Um smn/blm was a God as was smn/rdm I used it alot..Quote:
Originally Posted by Floortank
But um like I said no every job needs to hand held.. they got enough 2 braincell stuff tike to start upgrading things to high high complexiy
-
02-09-2021, 12:43 PMAncientWillow
-
02-09-2021, 01:45 PMMikkoAkureSMN is clunky, not complex. There’s a difference. I’m not looking for SE to “dumb the job down”. I’m looking for gameplay that is smoother and less awkward than it is now. It feels like the pet actions and the rest of the job are completely separate things.Quote:
Originally Posted by AncientWillow
The pet itself disappears for half of the rotation and I’m not sure why people are so attached to it. One of the pets from the very beginning of ARR has been near useless except for solo content. YoshiP has also said for a long while that we would be getting new pet glamours as well and that never happened. It’s time to pull the plug on the pet class experiment and do something new. MCH made it through the change and is finally a popular class so SMN can and should do the same.
Ideas could be like making Carbuncle and the egis timed summons that do their thing and leave. Make Titan an AoE party defense boost. Make physick scale off INT like vercure and separate SCH completely from ACN.
Just because other games have pets doesn’t mean it’s something that works with FFXIV. FFXI, WoW, and FFXIV are different games with different styles and different systems. -
02-09-2021, 02:23 PMDuskane
imagine if we still had grease lightning and clicking form shift 20+ time during intermediate and Advance relativity
-
02-09-2021, 03:18 PMShougun
As long as SE continues to emphasize the grand nature of summoner I think I'll be pretty happy. It's nice to see people enjoy the demi concept so much that some people want it to be the whole job. Quite a change from long ago when people would be like "egi is fine" lol.
I would love for SE to make the rest of the job primal infused, and then also upgrade the egi presence if possible (like level 15 titan egi sure cute, level 60.. kind of.. underwhelming). Yes I know SMN doesn't start at 15 lol. I'd actually be okay if they made SMN it's own job, not that I want the entire gameplay loop concept to change.. just not have think about what was before and make what feels right instead. Whatever that might be. Like our other new jobs, I feel benefit from being able to just come out the door without a class.
Infusing for example would be making SMN cure unique by giving it a carbuncle aspect (since carbuncle has been known to heal), or making raise relate to phoenix. I've also a personal hope they can get more variety of summons into the job without just leaping to "glamour". I'm not in love with the idea that Shiva = Ifrit = Titan = Carby, I would like for each summon to do what you would expect it to do. But I wouldn't say no to glamour over no glamour and no egi upgrade. Alternatively for the glamour perhaps adding more classic summons to the job as actual content (shiva, levi, odin, etc) but then the cool but not as common summons as alternative glamours. So like Sephirot can be glamour for Titan.
The original Summoner actually played quite well, but just didn't really hold a candle to any of the other FFs. We're approaching that well with demi, but now there are some edges that need polished and people who suggest we just go full grand or whatever. I'm okay if they did that, but I just get worried if gameplay changes so much people hate their favorite job.
So... MORE summon related content = good. Vast majority, if not the whole job relating to summons in some way = awesome (doesn't require, to me, a destruction of the gameplay loop). Grand feast that makes other MMO's summon jobs look silly = Amazing. FFXIV's demi add some competition to the other MMOs but I still feel they've room to improve to 'soundly' beat the competition, both visually and thematically mechanically (say like WoW's pets are a bit more stronger in their mechanical differences, they stand out a bit more imo- or Aion's spiritmaster's version of egi would obviously be better looking).
Hope everyone get's the summoner they want this coming expansion. I don't feel particularly worried since each expansion since HW has took another step to the grand and primal strictly, but it's exciting to think about how far they'll go. Good luck everyone :) -
02-09-2021, 03:38 PMHeulGDarianOh hi shougun how you doing? long time no see. As you can see its been nearly 2 years and this subject is still ongoing :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Shougun
Smn is more popular than current mch check this https://ffxivcensus.comQuote:
Originally Posted by MikkoAkure
-
02-09-2021, 04:09 PMShougunQuote:
Originally Posted by HeulGDarian
You, you get an upvote lol. Hi HeulGDarian :)
Excited or scared for summoner? Not particularly worried, hope no one hates their job after update though. So best of wishes to everyone lol :D -
02-09-2021, 04:11 PMOrmolt
If there's no drastic overhaul to this job at 6.0 (every other expansion has been pretty drastic, as everyone no doubt knows!), there are a couple of SMN specific things that I hope are improved.
