Is the WoL actually good though?

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Originally Posted by OhNooo

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That sounds more like Elidibus' approach to being the Warrior of Light. That's why even Emet came out in the end to help put his broken companion, bereft of mind and memory, to rest.

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Originally Posted by Dikatis

The quest is the Level 63 quest, "The Widow and her Love". The context is that Myste drags the WoL into finding someone he can help with his simulacrums, holding WoL's aether hostage (though admittedly by accident). He settles on Lowdy, the waitress who drugged the WoL back at Aymeric's first attempt to broker a peace conference between man and dragon. Her proctor is overzealous and hellbent on torturing her, filling her every day with misery and scorn, rather than allowing her to atone and serve out her sentence as decreed by the courts. Seeing this, WoL goes up to the proctor and asks him to tone it down. The proctor, so blinded by faith and apparently oblivious to the fact that this "concerned adventurer" is the Savior of Ishgard, draws his sword, forcing WoL to defend themselves and ultimately killing the guy.

It's not, "we goaded him to fight just to have an excuse to kill him" like Kizuya said it is.

The exact exchange:




We don't know what happened to her either, but there's no indication that she had any intent of fleeing, especially when it's mentioned that her guilt was more painful to her than even the proctor's punishments and fantasies of murdering her himself. We also know that WoL has forgiven her enough to not want to hurt her despite what she did to them.

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So what you're saying is that someone blatantly misrepresented a DRK quest in an attempt to portray it as the edgelord class they wish it was? I wish I could say I was shocked.

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Originally Posted by Dikatis

This is a real nothingburger of a take when there's plenty of things the WoL does of their own volition solely because they want to.
The Bard and Dancer questlines are kicked off not because someone asked them to be better at kicking ass but because they're genuinely interested in learning to sing and dance. There's nothing requiring them to participate in the restoration of the Firmament, but they do it and become the top Skybuilder, donating huge amounts of furniture and materials for the restoration of Ishgard following the Dragonsong War. They aren't forced to solve archaeological puzzles, make gifts for orphans, bankroll the Ala Mhigan widow and orphan fund, restore artifacts, act as a schoolteacher, swear a personal vendetta against disgusting Sharlayan bread rations, help the tribes, build airships, delve into the Palace of the Dead or Heaven on High, act as a romantic wingman and officiate a wedding, support conservationist efforts, or many, many other things they're never strong-armed into doing.
Hell, the Shadows of Mhach questline starts becaues WoL hears about sky pirates in the Sea of Clouds thinks, "Cool beans. I wanna meet this guy." and they do meet that guy who invites them to bring their pals to raid a ghost airship for no reason other than they want to.
WoL is not Superman, but they have agency and tend toward forgiveness, kindness, compassion, and generosity while preferring to help their fellow man more often than not. They wouldn't help the Garlean Empire and certainly not the Ascians because they wouldn't agree with their motives and methods.

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(IMO) WOL is just a weapon and a puppet that does whatever they're told by the group they are a member of. It just so happens that the group they are a part of are some sort of self-proclaimed liberators (IMO). It's not about good or bad (IMO).

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Originally Posted by Lyth

That sounds more like Elidibus' approach to being the Warrior of Light. That's why even Emet came out in the end to help put his broken companion, bereft of mind and memory, to rest.

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(IMO) WOL is just a weapon and a puppet that does whatever they're told by the group they are a member of. It just so happens that the group they are a part of are some sort of self-proclaimed liberators (IMO). It's not about good or bad (IMO).

Are you? You are the Warrior of Light; you should be asking that question in a mirror.

DRK is one of the best storylines. It shows that the WoL has self-awareness that they are not without stains from questionable actions. And boy-oh does it manifest directly.

I think there's other job quest storylines on par with it though.

Ninja's questline for instance has better NPCs with more character to them. DRK grips a lot of players though, because it echoes what a lot of people, feel.

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Originally Posted by OhNooo

(IMO) WOL is just a weapon and a puppet that does whatever they're told by the group they are a member of. It just so happens that the group they are a part of are some sort of self-proclaimed liberators (IMO). It's not about good or bad (IMO).

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Isn't this a take that you can have about any blank-slate protagonist in a video game with a linear story? Of course your character is a "puppet" following what the story says, you can't progress through the narrative otherwise. I think that should be understood as the nature of the medium, and not a literal character trait.

I do admire the fact that you're trying to reply in a direct, straightforward fashion, but I don't think that Kitzuya was actually looking for a serious response.

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

DRK is one of the best storylines. It shows that the WoL has self-awareness that they are not without stains from questionable actions. And boy-oh does it manifest directly.

