Who knew the 6.15 Omega Quests… (Spoilers)

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Originally Posted by Rulakir

Krile is basically just Minfilia 2.0, or Mini-filia. :P It's why I don't like her. The end of ShB they're supposed to be questioning Hydaelyn's motivations after discovering she's a primal only for Krile to find her so irresistibly charming she gives her body to her.

The Scions have always been zealous towards Hydaelyn, so perhaps I shouldn't be surprised when it comes to her all logic and conviction go straight out the window. The fact that they never had an issue with her telling Minfilia to kill herself or abandoning her until she let Hydaelyn use her body as a vessel is hand waved as Minfilia "following her heart" and somehow "free will" (despite Minfilia initially yelling "No!"). Thancred, the one Scion who should have anger issues towards her due to his obsession with Minfilia, refuses to even think about it (literally, he says as much after Qitana Ravel). Minfilia is Trashcan Man from The Stand, "My life for you!" and Thancred just goes along with it.

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What happened to Minfilia was basically entrapment. You know, just trust the inscrutable voice in your head as you've always trusted (for no discernible reason)...aaaand now you'll "live" and die as her puppet or you'll just die in the lifestream achieving nothing and helping no one as your soul gets reduced to nothingness. It makes me sick just thinking about it again. Everyone who's dealt with Hydaelyn has met with a terrible fate, one way or another, whether they were against her or her allies. I'm so glad that monster is dead.

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Originally Posted by LordGiggles

If the ancients live as long as the Ea will, with no other way to die except suicide, yes. it is a perfectly logical choice to make, being alive is a choice, not a virtue.

Really, what else are they supposed to do? The best option they have, by far, is death. Whether it happens now or eventually doesn't really matter when we have no idea how old they are already.

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The Ea as individuals can choose as they wish. As a collective however deciding that life isn’t worth living for any future generations is the failure. Their children can be mortal, and informed by their mistakes can blaze a better path.

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Originally Posted by LordGiggles

I think you're missing my point here. The sundered are not on an alternate path, they are just much much less advanced than the Ea. The Ea did not fail somehow, they weren't conquered, they had a strong drive to fight for scientific progress and a better understanding of the universe, and their reward was a guarantee that their lives would eventually become nightmarish if they allowed themselves to live on.

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Then don’t live that long, and celebrate the life you did have. The Sundered now have a universes wealth of examples of what not to do. They can find their way.

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Originally Posted by LordGiggles

The horror of their fate is that they did everything right. the only way to avoid a similar fate is to refuse fixing much about your life, and to not care about understanding the universe. Their dead end is a near inevitability.

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Many species did everything right, that’s Meteions point in her argument. It does not change the answer however, that one still can find a reason to keep going even if faced with that inevitability.

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Originally Posted by LordGiggles

It's not really comparable to death, they're already showing that many of them were willing to die. Even less comparable to death considering reincarnation is somewhat of a thing in this universe, we don't really have to fear what comes after. It's more similar to someone seeing everything they love die or be destroyed, and then being locked in a sensory isolation tank for the rest of their lives, with no hope to change this (though at least they'll die eventually).

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I think many fear what comes after, why else would the Ancients be so horrified by the Final Days? Even just losing who you were is agony.

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Originally Posted by LordGiggles

The omega stuff allowing us to say that none of the three ancients were justified in their actions is the closest we're going to get to a realistic take on the topic.

I did have more typed up in reply for this, but I completely forgot to send it, so just gonna post this part.

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I respect your take but disagree.

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Originally Posted by Misplaced_Marbles

What happened to Minfilia was basically entrapment. You know, just trust the inscrutable voice in your head as you've always trusted (for no discernible reason)...aaaand now you'll "live" and die as her puppet or you'll just die in the lifestream achieving nothing and helping no one as your soul gets reduced to nothingness. It makes me sick just thinking about it again. Everyone who's dealt with Hydaelyn has met with a terrible fate, one way or another, whether they were against her or her allies. I'm so glad that monster is dead.

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Guess it’s trolling hours again.

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Originally Posted by EaraGrace

The Ea as individuals can choose as they wish. As a collective however deciding that life isn’t worth living for any future generations is the failure. Their children can be mortal, and informed by their mistakes can blaze a better path.

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I don't think the Ea can have children. They collectively abandoned their bodies and became immortal energy beings.

