matter how overly complicated you want to go out of your way to make it sound, there is not currently, nor will there ever be, anything difficult about clicking a series of buttons in a specific pattern with a mouse as fast as possible. The simple fact of the matter is, that is just repetition. Anyone can do it and in systems set up for it, it never changes.

You can claim your Elite status all you want, but I'll take actual Strategic combat over Mindless Repetitive Rapid Clicking any day.

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I'm having trouble believing that you read her post at all with that response. She just said that the rotation is what you do whilst spamming. Yes, within a couple weeks at most of playing a game, clicking the next button within a single global cooldown is going to be cake, no matter the distance between them. (Not that you'd have to use mouse for this...) Her point was the strategy and the arrangement of those immediately accessible elements is what makes the difference, and that the difference is often larger as those skills become more accessible, rather than being restricted by long cooldowns. In other words, the more choice, the less restriction, the large skill-gaps will often be, as long as the types and functions of abilities are at all diverse.

When you're restricted by XI-length cooldowns, there's not going to be much difference between players of the same gear, because their rotations are essentially clicking off CDs as they pop back up, with little prioritization in a long fight because there's little overlap. In those cases, the gap is usually shrunk, or it's based off a very small amount of crucial decisions -- stuff like saving every Howling Fist for Blindside, or using Keen Flurry on HF vs. something else, saving the HF for the Blindside line-up when using FoF. These decisions can make differences, but there are usually too few of them, or they entirely independent of the fight itself, and in either case they have enough reaction time that the speed of the player's decision-making isn't much of a factor. The result being, again, a smaller skill (read: result) gap.

Personally I do hope that battles don't become a TP move spamfest, hopefully cooldowns will remain limiting enough and TP regeneration will be low enough to prevent people just mashing their skills but fast enough to give tactical advantages at the start of a fight and slow enough to have diminishing returns on longer and multiple battles.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

Personally I do hope that battles don't become a TP move spamfest, hopefully cooldowns will remain limiting enough and TP regeneration will be low enough to prevent people just mashing their skills but fast enough to give tactical advantages at the start of a fight and slow enough to have diminishing returns on longer and multiple battles.

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In which case it works like the stamina bar, but larger and probably without any of the early mechanics involving timing (between high and low stamina). Hmm... I need more text-emotes for these situations.

It really does come off as a "Stamina"ish type of play doesn't it? It's funny how many people are singing it's praises under a different guise.