Lazy Crafted Weapons & Lazy Garo Gear

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Originally Posted by kaynide

Not so much that it is anyone’s fault, but that the dev team essentially said “hey guys, you all have really been wanting these races, so we added them the best we could with time allocated to not neglect other critical parts of the expansion. It won’t have everything that core races do, but our dev team even went out of their way during unpaid overtime to add as many hats as they could”

Which was responded with “omg wtf guys this sucks”

So they added more as they could (including that awful Hroth hair) and got even more “wtf guys”.

At this point they really should just say “yeah nah, we will put time and effort into things most players can enjoy; we will put time into these niche things when we have time to…eventually”. As is, I am legit worried island sanctuary will be really half arsed because they keep wasting time trying to do too many things at once.

That is not to say these things should straight ignored. Ultimately, I really hope they just take a step back and devote an entire expansion packs worth of resources on just doing a TLC update and not try to tack things on half finished. No new jobs, maybe just do hardmode dungeons using existing assets etc.

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Uh, the playerbase wasn’t begging for hrothgar though. Hrothgar was an addition purely because Yoshi P wanted a beast race. If he wasn’t prepared to actually take time and resources to put towards them, he shouldn’t have added them in the first place. It was a selfish decision by him, and one he doesn’t seem to even stand behind as he doesn’t even play one.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Uh, the playerbase wasn’t begging for hrothgar though. Hrothgar was an addition purely because Yoshi P wanted a beast race. If he wasn’t prepared to actually take time and resources to put towards them, he shouldn’t have added them in the first place. It was a selfish decision by him, and one he doesn’t seem to even stand behind as he doesn’t even play one.

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Its not like ""he wasn’t prepared to actually take time and resources to put towards them"" its more like making a Playable Beastrace was possibly a bigger uptaking then intended. Plus the Viera were also being developed. A "gamble" I guess to try and satisfy the long-time request of We Want Viera (Proving once again the devs & team DOES listen and try) while also A Beast Race Option might be fun (I and others wanted a Beast Race)
And as mentioned at the time, this may be the last time they make any new playable races. So I dont believe its selfish at all to give the Loud Majority what they asked for, while also giving the Quiet Minority what they would want.

Besides, as its been echoed several times in this forum, especially in the Male Viera thread: More Options for the Player is Good.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Uh, the playerbase wasn’t begging for hrothgar though. Hrothgar was an addition purely because Yoshi P wanted a beast race.

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I can't say how many people were asking for beastlike playable races, but there were certainly some. I recall having written a few times that I didn't think it was possible because of the story's early emphasis on the divide between "men" and "beastmen" and I didn't think a playable race could get much more beastly than Au Ra and still be regarded on the socially acceptable (not to mention dialogue-indicated) side of that divide.

Honestly I still think Hrothgar are a mistake at that deep lore level, but – whether it was Yoshida's whim or a desire to cater to such requests – they did it, excused it in the lore as best they could, and they're not going to be removed from the game now.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Its not like ""he wasn’t prepared to actually take time and resources to put towards them"" its more like making a Playable Beastrace was possibly a bigger uptaking then intended. Plus the Viera were also being developed. A "gamble" I guess to try and satisfy the long-time request of We Want Viera (Proving once again the devs & team DOES listen and try) while also A Beast Race Option might be fun (I and others wanted a Beast Race)
And as mentioned at the time, this may be the last time they make any new playable races. So I dont believe its selfish at all to give the Loud Majority what they asked for, while also giving the Quiet Minority what they would want.

Besides, as its been echoed several times in this forum, especially in the Male Viera thread: More Options for the Player is Good.

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More options if it comes at a cost for others things isn’t always good. They know their resources, that’s part of the job. They should have simply done one race, and then the other at a later date. From what it seems and from what info i could find, i wonder if the main reason outside of yoshi p wanting a beast race was that he didn’t originally want a male viera. I believe at some point he said that would be “weird”(which i don’t really know why?) and that might be why else he added hrothgar. Either way though, again, part of the job is knowing what you can handle, and allocating time and resources accordingly. Considering the things we lost and how neglected both races have been, it was very clearly the wrong decision.Point still stands though, it wasn’t the players pressuring him for hrothgar. That was his decision because he wanted them.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I can't say how many people were asking for beastlike playable races, but there were certainly some. I recall having written a few times that I didn't think it was possible because of the story's early emphasis on the divide between "men" and "beastmen" and I didn't think a playable race could get much more beastly than Au Ra and still be regarded on the socially acceptable (not to mention dialogue-indicated) side of that divide.

