Honest question: If every player/class/job is equal,who is unique? (Gameplay topic)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Canadane

Scootaloo, according to your profile, you have one tank, one melee dps, and acn (so 1 magic dps and 1 healer) levelled to 50.
How are you able to say everything in each category work the same if you aren't experiencing them all to their fullest?
Not to mention you have no crafts at 50, so you cannot see that benefit either, I suppose.

Like I don't mean to call you out, but you should really try things out completely before complaining about them.

---

Complaining? I'm pointing out facts about them, big diff. If I was going to complain, I'd make a post about how unoriginal the gameplay is,how the current state of the game reminds me a lot of WoW, and how tedious it is to farm solidery tomes.

Oh wait, I just did. See the diff?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Causality

Crafters are the only ones that can Affix materia to these items. You NEED to have a crafter to Maximize the potential and that crafter has to match the type of item as well as the Level Requirements of the materia.

---

But not to, y'know, actually craft.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

While I agree it's good to have variety in the jobs, I really don't feel they're too similar. I actively play both WHM and SCH, and BLM and SMN. They're very different.

---

But not as different as, say, WHM/SCH and DNC. A healer that generates its cures by being in melee combat, doesn't require MP and can't be silenced. When you look at it from that perspective, WHM and SCH are fairly similiar. To be fair, of all the roles currently in the game, the healer role does, to me, seem to have the widest difference.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

I also play BRD, it's very different as well.

---

BRD is not anywhere near as different as it could have been. It could have been a support class as it has been in all FFs rather than a DPS with a couple of support abilities.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Causality

Like people have already stated, too many differences leads to people being left out. Remember back when everyone was farming Brayflox HM speed runs for Myth? The ONLY DPS jobs people wanted were BLMs and BRDs. Just last night, I saw a Party Finder for Levi EX that specifically stated "no monks." Exclusion is not a good thing in a game like this.

---

Sometimes you have to accept that some classes will get left out of some content. Fortunately this game encourages you to level multiple classes. As long as a class isn't left out for most content and the BIS doesn't exclusively come from one content (*cough* Coil *cough*) then it's not as bad as you're worried it will be.

Ask someone who levelled PUP to 75 in XI, they got left out for loads of stuff, but it was hella fun anyway.

Equality does not necessarily mean that no classes are unique. The only two jobs in the game that play almost identically are Scholar and Summoner, and that's only because they branch off of the same class, and even then, they have enough difference in playstyle to be unique.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scootaloo

Complaining? I'm pointing out facts about them, big diff. If I was going to complain, I'd make a post about how unoriginal the gameplay is,how the current state of the game reminds me a lot of WoW, and how tedious it is to farm solidery tomes.

Oh wait, I just did. See the diff?

---

So, what do you want exactly? You say that, for you, all DPS are ultimately the same, minus "few differences".
But that's a very subjective thing and, as you are now well aware after 4-5 pages, people don't have the same opinion as you do about this.

You can't argue with people on a subjective point, trying to bring logical arguments, that makes no sense.

As I said in my previous post, which still remains unanswered, it all comes down to the way you percieve the differences between some key-points of the gameplay between each class. But still, this is highly subjective and you can't form any logical argument with that.

You have 3 classes at 50, none of which are in the same side of the Holy Trinity. If you had some first-hand experience with all 9 jobs, you'd know exactly how different they play and how different you have to think about what your current and next actions are in a changing fight situation.

TANK

WAR mindset: big hit's coming up, how do I get an Inner Beast ready? Shit, didn't get to 5 stacks in time, gotta pop a buff

vs.

PLD mindset: bit hit's coming up, I'll just press 1 button and call it a day.

(alternatively)

WAR mindset: Overpower, overpower, overpower, aoe tanking all day erryday

vs.

PLD mindset: Flash, flash, flash, shit lost hate to Flare whatdoidohelp

HEALING

WHM mindset: aoe heals, top everyone up with regen, might throw some stone and aero out but gotta watch my mana

vs.

