Stop Making Should-Be Achievement Gear.."Optional Gear"

They are not going to stop doing something that is profitable just because you don't like it. Sorry, but that is reality.

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Originally Posted by Owl_Hawk

But where does it stop?

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It stops when, instead of relying on a small number of people with the bad financial sense to buy all their crap (e.g., me), they raise subscription prices across the board.

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Originally Posted by Gaj85

You do realize that you don't HAVE to purchase OPTIONAL items, right? So who cares if others do? How does that concern you at all?

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This has always been a poor counterargument and I say this as someone who has purchased multiple items from the Mog Station as well as from Square Enix's official store. The rate at which new items are added to the Mog Station has increased over time and there's a lot of stagnating content in-game that could easily be refreshed by adding some new items as rare rewards. Take the revamped Diadem, for instance - there's no exclusive rewards in the form of mounts, minions or glamour for those of us who already acquired the pegasus mount and minion the first time around.

...and in a game where most of the content revolves around acquiring interesting looking glamour, minions, emotes and mounts it feels very dishonest to play down the appeal and importance of cosmetic rewards.

I can't personally jump on the Doom & Gloom train about how the cash shop is the worst thing ever when it's only feeding more money into the game you, the naysayers, are apparently still enjoying enough to continue subbing for. Everything on the cash shop has been of really niche interest. There's hardly anything any there that the average person gets excited about except for once in a blue moon so it's hardly like they are even abusing it's current state to it's full potential either. When accounting for my total subscription fee and Mogstation purchases, to date I've still spent less money on here than my previous game which was a Free-to-Play MMO which I have - by now - played less than FFXIV and I am a glamour/vanity freak with over eight characters who has no problem shelling out money in this game if it's for something that suits any one of my characters.

Many people are speaking as though this is the only avenue in life where you pay for a service and don't get absolutely everything remotely associated with it for free in exchange. There's nothing exploitative about this system in my opinion and anyone who claims otherwise is primarily basing their reasoning an a slippery slope fallacy when the fact of the matter is that 90% of the people who express support for and defend the cash shop all imply they are just as against the idea of it reaching the same negative point you are all afraid of(e.g paying for 'power-ups').

I don't like that the new emotes are single-character only. I think that was unnecessarily stingey of SE to throw out such a restriction.
I also think the OP had an undeniably interesting point about the likes of NPC Magitek Reapers being made available through farm content and I admit I regret the missed opportunity(since the mentor one was horribly implemented) for the sake of those interested, but I still wholeheartedly support the cash shop - that is to say, I still wholeheartedly support a fair and non-pressuring manner in which the game I love playing can rake in more revenue, look more successful to the investors, and therefore earn nice and plump budgets to feed back into the game as what happened with Stormblood. Yes please.

I can't even fathom this concept that some people are suggesting where the game should be made better in exchange for making less money.

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Originally Posted by Owl_Hawk

A sub is a sub..we should have access to everything if this game isnt a Free-To-Play game.

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This is where I think the argument goes too far. The cash shop is not SE holding candy in front of your face and telling you, "You need this! Buy this!". You don't need any of this. Saying its Optional Items is just not enough for people, so whatever.

For what it's worth, this is how I look at it: I bought Tales of Berseria at full price on Steam because I played a Tales game once. Tales of Berseria ended up blowing my expectations out of the water and I'm thoroughly enjoying it. I want the devs of this game to continue making Tales game of this quality and better, but how can I do that? I buy all of the DLC costumes/items. I WANT to support good game development and MONEY is how I can do that. Yeah, I bought the game already and some would say that is enough, but I'd rather drive the message home and make sure these men and women get rewarded for their work.

I love FFxiv, it's the best MMO on the market by a long shot, imo. I pay my sub even when I stay 3-4 weeks off every now and then. I also buy stuff from the cash shop. Not because I think I need it, but because I support FFxiv. Subs is not enough to pay for everything we get in this game. I believe I read something about how the cash shop was able to pay for the upgrades to the NA servers? (i dont have a source).

With your threads you have been making it would seem you are not Happy. You could always leave the game and be done with it?

OPu can always change game lmao be happy u can quit the game iif it stresses you like this

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Originally Posted by Owl_Hawk

A sub is a sub..we should have access to everything if this game isnt a Free-To-Play game.