I love pet classes but pet classes also need to address their pet specific hiccups. I don't *think* I should have to actively monitor my battle log and floating text to see if an attack animation actually went off because pet actions ghost, for example. I've never felt I need to do this on other jobs in this game, at least.
There's also the well documented inconsistency in demi-Phoenix's casts around its initial use of Everlasting Flight too which makes it needlessly fiddly.
Of course, these comments are all dependent on the job feeling similar to 80 at 90 - who knows what's planned! -
02-09-2021, 09:52 PMJirahAnd theirs my que, all this “MCH revamp” crap wasn’t even a revamp and I’m starting to get annoyed by everyone recommending every job to do what they did with MCH. MNK, BRD, NIN, what have you.Quote:
Originally Posted by MikkoAkure
MCH did not improve in SHB it got the “accessibility touch” and made it until a absurdly easy and bloated job with no structure. Take the turrets for example, people nagged about the turrets being token and inconsequential and they solved this by making it even rarer and having even less to do with the main rotation and removing its AOE, Debuffing and explosive capabilities to be more accessible.
Agree or disagree idc, but for the love of god not every job needs a “MCH style revamp” we don’t need the jobs to be filed down to single button prompts -
02-09-2021, 10:35 PMMikkoAkureAnyone who thinks MCH, BRD, NIN, and MNK were in a better place pre-revamp is delusional. People point to MCH because it was a job created around an un-fun mechanic that instead of being fixed, received another mechanic that required awkward messing around with the rotation and cutting off flamethrower mid-use to take full advantage of.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jirah
Like I said before, the devs are not fans of pets. I don’t know why anyone at all would expect MCH turrets to be expanded on in Shadowbringers, regardless of player nagging, when SCH and SMN had their pets also reworked into being more inconsequential. Yeah, I miss bishop turret, and all the turret abilities we had before. I don’t miss having to place my turrets every single pull though. And like SMN now, turrets had nothing at all to do with the rest of the job and were tacked on.
I’ve been here since 1.0 beta and been through all of the changes of the game, some good, some bad. But SMN has had an identity crisis when it was first made and still to this day hasn’t been addressed. They’re a DoT mage, still with legacy skills that made more sense when they were below 30 as a DPS/healer hybrid, with pets that have a handful of actions - 2 of those being on really long CDs, and then 3 timed stances. None of that really meshes together.
Egi aren’t fun to use. The egi abilities are on GCD now so they can’t be weaved. The egi has a little bit of lag too so you can’t just mash it’s buttons. It’s awkward, like SMN has always been, and should be changed. -
02-09-2021, 10:58 PMAomine1992This^^Quote:
Originally Posted by MikkoAkure
Lol MCH was dreadful pre SHb, that tight window you get for burst and then to sit and do nothing but wait on the rng combo to proc while trying to reload....
MNK was just too punishing almost all your good skills had a really bad draw back which leads into losing GL, and Anataman in the opener at the starting of the expansion was trash and depended on server ticks. MNK has a long way to go but it’s way better then what it was.
SMN 5.0 was a huge indicator that the egi system is seriously flawed, double and triple weaving egi assaults and not getting Ruin IV price because your dumb pet skipped an assault. Aetherpact is always freaking delayed and used to cut into your Phoenix phase and still kind of do. The egi brough nothing but problems and still does. SMN is trying to be too many things at once, poison mage/pet tamer and then shift to Summoner/Evoker which is why caster balance is always off because summoner is the problem and has been since SB and it’s because they can’t fix the pets, they’ve had years to do so and haven’t.