SCH mindset: tra-la-la dps for days, mana for days, don't even need to leave cleric stance to lustrate, let the WHM worry about stomps

DAMAGE

MNK mindset: boss is about to jump, how do I keep GL3 up through the jump? idgaf if the boss turns, my combos will still hit

DRG mindset: Heavy Thrust/Impulse Drive missed because the boss turned to do fireball/landslide/fffffffffff

BLM mindset: when's the best time to pop manawall/ward so I can keep casting without moving? Nice, got a Firestarter proc, I can reposition again finally

SMN mindset: dots for days. Had to cancel a Ruin cast? I ain't even mad

BRD mindset: Wait is this game supposed to be hard?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scootaloo

Complaining? I'm pointing out facts about them, big diff. If I was going to complain, I'd make a post about how unoriginal the gameplay is,how the current state of the game reminds me a lot of WoW, and how tedious it is to farm solidery tomes.

Oh wait, I just did. See the diff?

---

Perhaps "complain" wasn't the right choice of words.
How would you give each class it's fair assessment if you haven't played them all?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HakuroDK

Equality does not necessarily mean that no classes are unique. The only two jobs in the game that play almost identically are Scholar and Summoner, and that's only because they branch off of the same class, and even then, they have enough difference in playstyle to be unique.

---

I think what this thread is showing is a difference in scale.

Some posters see the Greased Lightning mechanic, for example, making the MNK play differently to DRG.

Others see both jobs as a case of maintain rotation, get into the correct position for each hit. Repeat. DPS jobs can be far more varied than this.

It may be a heritage thing. People coming from the older MMORPGs have experienced wide varieties of jobs that have been streamlined in the newer MMOs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aegis

But not as different as, say, WHM/SCH and DNC. A healer that generates its cures by being in melee combat, doesn't require MP and can't be silenced.

BRD is not anywhere near as different as it could have been. It could have been a support class as it has been in all FFs rather than a DPS with a couple of support abilities.

---

I never played XI, but I heard dancers were really fun. I would love if they added dancer as the next healer class. I would eat that up in a heartbeat.

As for bard, they may not be all they could be, but you have to admit they're very different than other classes. They're the only class that can restore MP and TP for the whole party. They're the only class that can buff the magic damage of every caster in party. They're also the only class that can run around (and at a ranged distance) all of the time, while still attacking at full force.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NorthernLadMSP

They're the only class that can restore MP and TP for the whole party. They're the only class that can buff the magic damage of every caster in party. They're also the only class that can run around (and at a ranged distance) all of the time, while still attacking at full force.

---

Yet, from my experience, they just like to run around pew pew pewing. Double WHM out below half MP, RUN FOREST RUN. SCH having to raise too many bodies and out of MP, RUN FOREST RUN.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Canadane

Perhaps "complain" wasn't the right choice of words.
How would you give each class it's fair assessment if you haven't played them all?

---

It doesn't take grinding a job to 50 to get a clear picture of how it plays.

Reacting in real time is another story but this isn't about the reaction mechanics.(That's a whole other thread)

And for the record, I plan to have all jobs to lvl 50 before 2.4. Hell, I bet even when I have them all to 50 people will still try to argue these things.

idk, maybe its just because I hail from FFXI and am used to being able to look at a dragoon and a monk and immediately see the differences between them that I'm seeing so little.

Lord knows us FFXI players get hate just for existing in FFXIV due to all the WoW players flooding in this game. WoW players hate us for wanting a challenge and we hate WoW players for wanting everything to be "easy mode".

Anyways, enough of me derailing this topic.

Point I'm trying to make is, I've played each job to know them in and out, I don't need to be level 50 to know how one job works... This is actually sad in itself that I can learn and master a job before I even get all the skills because they really don't make any difference in the end when the end result is just dmg output and that's it.