Paladin needs to be overhauled

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Originally Posted by Curisu

Once I accidentally queued in as PLD for CC.
Use the little time at the beginning to putt skills in my hotbar and read them while moving.

I hard stomped and carried that run.
No one was able to kill me while I was chasing down 2, 3 enemy's and dashed back to support my team.

I could not score many kills but my team was alive and could finish them on.
Was surprised about how good PLD is and understood now why it is so annoying to play against one.
Queued in a few more time as it and won the games easily.

PLD is fun to play and far from weak in low-mid rankings.

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Was this before or after you rescued a basket of kittens from a burning building?.......I joke, while i might be open minded into possibly believing your story im extremely skeptical but either congrats I think

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Ok for starters, please just edit your post and add additional quotes + comments. This circumvents the 3000 character limit from the initial post and condenses everything in one comment.

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tried didnt work for me, but The reason i took it into segments individually is because there sees to be a retention or cognitive dissonance issue with some of not only your responses but others as well which i will illuminate for you,also i dont enjoy doing it this way it limits me in the forum

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I believe you misunderstood what I am saying. I never said they are mutually exclusive - I said that if your teammate is the one running away while you already used cover (and hopefully used a macro for it with "Covering <teammate>!" in it) then you did your part, Cover in what the ability is supposed to be did its part and your teammate is the one being the issue.

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A skill that becomes ineffective/effective based on the RNG skillset/awareness of another is by its very nature is useless, what good is cover if the 10y tether is broken in the 1st second of activation that doesn't utilize its intended purpose ? what other skill or class has two draw backs with one gain? the response only you have is this same one, how does that help PLD?

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I never said anything about sticking around with a teammate who is clearly overextending. If they dive a backline alone and get gobbled up by four teammates or decide to not retreat in a 2v4/2v5 scenario with you, shame on them because you shouldn't Cover that and rather run to ensure your LB charges up.

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you can admit this scenario happens but not the plethora of others that render cover useless

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

before you assume and lecture me about situations with Cover and how animations about it may pan out, I actually play Paladin along with Dark Knight as my main jobs in PvP. The dash animation lock isn't so utterly damning as you make it out to be. For an ability of this caliber to give your teammate a second chance in life, the short wind-up is fair. I simply got used to it by reacting earlier rather than later.

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I think you should play PLD more because if you truly "main" it you'd have the forethought to recognize these scenarios with your responses, but you find cover not as troubling which is subjective so ill leave it at that.

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

I am glad you made it sure you know, but frankly I will have to repeat certain things since you can't talk about Cover one-dimensionally since it is a synergy-based ability.
1.) Once again, your teammates have skill issues. If your covered teammate insists on running away, that's on them not you.
2.) This isn't PvE, Paladin DPS doesn't matter as much as you want it does and a DPS loss by using Guardian-Guard is smaller than a DPS loss from either you or your teammate dying because that costs your team 15s+ LB charge time + about 20s or more of damage downtime from one player over 5s you not dpsing. If you care this much about your damage, you should give Dark Knight or Gunbreaker a serious consideration.
3.) Correct, this one is match-up dependent, though I kind of expected to not having to mention it.

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not sure what your trying to make with the PVE remark, but you seem to misunderstand when i say dps loss im not referring to PLD individual dps (as i have stated multiple times thats not my concern despite it being a flaw) what im referring to is the total dps of the 4v5 scenario in which the guard + cover creates or 3v5 if your teammate is using an elixir, im not against this combination it is indeed useful in certain events few and far between as they are but to praise it or put it on a pedestal is ridiculous

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

About intended/perfect play - I am sorry to tell you this, but looking at any abilities through the scope of the average player or the lowest common denominator is generally bad practice at job balancing. Just because your region may have a surplus of such players does not mean you should balance abilities around them.

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You think this is a smart or healthy model for success of a job let alone PVP in general to balance a skillset on select few rather than the general/casual player base? but yet you'll use average player for upcoming arguments

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Also no offense, "I am not even going to get into the fact that cover can't be used in 1v1" yeah no, this is like complaining SCH damage is low in 1v1 because you can't spread dots or damage buffs. Certain jobs are not made for 1v1.

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Despite PLD being able to solo kill or 1v1 prior to 6.1 with cover included, this is an a strange response but again not gonna push into 1v1 too much

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

Hallowed also had +30s/+60s(pre-buff) the cooldown of Guard, Cover had a +20% dmg taken if they attacked you directly and there was no Elixir your teammate could make use of in the cover time. Also your own life tended to be relatively important as a medal carrier, particularly when Heavy Medal debuff was still around. You also were constantly duking it out as the objective were the players themselves in rather small arenas, so the mobility wasn't as great as you'd try to tell me.

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theres a bit to unpack here
1 teammates still had pots before 6.1 plus bloodbath for melee
2 cover has great mobility with guard (even tho this skill by its nature is a liability for mobility) but cover + HG isnt great because of........reasons?
3 youre "duking it out" regardless i dont know wut this point was even for
4 im pretty sure the debuff was removed in between or before shb patches not sure why this was brought up

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Originally Posted by Reinhardt_Azureheim

"Gatekeep PLD as the sacrificial lamb" - ...what? Your job design with Cover in it literally is using your own life to protect another. If you get chain stunned from Covering a teammate, you saved a teammate and wasted a team a ton of stuns. You could also use Purify along with it so you WOULDN'T get chain stunned. And if you get stunned without Cover during Phalanx... then I am sorry, but you baiting those stuns is like the greatest W a tank in any game could hope for. Do you have any idea how many people might be thankful that they hit you and not them?

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You think thats healthy for the Job let alone the player, to have the job designed around this function? also using purify during a chain stunn why didnt i think of that i bet theres no myriad of scenarios or issues or skills that prevent purify prior to or during this scenario , thanks for this advice it never occurred to me, also i can tell you not many are as thankful as youre pretending it to be this is PVP we're talking about i dont know what gentlemenly matches youve been in but they are far out numbered by the reality of the response that is met when you die from a chain stun after LB was wasted or cover