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May I ask why? You mention that content "should" be earned in-game, and that we are paying for a "FULL membership," but what are those points based on? Because Square Enix doesn't need to make more money? I mean, granted, but so what? By what argument "should" all this be free? You act like that's an inherent truth, but that's not the case.

Now, I think your point about customer satisfaction is strong, and important. If they charge too much and it drives people away, that's bad, both from a business and a customer perspective. However, that doesn't seem to be happening, at least not yet. But I don't think it's wise to conflate "I don't like that I have to pay for this" with "I shouldn't have to pay for this." The first is a valid argument, even though everyone seems to be afraid to just say that. The second is kind of nonsense.

Sure, we can take out the cash shop, but your sub fee goes up to $100 a month. Would you STILL keep playing if the sub fee was $100 a month? I know I wouldn't. At least with optional items I can dip in when I have a bit of extra change to spare for my gaming, but if it was $100 a month sub fee I couldn't justify that. £8.99 a month is very reasonable plus a cash shop allowing me to dip into items. If they charged for access to dungeons or savage raids, etc, sure, I'd be OK with that, I buy access to the dungeons I want. No big deal. To me the £8.99 a month covers server access only. Anything else given by it is a bonus.

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Originally Posted by Owl_Hawk

But where does it stop? Shall they stop making all sorts of weapon models all together? and just upgrade the same piece of item forever? And if you want anything else...pay for it? We are paying a sub already..part of that sub is the expectation that we will get digital items..systems such as the Veteran items is fine, since it rewards people who play...The Sub also covers items that users can use in the game....The game should be fun, challenging and since it is an MMO...should have alot more content for people to go do...Things to strive for...otherwise what is the point of playing at all? Then have them remove all mounts from EX fights...All emotes from the game..I can afford to buy these items...But my point is why pay a sub and bother having achievements if all the good stuff is bought? why do anything in the game? Raiding is OPTIONAL isnt it? so is LEVELING...so is gearing up...you don't make a strong point at all.

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Well let's dissect this post, shall we?

1. We don't pay for weapons with stats, because that would be against the point of a sub MMO, that would be F2P wherein Yoshida has already stated he would close the game before it got to that point.
2. We don't pay for gear with stats, because that would be against the point of a sub MMO, that would be F2P wherein Yoshida has already stated he would close the game before it got to that point.
3. You pay a sub and you do get items? Actually, the sub is more of a pass to pay the game for that month, really. You could pay $15, and not get anything out of it if you really wanted.
4. If you can afford to buy all the emotes and mounts in the game, why are you then complaining about a $24 mount or $15 hair/outfit bundle if you can afford all the emotes and mounts which would amount to a total of 120 emotes, and 80 mounts, which totals to $840 for emotes and $960 for mounts, for a grand total of $1,800. You'd be absolutely okay with paying $1,800 instead of paying less than that over a course of 4~ years?
5. So all the good stuff is not in the achievements? Let me remind you, we don't have GC Warsteeds on the Mog Station, we don't have the ADS mounts on the Mog Station, we don't have the Yokai mounts on the Mog Station, we don't have the GARO mounts on the Mog Station, we don't have the tank mounts on the Mog Station. There's a lot of stuff ALREADY rewarded from achievements that is apparently, as you put it, "not the good stuff"...
6. Raiding is optional, but the gear has weight to it, as opposed to Lv1 glamour gear...
7. Leveling is optional... if you want to be forever stuck at whatever level you're at.

You don't make a strong counterpoint at all... strawmen are only good if they actually make a point. Your point is that because VANITY items are available on the Mog Station at a premium, that things with WEIGHT to them, that are a core part of an MMORPG's system, should be on the Mog Station for a premium, as if they were a vanity item.

Sorry... what was the argument again? That pretty bow for my hair is on the Mog Station, so the entire game should be?

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Originally Posted by Ririta

That's .001% too much imo

The one thing that I've ever wanted would cost me 30$, more expensive than the game and more expensive than a full game on Steam.

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RRP for AAA games is $60 for home console or PC, $40 for handhelds. Indie games are an entire different category to AAA games, let alone an AAA MMORPG.