Raiding in The Arcadion: Our Heroic Hypocrisy

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Originally Posted by Striker44

Doesn't the WoL initially object, and then only agrees to fight on the condition that the souls used to help him in each fight are then freed if he wins?

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Metem insists that it would be unfair for the WoL to fight without anything to balance the scales against people who can use feral souls. He mentions they have souls of former champions in storage and they will use them to create allies for us. He says they will draw upon our memories for it so they will be compatible working with us. We're unconvinced and have two choices:
- That sounds a lot like the Endless
- Like the arcane manifestation of Gulool Ja Ja...

Metem in my screenshots say for the purposes of evening the odds that seven simulacra should suffice but I can't remember which option I chose that led to that. I want to say it was the arcane manifestation option.

We get two choices again
- Using souls for entertainment is wrong
- The souls in your repository should be set free

The one I chose that using souls for entertainment was wrong.

He says he expected we would harbor reseverations about the use of souls because those outside the barrier usually do. That's when he sweetens the pot and says if we win the souls that fought with us will be free. He says we will be the star who brings fresh change to the Arcadion. At that point, we agree to fight under the terms.

It should also be noted that when Metem meets you on the street he mentions that opening the Arcadion is meant to help give the people of Solution Nine something to help them forget their cares after losing Sphene by giving them something new. And that something new is the "people's protector" competing for their entertainment.

So it's kind of masterful how well he hit our key WoL points. We help make people happy, we get to fight, and we're working to free captured souls who fight with us and potentially help enact change about souls being used for entertainment by leading by example.

The whole Arcadion plot contradict the msq. "using a beast soul too much kills you"...

Meanwhile in the msq the queen explicitly explain that the regulators take care of that problem and purify the souls.
A much as she lies, that is the one thing that doesn't makes sense. She does care about her subjects, she should know ; either because victims never because endless or simply because it's been eons and she never saw one alive or dead again.
They can't really pulls a "the owner was the super-admin more powerful with all the secrets"

Another plot hole : every player in your team are dead, and their characters should be deleted at the end of the raid serie. That or they already harvested all the souls of WoLs across the multiverse.

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Originally Posted by Calysto

Another plot hole : every player in your team are dead, and their characters should be deleted at the end of the raid serie. That or they already harvested all the souls of WoLs across the multiverse.

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These are just former champions from before the whole beast soul stuff.
They aren’t WoL’s just talented fighters.
I don’t see how that is a plot hole or I completely misunderstand your point.

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Originally Posted by Chasingstars

The reason the warrior of light takes issue with it is its more spelled out in japanese.

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Doesn't really change the connotations of what's going on.

Aetherial conductivity is just one step of each relic line. In ARR relic, that's like the soulglazing step. The process for making them is far more involved than spirit bonding, and it is not the same process. The purpose of increasing the weapon's conductivity is so it is more likely to absorb souls. And as established already, even if we peddle that back to just being aether of the soul, there are steps in the relic process that require the sacrifice of people(beastmen) body and soul. No way around it.

Also there's nothing conclusive on the, "Why" it's wrong. Just that the Warrior of Light is saying that it's wrong.

Like there's been nothing conclusive in our narrative that means that a person's memories are always lost when they go back to the aetherial sea. If anything, there are more examples of people retaining their memories.

And, there's a big thing in Flooded or Rejoined Shards where they lose their own aetherial sea. In a Flooded Shard it's due to the very aether of the sea taking on an extreme property of the dominant aether (The 13th is our only actual example, since 1st's sea still intact due to flood being stopped). In a Rejoined shard it's because that sea has merged with The Source. As far as we know, Alexandria lost access to their aetherial sea when their shard was beset by Lindblum's WMD. So that hasn't been a factor of life for them for hundreds of years at a minimum (thousands if you buy into it's the 12th theories).

So we've got the WoL of The Source, a world that's a little more than half way back to its natural state, telling denizens of a Shard that their way of life is wrong because it's not natural. Once again devaluing Shard life, as seems to be the case with every storyline involving them.

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Originally Posted by ClayyLmao

Would you call a man who hunts to feed his family a hypocrite for being against people who hunt for sport and leave the meat to rot?

My WoL isn't being hypocritical. She isn't betraying her own morals. She's used aether in the past to prepare herself to save the world, not to have people soyjak at her in a colosseum for glory.

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This analogy doesn't quite land, because the analogous parts don't line up.

Your WoL in your head isn't the WoL on screen. The WoL has made relic weapons involving the consumption of souls as established earlier in the thread, and the aforementioned tea kettle as well. They are a hunter that does both of the things you tried to compare.

This doesn't really make sense. If your entire argument hinges on optional content, there is no "our hypocrisy". It's just yours. So a topic title adjustment seems appropriate here.

Secondly, there is hypocrisy in the raid story but it's moreso surrounding the apparent disgust at taking the WoL's soul. Isn't that kinda what their whole society is predicated around? Not just people who die of natural causes, but people who are killed by their army. This is kind of like feeling better about eating cow meat because didn't personally kill it. But that's not what Black Cat says, she's just weirdly being hypocritical.

Not that it matters because the raid itself is optional content. So ultimately I'm not sure what the purpose of the topic is. "You might be a hypocrite"??

But that's to be expected when your agenda is absolving everyone in the story except the protagonists.

I also don't have a strong recollection of relic quests but hunting beasts or otherwise antagonistic forces is false equivalency to something like plundering entire worlds of innocent people.

WoL, approaching a lvl 30 something Hoplomachus carrying an unfinished Zodiac Weapon:

I NEED YOUR SOUL

*Proceeds to murder the poor man*



We do be sounding like Black Cat's big sis xD

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

False equivalence. Those are part of the imperial legion, not just random innocent people. It's a group trying to capture all Eorzea against their will.

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...It's just a mindless joke that popped up in my mind while reading OP's post I aint arguing with y'all. It doesnt have ti make sense. But do continue your guys discussion it's actually engaging to read all you peoples thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by Mnemy

...It's just a mindless joke that popped up in my mind while reading OP's post I aint arguing with y'all. It doesnt have ti make sense. But do continue your guys discussion it's actually engaging to read all you peoples thoughts on this

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That's fair, I can't tell if the topic is serious tbh.

I'm mostly always serious. Not mad or nothin' Just pointing out contradictions/hypocrisy in the story where I see it.

*sips tea out of soul powered tea kettle*