Wow. I normaly don't like speed runs and a lot of the time it's the tank who goes and does it. Then dies cause they didn't pop their CDs properly and stood in every aoe while I used everything I could and the kitchen sink. A lot of the time doing so without asking or not giving enough time to respond. and i'm talking about the type of speed runs where it's pull everything from the start to the 1st boss and then repeat in between bosses if the dungeons allow it. So I highly doubt that's an accurate statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Doki
I'm a level 67 paladin... Who does not know how to tank.
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10-13-2018, 05:47 AMSannaR
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10-13-2018, 05:49 AMFynlarQuote:
I never use that ranged shield attack and I never use that weak-butt rotation that increases enmity. I've gone this far without them and I prefer to keep it that way.
Then yeah, I'd agree with the bolded assessment in your OP.
You seem like you're just looking for validation and aren't actually open to improving yourself, so I'll spare myself from making any further commentary.
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I hold aggro 90% of the time. You're saying it's not enough?
Like I said, I've gotten COMMENDATIONS as a tank.
90% is really bad, yeah. And commendations honestly mean nothing. Lots of people automatically commend tanks/healers even if their performance was just mediocre
That's pretty strange, I do switch for bosses when the group is competent, and I have not once had anyone comment. I honestly don't think many of them even noticed.Quote:
Leveling a PLD currently, the amount of flag I have gotten for switching to Sword for bosses is amazing. It is like every second dungeon run the healer -while not contributing any damage- will show an amazing APM typing something along the lines of "Shouldn't you be in Shield Oath?" the second I turn blue. I am at a point where I just politely excuse myself that my tanking style doesn't fit the Healers comfort zone and leave the dungeon. Really no need for that kind of discussions anymore.
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10-13-2018, 05:51 AMBright-FlowerWhen I tank (which is almost always) I like to do this little thing called 'ask the healer' before I do big pulls. I like doing them, but if the healer doesn't want to do them for whatever reason, I slow down. It irks me a bit when I queue as a dps or healer and a tank just runs off without a word to pull all the things.Quote:
Originally Posted by SannaR
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10-13-2018, 05:58 AMSannaRI used to get tanks who'd just look at my gear and assume I could handle healing the pull all the things and then do poorly on their end. I think it was mostly the lull before SB came out type of thing where you're tired of doing the same dungeons over and over type thing. Then there's the ones that I swear they think gear = skill or that because they do said pulls with their besty or their SO that it's ok to do with a random healer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright-Flower
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10-13-2018, 05:59 AMMightion
This had to be a troll post; I just started and I went through the whole tank trials before I even got into Sastasha during the MSQ.
That being said, no one has ever complained about my tanking - nowadays I pull with Shield Lob, Flash, then Circle of Scorn + Total Eclipse, etc... but the bit about changing out of Shield Oath was unknown to me... in four mans, I go into Shield Oath and stay there, and no one has ever said anything? I have always thought Sword Oath was for soloing. í ½í¸€ -
10-13-2018, 06:03 AMBright-FlowerGoing sword oath is something that can help speed things along when you're familiar with a boss, but not really needed. I doubt many people will complain or care. Really I don't think it ever matters much except in high end content where you're trying to squeeze out every last drop of dps you can to clear a ex trial or savage fight while progressing, or to speed clear them quickly on farm. In a dungeon you shouldn't ever feel pressured to go sword oath, it's just something you 'can' do if you're confident in your ability to hold agro with it and in the healer to keep you up without that buffer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightion
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10-13-2018, 06:04 AMRymmGoing Sword Oath allows you to squeeze out a bit more dps which is nice for dps checks and to speed up the run a bit but it is extremely rare for a tank switching to dps stance to be necessary in a 4man fight. It's one of those things that optimizes your play but isn't required for a clear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightion
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10-13-2018, 06:08 AMFhaerron
For 2 tank content boss opener:
Have the Warrior or DRK open the fight you Provoke and use shield lob and the other tank uses Shirk on you.
Then the other tank uses Provoke and you shirk them.
This is done in tank stance after this both tanks can switch over to DPS stance
> DPS the entire fight and forget about enmity.
