Midgardsormr and the Crystals

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Originally Posted by lololink

If it's not linked to the twelves, then why does Louisoix have a vision of the twelve swords that were summoned right before as the twelve to jail Bahamut ?

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If it's not linked to the true Twelve, the explanation is that Louisoix carved symbols into rocks and asked people to pray to them, and they did, and then he called on their prayers to power his summoning . Prayers + Aether = Manifestations. Isn't your question sort of like saying, "If Good King Moggle Mog XIIth is a myth, how do you explain that I just punched Good King Moggle Mog XIIth in the face?" We saw Good King Moggle Mog XIIth, but the Scions go on to question if he ever even really existed. How can we see the same event with the Twelve and just close the book?

We certainly have enough information to ask questions and point at possibilities, and even pick favorite theories to throw our weight behind, but to close the book on it as "It was The Twelve." ... If that ended up being correct, it would have been correct incidentally, imho.

And that's coming from someone who still thinks there's a chance that there's some truth in the Twelve, in spite of the ambiguity in the above, in spite of an Ascian egging people on to summon Rhalgr because he knew it wouldn't be Rhalgr, in spite of the symbols of the Twelve showing up in Allag society even though they clearly didn't think a god made the lesser moon at the beginning of time, in spite of Althyk and Nymeia actually probably being Hydaelyn in the Midgardsormr story, and so on.

I have a little faith, including an open mind that you might be right. I just get nervous at the "Let's accept that it was definitely that." part.

I think that the twelve and Moggle Mog XII truly existed or else they couldn't be summoned, but the myths surrounding them are likely to be false or far from the truth considering they disappear at the first umbral era, we should really summon Ramuh again and ask him some questions.

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Originally Posted by lololink

I think that the twelve and Moggle Mog XII truly existed or else they couldn't be summoned,

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I think that's where it starts to get murky in such a way that the distinction between "true god" and "eikon" becomes moot.

For instance,

If you summoned Phoenix (literally T12 Primal Phoenix), could you therefore be sure that phoenixes existed? It might potentially prove is that Louisoix existed, but what if you summoned Phoenix without knowing his name or that he ever lived? What if you just believed in The Phoenix? If the Spires we summoned were more than just Aether and Prayer, for all we know, we summoned the warped spirits of the twelve Zodiac Braves and called them whatever names we wanted. One could make a case for that being the core of all primal summoning, but then it becomes rather moot to debate the finer points of, I think.

Interresting :

But still that would mean that the twelve existed, maybe they weren't gods from before the 1st era but it would mean that they exist, Phoenix exist, but it's not the one the myth talks about, the real Phoenix is Louisoix ( Unless Louisoix managed without knowing it to make a Iceheart-type summoning, but that's unlikely ). Something can exist even if everything you know about it is fake. My point is that I don't think it's possible to summon a soul that doesn't exist, that would either mean that the Primal is souless ( and so it's not really a summoning ) or that it's possible to create a soul and add any memory you want to it.

Furthermore, were the Zodiac brave 12 ? There are only 10 jobs and 11 relics ( counting Aegis and Excalibur as two ) Or they still wanted to name them the Zodiac weapon while there wouldn't be 12 weapons. Meaning 2 are unknown. Meh nevermind that, it's out of the subject.

Midgardsomr is recuperating. Hydealyn is recuperating. The seal is broken, or rather the crystals are sealed. Tupsimati is wide open for the taking and the Dravanians are moving against Ishgard.

So far, only 3 Ascians have meddled with the Eorzians; Elidibus, Nabriales and Lahabrea.

My question is, what is Zodiark waiting for? If he is the opposite of Hydealyn, as we've seen the big black crystal floating in aether, what is he waiting for? The Ascians want to revive Zodiark, does it mean that he's dead? Or just recuperating like Hydaelyn? Why does he never speak to the Warrior of Light or anybody else?

In my opinion, Midgardsomr is equal in power to Hydaelyn, or have power close to her, sealing the crystals and all. But the crystals are not the things that powers the Warrior of Light, it was Hydealyn herself. What are the significance of the crystal in the first place? To porte