This has got to be one of the worst mmorpg community to exist

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by strawberrycake

Eden Tier 2, Casually was lvling my SCH, told a guy about how they should use rampart and TBN during pulls, said it in the nicest way possible as the 3 mobs per pack were nuking them, literally. I was a tank main that tier and was oh snap neat a new DRK, and their BRD friend got so pissy with me, I dropped it cuz I just laugh at white knights like that and got a warning from a gm. I have no reason to lie if I was nice or not as I have zero problems telling people their idiots in this game, but that situation really made me not wanna help a lot of new players when I saw em after that.

---

Why do I get the feeling it wasn't "in the nicest way possible"?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boblawblah

Why do I get the feeling it wasn't "in the nicest way possible"?

---

Because XIV players love to look at any situation where the person on the receiving end of advice isn't toxic and creates a narrative that all sprouts are benevolent beings that can do no wrong.They also love to act like the people who are GMs always do their jobs right when we have several or more posts on these said forums proving they screw up just like anyone else and make bad calls. That being said if you'd like to uphold that narrative and act like I am in fact a bad actor you're more then welcome to. No skin off my nose.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Boblawblah

Why do I get the feeling it wasn't "in the nicest way possible"?

---

If you look at the TalesfromDF subreddit a person can give the plainest advice and the person on the receiving end will become a shrieking pissbaby. It's good entertainment for me at least.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mosha

If you look at the TalesfromDF subreddit a person can give the plainest advice and the person on the receiving end will become a shrieking pissbaby. It's good entertainment for me at least.

---

I have no doubt that people have reacted poorly to advice, even kind advice, but I'm willing to be it's very rare, and most instances of people giving advice, either is pointless ("please heal", "take aggro") or needlessly aggressive. I've had many tanks not turn on tank stance, and a single "stance? :)" has never had someone go off on me. That said, I also don't bother chatting with teammates that are obviously a bit on edge, because I read the room and realize there's no point, they're not looking for advice. Just finish the instance and move on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mosha

If you look at the TalesfromDF subreddit a person can give the plainest advice and the person on the receiving end will become a shrieking pissbaby. It's good entertainment for me at least.

---

This gave me flash backs to when I got told I was toxic for asking someone to politely use their job stone once.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by strawberrycake

Because XIV players love to look at any situation where the person on the receiving end of advice isn't toxic and creates a narrative that all sprouts are benevolent beings that can do no wrong.

---

I really don't believe that sprouts are trying to be toxic. They are new; the world is confusing to them and they don't necessarily play to be "good" but to enjoy the story (for example, some youtubers will go through the MSQ then move onto the next FF game).

What is important to understand is that they don't know you. You are a stranger to them. They don't know your advice is well-intentioned, so their default assumption is going to be that you're being rude. Especially if it's the very first thing you say to them and you blurt it out, bereft of context.

If the first things you said to them were introducing yourself and talking about the meaning of life while waiting for the healer to get back from AFK, maybe they'd trust you, but if the first thing you say is "use this, use that", barking orders at them, it's not a good first impression. And that is how most people do it in my experience, unfortunately.

Quote:

---

They also love to act like the people who are GMs always do their jobs right when we have several or more posts on these said forums proving they screw up just like anyone else and make bad calls.

---

Well even the time there was 100 page forum post over PF, the fact is that it was the result of a player reporting those PFs and they generally act on reports, which explains why it was inconsistent. If it's not reported they don't actually do anything about it. So it wasn't quite an error by the GM but rather that players demanded a bit of an internal policy shift. Most likely they had not had someone report PFs much before.

That said, GMs do have to act on a degree of interpretation of their rules and guidelines and the situation, which might not always come out the same.

Quote:

---

That being said if you'd like to uphold that narrative and act like I am in fact a bad actor you're more then welcome to.

---

I don't think most people giving the advice are trying to be a bad actor, it's just that giving the advice in the first place is often not going to work out, because it comes across as blurting it out to a stranger and this first impression acts as a confirmation bias; confirmation of their fear that someone in the dungeon will be toxic.

You basically have to find a way to dispel that fear before blurting out advice and that's difficult to do while fighting enemies, so unless someone goes AFK or stops to chat, it often doesn't work out very well to give advice.

Was on twitter (Or X if ya nasty) a while back, stated only play XIV for the story and had like, 30 notifications in 30 mins all about XIV....or how "You doing it wrong."