For dungeon boss opener I do:
Shield Oath
Sheltron while running into range (if available)
Shield Lob as soon as in range
Fast Blade (Spirits Within in between the GCD) > Riot Blade (shield swipe in between the GCD or during the next GCD if not available yet) > Goring Blade (Circle of Scorn in between the GCD)
Fast Blade > Savage Blade > Rage of Halone (this 3 hit combo 2 times in a row)
Change to Sword Oath
Fast Blade > Riot Blade > Goring Blade
In between the GCD after Goring Blade wait till you have about 0.5S left of the GCD, hit Requisecat and spam Holy Spirit untill you run out of MP.
Fast Blade > Riot Blade (Wait till about 0.5S left of the GCD) > Goring Blade
Fast Blade > Riot Blade > Royal Authority (This 3 hit combo 2 times in a row)
Fast Blade > Riot Blade > Goring Blade
If the boss is above 20% HP at this point do another Requisecat and Holy Spirit spam round. If the boss is under 20% HP just keep using Royal Authority combo (and Goring Blade after 2 RA's).
If for some weird reason you are about to loose enmity don't be afraid to change to Shield Oath and use Rage of Halone 2 times more.
That's the order I use for all dungeon bosses. For certain bosses you may need to change it up a bit for example the scorpion boss in the Burn I wait with using the first Requisecat until after hailstorm since I have to move and will waste the buff otherwise (just keep using your DPS combos during such times) and then change back to the rotation order after you've done the certain move mechanic.
I have never lost enmity like this.
You do NOT need tank stance to survive tank burst in dungeons, especially as a PLD use your CD's to counter those hits.
If you do die, either you didn't move out of AoE or your healer is just bad (mostly the later) nothing on your part.
Or in rare cases DPS messed up like the heads on the last boss in the burn for example, during such moments you can use Sentinel (if you're at high HP) or Hallowed Ground (if your HP is low, also a good idea to use cover on the healer) to survive the massive damage.
For trash mobs in dungeons wait just till before you move into range aggro and hit sprint (20 seconds) then keep running without stop (until sprint runs out) and use flash each time you run trough mobs after your sprint runs out turn around use flash one more time, use fight or flight and spam Total Eclipse and Circle of scorn & Spirits within.
Rotate your CD's properly otherwise you will (most of the times) die and nothing the healer can do about it, if you ever fall to critical health use Hallowed Ground so your healer has some breathing ground, using Convalescence is most of the times useful as well in such times.
A quick note about Provoke.
It doesn't do anything on it's own and can't be used to build enmity (not unless you have a second tank to shirk voke with but that's a different thing).
If you died or lost aggro on a single enemy use Provoke and Shield Lob. Then use at least 1 Rage of Halone combo to build some more enmity
If you died or lost aggro on multiple enemies use Ultimatum and Flash (can spam flash 2 to 3 times for extra enmity).
If you need some more info just reach out and I'll happily tell you more details. -
10-13-2018, 06:35 AMFynlar
To the people remarking that Provoke pulling is 100% useless -- it's not; it has greater range than Shield Lob or whatever equivalent, and still has its uses for that reason. Yes, it shouldn't be your go-to pulling ability, but its increased range means it does still have uses here and there for pulling.
What you're doing is still fine. Sword Oath for bosses is just something comfortable tanks might do to make the fights a tiny bit quicker.Quote:
That being said, no one has ever complained about my tanking - nowadays I pull with Shield Lob, Flash, then Circle of Scorn + Total Eclipse, etc... but the bit about changing out of Shield Oath was unknown to me... in four mans, I go into Shield Oath and stay there, and no one has ever said anything? I have always thought Sword Oath was for soloing.
It isn't something you should be in for pulling packs of trash mobs, obviously. -
10-13-2018, 06:42 AMGeminaI do this too. I'm a healer main, and I try to be a people pleaser so sometimes I will ask before doing a big pull. A lot of the time though, I'm thinking they're thinking, "Why'd you stop? Go go go!" So there are times that I will do a big pull without asking if I have gauged the group can handle it. There are also times where I just say screw it, and say "Big pull coming!" and just do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright-Flower
Basically that entire clause is what I do after one glass of wine, then two, then three.... then I become woohoo tank! Which ironically is when I have got most of my comms tanking dungeons.