Maybe some didn't, and continued to live normal lives, and the race became extinct eons ago while the immortal ones lived on.

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Originally Posted by Kuroka

They always could look for new planets, and dying to start over is not that different from our "gathering small pieces of happiness only to loose em again and start over"... And the sharks... id rather get that as an joke of something gets trendy and ppl suddenly flood him with it. Thats something very human to do lol...

Venat broke with an tradition, sure they ask her when she wanna go, but theyre not "do it soon or we do it!" so i dont really see the problem there - consider they dont seem to have a natural death and we have 0 Idea how old she actually was.

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But the whole sharks thing seemed to have been something that has been happening for some time now. Just look at the Fenrir. We get told what the original thought behind its creation was. Even when we tour Emet's biased memory of Amaurot we get told the create something cause it's the new fad thing was happening up to the Final Days. When it comes off as the only outlet people have to express themselves is through their creations how long will it take before others get to thinking like Hermes and go what's the point? The ones who seemed to be innovative are those few who were seen as strange as they were creating things and experimenting on things without the use of creation magic. We don't know how long between our time in Elpis and the Final Days were, but they were already showing signs of staleness.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I don't think the Ea can have children. They collectively abandoned their bodies and became immortal energy beings.

Maybe some didn't, and continued to live normal lives, and the race became extinct eons ago while the immortal ones lived on.

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I’m sure they could find a way to make reproduction in some form a possibility again. If any species could its them.

And based on the fact that both the Omicrons and the Dragons both had schisms, I’m sure the Ea had theirs as well. What exactly happened to them would be cool to know.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

Philosophically, you can interpret this to mean that all things are transient and fleeting, which fits in with our own experience of life as humans. And the real question being asked is philosophical, not literal: Why live, when all things surely perish? Why learn, when all knowledge is eventually lost? And the resolution to this conflict is in Y'shtola's response. It's about the journey. Even if we're all eventually destined to 'lose', that doesn't stop us from having a ton of fun along the way. Nihilism is not a sustainable philosophical stance. It's just a temporary place, a bus stop for lost souls.

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All well and good as a philosophical musing, but not exactly convincing to the Ea considering that they would literally live to see the universe turn into a cold void of nothingness.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

they were already showing signs of staleness.

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We're playing a game called Final Fantasy 14.

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Originally Posted by EaraGrace

Guess it’s trolling hours again.

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Huh? How so? A decent amount of posters have always found Minfilia's fate to be pretty alarming - even some of us who didn't particularly care for her as a character.

Furthermore, simply disliking or voicing displeasure towards Venat does not equal 'trolling'.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Huh? How so? A decent amount of posters have always found Minfilia's fate to be pretty alarming - even some of us who didn't particularly care for her as a character.

Furthermore, simply disliking or voicing displeasure towards Venat does not equal 'trolling'.

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Because it’s a complete strawman of Minfilia and Venats actions and the reasons behind it. Hydaelyn was nearly dry of aether and called out to a noted ally for aid who made clear time and time again she wanted to help. There’s nothing indicating that Minfilia wished to not be the Word of the Mother or that she was going to die if she didn’t say yes, and it’s made clear that her decision were her own. The game explicitly says she did so because she wished to.

And that post wasn’t just voicing disagreement or displeasure. It’s just trying to piss people off.

I wouldn't consider it to be a 'strawman'. Each and every single one of Venat's victories are built upon the demise of other people. The vast majority of them completely without consent at that. To say nothing of the artwork for the patch where Minfilia's fate was first revealed:

https://i.imgur.com/e7lsr1c.png

Furthermore, people are perfectly free to come to their own conclusions regardless particular characters - especially if their actions are controversial.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I wouldn't consider it to be a 'strawman'. Each and every single one of Venat's victories are built upon the demise of other people. The vast majority of them completely without consent at that. To say nothing of the artwork for the patch where Minfilia's fate was first revealed:

https://i.imgur.com/e7lsr1c.png

Furthermore, people are perfectly free to come to their own conclusions regardless particular characters - especially if their actions are controversial.

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Wasn't Yoshi actually asked about that artwork recently though and basically said that "it meant nothing" and has no connection or bearing on EW's story? If that was the case, then whatever reasoning that may have been behind back then has since been retconned anyway (yet another one I guess). I'm not trying to make a judgement either way, just looking at it objectively.