The whites knights came in heeeeeeeeeavy..........
https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/.../tangled-1.jpg

Bronsexuals are not that bad........Thought it was them at first as a sports fan because they are obsessed with their king. Was like, "Yeah.... 100% ONLY playing for the story now lol"

Justified.......Cry me a river why don't you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=CIk45fEWBok

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I really don't believe that sprouts are trying to be toxic. They are new; the world is confusing to them; they don't necessarily play to be "good" but to enjoy the story (for example, some youtubers will go through the MSQ then move onto the next FF game).

What is important to understand is that they don't know you. You are a stranger to them. They don't know your advice is well-intentioned, so their default assumption is going to be that you're being rude. Especially if it's the very first thing you say to them and you blurt it out, bereft of context.

If the first things you said to them were introducing yourself and talking about the meaning of life while waiting for the healer to get back from AFK, maybe they'd trust you, but if the first thing you say is "use this, use that", barking orders at them, it's not a good first impression. And that is how most people do it in my experience, unfortunately.

---

The run started fairly cold as neither the tank or the BRD said hi when my friend and I did, half way through after noticing how much damage they were taking, I then was like *hey, i know you're new, I'm a main tank for the tier and I know a lot of this possibly seems scary, so I wanna give you some small advice as some healers can be asshats about this type of stuff, you should always use a CD. like rampart, shadow wall, or TBN. The BRD instantly told me to shut up and just heal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I don't think most people giving the advice are trying to be a bad actor, it's just that giving the advice in the first place is often not going to work out, because it comes across as blurting it out to a stranger and this first impression acts as a confirmation bias; confirmation of their fear that someone in the dungeon will be toxic.

You basically have to find a way to dispel that confirmation bias before blurting out advice and that's difficult to do while fighting enemies, so unless someone goes AFK or stops to chat, it often doesn't work out very well to give advice.

---

It's why I alsy try to introduce myslef in runs and give the advice if I see someone seriously struggling and it usually goes well. But sadly there are the people who will see it as you being agressive and or antagonistic. ANd for me it's like, I know how hard MMOs can be, I just wanna give people the same grace I got when I was a kid playing on their big brothers account trying to lvl xD

Lmao what a thread.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by strawberrycake

Eden Tier 2, Casually was lvling my SCH, told a guy about how they should use rampart and TBN during pulls, said it in the nicest way possible as the 3 mobs per pack were nuking them, literally. I was a tank main that tier and was oh snap neat a new DRK, and their BRD friend got so pissy with me, I dropped it cuz I just laugh at white knights like that and got a warning from a gm. I have no reason to lie if I was nice or not as I have zero problems telling people their idiots in this game, but that situation really made me not wanna help a lot of new players when I saw em after that.

---

This is why I would never offer advice no matter how bad a player is playing until they f*** up real bad and cause a disasterrific wipe. At that point I'd make sure to let it be known that I can offer some help to rectify their mistake. The wipe serves as a 'slap on hand' by the game for playing terribly---when done, I find that people tend to be more receptive to advice because they knew 3-7 other pair of eyes are on them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by strawberrycake

The run started fairly cold as neither the tank or the BRD said hi when my friend and I did, half way through after noticing how much damage they were taking, I then was like *hey, i know you're new, I'm a main tank for the tier and I know a lot of this possibly seems scary, so I wanna give you some small advice as some healers can be asshats about this type of stuff, you should always use a CD. like rampart, shadow wall, or TBN. The BRD instantly told me to shut up and just heal.

---

I see, looks like you really tried with breaking the ice there.

How I personally handle it is to let them make all the mistakes they want to make and learn from them. After all, they're only going to get the "died to that mechanic" experience once probably, then they'll know it and be able to recall that time they died to it when reminiscing. I also tend to think that if someone really wants to know all the mechanics ahead of time they'll either lookup a video guide or do it with duty support.

In rare cases, if they ask for help then I answer it or if we really can't progress then I explain the mechanic in a general way, with the phrasing "you can achieve X by doing Y" or "X can be done by doing Y" and I don't even say who I'm talking to, so it keeps it very generic as if I'm writing a book. Since it's phrased as "can", it's informal and not demanding that they actually do it.

I actually always did that before the rules were clarified but now they got really specific about how things "should be phrased as a suggestion rather than a demand" and what I do already follows that.