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I don't see a specific 'moral' message implicit in the Dark Knight storyline.

Frey's storyline is about finding 'your voice'. You don't have to be the hero, but yet you still are. Why? Sidurgu's storyline is about understanding the basis of a Dark Knight's power in their emotions towards the people that they want to protect. Myste's storyline is about accepting the weight and the responsibility of your decisions while staying true to yourself.

The resolution and synthesis of all these storylines is simple enough. You are who you choose to be, now and always. Whatever reasons that you derive for your character's actions are yours and yours alone. Hence Frey's parting line: 'Was it ever mine...?'

What's perhaps more interesting is the fact that it's also a very early exploration of how memory transference works, except that you're not inheriting the spirit of a 12000 year old entity that overwhelms and overrides your personality.

The Warrior of Light is a sadistic monster.

Do you really think the WoL is dumb enough to keep letting enemies walk away? To do nothing while people die around them despite having the power to heal them? To prevent the damage from ever occurring?

Ha! No one could be that much of a complete imbecile.

No no my friend. The WoL enjoys watching his 'friends' and innocents suffer. To allow enemies to escape and inflict more suffering, just for the joy of fighting them. We are just like Zenos. Only we are smart enough to play the dumb hero role so we can get catgirl booty during downtime.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

I don't see a specific 'moral' message implicit in the Dark Knight storyline.

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I honestly don't know why you don't. The first thing you embrace upon rousing Fray's corpse is vigilante justice.

"The threshold we refuse to cross is a line we draw for ourselves. We fear the consequences, and people suffer for our indecision."

"Everyone who held that crystal came to conquer that fear, and became who they wanted to be. Will you be the next?"

The DRK quests up to 50 are about the WoL looking inside of themselves, and admitting that there is inner turmoil. Desires to be selfish. The self given view that the WoL is a king who sits on a throne of bones. A king of death. And it's really highlighted in the level 50 quest against yourself, Esteem, wherein Lord Drillemont and the other wards of House Durendaire not only come to your aid in battle, but seek to remind you that you are the hero they know and want you to be that sees the WoL overcome and accept their dark side.

The Sidurgu Moogle quests posit that the greater one's love for what they seek justice for or protect, the bigger their flame in the abyss. The brighter it shines, the longer shadows it casts, and therefore there is more darkness to draw power from. It's not that other ideals don't produce power, it's merely that love trumps every other one.

Myste's story is about casting judgment on others, something core to DRK's initial premise. Knowing that by casting judgment on others, usually means to kill them or harm them in pursuit of your own moral code. It's about accepting that you are not above judgment either, but self doubt is not judgment.

The overarching moral of DRK's storyline is that you shouldn't shy away from what feelings make you uncomfortable. Whether it's indignance, rage, love, or doubt. You should steel yourself, and embrace who you actually are. If you can accept yourself, then you can better serve others.

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Originally Posted by Necrotica

The Warrior of Light is a sadistic monster.

Do you really think the WoL is dumb enough to keep letting enemies walk away? To do nothing while people die around them despite having the power to heal them? To prevent the damage from ever occurring?

Ha! No one could be that much of a complete imbecile.

No no my friend. The WoL enjoys watching his 'friends' and innocents suffer. To allow enemies to escape and inflict more suffering, just for the joy of fighting them. We are just like Zenos. Only we are smart enough to play the dumb hero role so we can get catgirl booty during downtime.

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Who are we supposedly letting to just bleed out? Most of the time we let whatever non named and sometimes named cnj or other healer attend to the wounded while the WoL goes to deal with whomever or whatever is needed to be defeated to afford us a breather. Not everyone's WoL is a healer. It'd also be silly to have the WoL to stop and heal people while there's still fighting happening. There's also a difference between a person who has wounds that can be easily-ish healed vs some one who's so wounded that It'd be the equivalent of a doctor who's trying to save a patient that not only has a lot of internal bleeding and other injuries but also a major artery that's been severed. Where no amount of blood pumped into them will fix the problem due to their various wounds pumping it back out too fast.

The only person who irks me with how many times they were allowed to backstab us or escape and who I'm not sure when, where or how new players are introduced to due to their original quest being one that got cut out is Lourontius. The Wood Wailer who was giving the Garleans maps because in his mind the Wood Wailers didn't pay enough. We chase him all over the Southern Shroud and only get him put into custody by temporarily joining forces with the two poaching groups. And unless you want to pull a Minority Report being proactive in trying to stop the bad before it happens tends to not work. It also has a lot of chances to make situations worse.