Honestly I still think Hrothgar are a mistake at that deep lore level, but – whether it was Yoshida's whim or a desire to cater to such requests – they did it, excused it in the lore as best they could, and they're not going to be removed from the game now.

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Are people asking for them to be removed? O.o

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Are people asking for them to be removed? O.o

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If what I said can be construed as saying they should be removed from the game, then so can your statement which I think I was addressing before I trimmed down the quote to the core bit.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

If he wasn’t prepared to actually take time and resources to put towards them, he shouldn’t have added them in the first place.

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You don't think they should have been added without more work. I don't think they should have been added because they're lore-breaking. Either way they're here and they're not going away. That's all I said. Nothing about people asking for them to be removed.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I believe at some point he said that would be “weird”(which i don’t really know why?)

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Because people usually associate Viera with Fran, and we all know why and how she was conceived.

So when people started asking for a male version of what's essentially a magazine bunny, they probably didn't know how to address it. I mean, we're talking about the same company that had their female devs work on enabling some of the female-only gear to males, because the guys felt uncomfortable doing so.

Same thing when the Eternal Bond was first released. They had to frame it as a "bond of friendship" in order to justify same sex weddings.

I don't condone this, and I think it's great they are slowly opening up to the idea of being inclusive, but the company has had history of being a bit conservative with their choices.

I have to be 100% honest, the amount of modelswapped gear I saw when Endwalker released was a huge bummer. They've continually added less and less to the game every expansion, so seeing all that gear and only a couple of pieces being actually new rather than ripped from something that already exists bothers me. If I was cynical, I would say the reason they don't want to allow us to simply glam into anything we want, regardless of class is so they can rehash the same items over and over again into other classes so that we feel like we're getting something new when we aren't, and that we're stupid enough to believe half of what they give us is new. Maybe I'm cynical? I hope that isn't the reason, but I wish they'd just let us wear whatever we want anyway.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

If what I said can be construed as saying they should be removed from the game, then so can your statement which I think I was addressing before I trimmed down the quote to the core bit.



You don't think they should have been added without more work. I don't think they should have been added because they're lore-breaking. Either way they're here and they're not going away. That's all I said. Nothing about people asking for them to be removed.

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I wasn’t meaning you were saying that, i figured based on what you said you must have seen or heard people asking for them to be removed which is messed up. I don’t think they should have been added without more work, but since they’re here now i obviously wouldn’t ask for them to be removed. People are still playing them, i just think the devs need to be more weary about where they’re reallocating resources. Either way this has derailed a bit, but yeah, it’s a shame we haven’t gotten as many weapon and glam designs as we have in the past. Honestly i don’t know how much hrothgar is to blame, as in a whole 3 years they only got 6 new hairstyles and they got them with the ears cut off so it’s not like they had to work around them.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Uh, the playerbase wasn’t begging for hrothgar though. Hrothgar was an addition purely because Yoshi P wanted a beast race. If he wasn’t prepared to actually take time and resources to put towards them, he shouldn’t have added them in the first place. It was a selfish decision by him, and one he doesn’t seem to even stand behind as he doesn’t even play one.

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I distinctly remember people asking for both Viera and Ronso as playable races; not necessarily in equal measure, but it's always been a thing. YoshiP's decision to do Hrothgar was likely a mix of that and a reaction to the disappointment some players felt in the Au Ra not being MORE bestial in nature (people were expecting something more like a Lizardman or Draconian.. like the Bangaa of FFT)

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Originally Posted by Raskbuck

Because people usually associate Viera with Fran, and we all know why and how she was conceived.

So when people started asking for a male version of what's essentially a magazine bunny, they probably didn't know how to address it.

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Fair, but they did go through the EXACT same thing with Female-only Miqote and Male only Roes in 1.0 (and in FF11). They even made a big deal about NOT making single-sex races at that time, so it was odd that they did it again in 5.0. So, yes- would have been better to add 1 sex and 1 race at a time, then add the other later (like they did with only male Viera), so it's fair to say they've learned from their mistake...late as that lesson may be.