BLU for Duty Finder and Raids! Show your support!

Who wants to bet PotD will remain inaccessible for BLU?

That's the proverbial nail in Blue Mage's coffin for me. Granted, I think it's been a huge waste of resources. If they at least allow it access to Deep Dungeon, that could be kinda fun, especially for solo attempts. On the flip side, if they won't even do that. What's even the point?

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Originally Posted by Kye

All development outside of the story has been really strange recently, they've been constantly missing their mark or falling short and just causing tons of displeasure among the player base to the point where some may argue it might have been better not to implement anything at all because what does release is so disappointing.

I honestly believe they've pulled most FFXIV devs off the team to work on FF7 Remake because they can't allow that to fail and it's sad. Instead of the devs actually working to add what people want, like they did in the past, now it's like: "Well here's what we have the time and resources to make, so how do we spin it so that it seems like we're giving them what they want?"

It's all very disheartening because Shadowbringers was the expansion that truly made FFXIV a WoW-killer (if there is such a thing) and the devteam seems to be lacking the most during this critical time.

Why can't Yoshi P say what we all dream he would: "We're going to make Male Viera and Female Hrothgar!" "We're going to make Blue Mage a regular job!"

Why do we keep getting half-finished things that no one asked for instead of one fully completed thing? I think I know why... because FFXIV is an amusement park, and the more rides there are, the more visitors it will get, regardless of how cruddy those rides are.

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While I do actually agree they have been missing the mark in some aspects—particularly job balance, which has been atrocious. I sincerely doubt FFVIIR has bearing on these decisions. They were never going to develop Male Viera and Female Hrothgar mid-expansion nor would Blue Mage be a real job in that same time frame. The last time they attempted a mid-expansion addition was Ninja—a job already in development from the 1.x days if I recall. The sheer amount of work they claimed it caused made the process a nightmare. That tells me even if FFVIIR weren't a thing, neither of what you're asking for would happen until 6.0 at the earliest.

I'm hard-pressed to believe the new content will make me not want BLU in normal content as a normal job, but I'm going to give them a chance, mostly because I want to see the last few hold outs move to my side of the issue. I'm interested in hearing what goal they'll set next if this one fails to keep justifying what they did to BLU.

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Originally Posted by BubblyBoar

I'm hard-pressed to believe the new content will make me not want BLU in normal content as a normal job, but I'm going to give them a chance, mostly because I want to see the last few hold outs move to my side of the issue. I'm interested in hearing what goal they'll set next if this one fails to keep justifying what they did to BLU.

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My problem with the new content is its more carnival stages, more spells and a dungeon challenge log.

So its gonna be
1. Level up
2. Get some spells
3. Do the carnival all of once
4... Do the dungeon log, I guess, or farm spells, to use in the dungeon log... which gives seals, which are used for stuff I don't need.

I don't think I'm even gonna level it, Im not going to add to any kind of statistic of success to them on their end, cos they still considered it a success last update I believe even though not all that many people even got to 50 on it, so if a significant portion of the small amount of people who got it to 50 dont get it to 60 then maybe they'll reconsider. Unlikely but I'm not gonna put up with it, I used BLU all of once outside the intial week to help a friend do low level dungeons, no point getting it higher.

The Madmen Nerfed BLU. I Don't even, what?

Reduced aoe damage across the board, no self destruct spam, peculiar light and off guard now being trick attack so you cant captalise on that sweet multiplicative damage stacking. Huh, its almost like their balancing it like a real Job.

Inb4 the 60 skills just add back what was changed

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

The Madmen Nerfed BLU. I Don't even, what?

Reduced aoe damage across the board, no self destruct spam, peculiar light and off guard now being trick attack so you cant captalise on that sweet multiplicative damage stacking. Huh, its almost like their balancing it like a real Job.

Inb4 the 60 skills just add back what was changed

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Hmm depends on how long brush with death lasts and whether we still die when using skills, if yes welp that slows things down in dungeons, if no may actually be useful for boss fights if timed well with a full hp blu using white wind.

We had potency increases in a lot of places but added aoe dop off :s

off-gaurd is better now than in 5.1 while also not being broken so this change is why? same with peculiar light just why?

Overall i think our single target damage has gone up but we may have taken a hit to our aoes

I'd say the unknown is what abilities they plan to give from HW areas. Personally, I'm fine with reduced AoEs, but it's also possible they want the pending new abilities to shine by either not having reductions or different scaling. The various ST changes otherwise make full BLU parties more viable, while changes to learn rate are still a mystery as well.

Most spells got their potency increased by more than 50%, which means it's basically like you have the old +50% effect of Off-Guard up all the time now. It's mostly a buff for single target damage, with the notable exceptions being the primal skills which did not see much of a buff in strength and will seem much weaker than before, bleh.

I think the only confirmed HW ability so far is Level 5 Death, which Yoshi-P mentioned in an interview.

I'd love if they could even start with BLU being able to e used as DPS in Squadrons.

Well here's something...

https://img.finalfantasyxiv.com/lds/...I43Afi3o84.jpg

Looks interesting, though I'm disappointed to once again see a "Weekly Target", I could really go for some daily Blue Mage content in all honesty... I can't even hope that there's a daily dungeon run, given the weekly target is an EX Primal while they're on the Raids tab, so it looks like we're just going from 3 Masked Carnival instances a week, to that plus one piece of Duty Finder content... For what looks like the exact same rewards too... Was kind of hoping we'd get Centurio Seals come Lv60 but nope... Still the same lackluster rewards as Masked Carnival... Ideally give Blue its own currency with unique stuff, rather than Hunt currencies that can just be more easily obtained from Hunts rather than playing Blue Mage...

Honestly Blue Mage has grown on me over the months, still far from what I'd want it to be but I can at least have fun on it... Just wish there was more to actually do on it to have fun with... Weekly content is very easy to forget, especially when the rewards are basically non-existent... I guess Duty Finder content is at least a step up from Masked Carnival, which is basically 5 minutes worth of content a week...

I find it really funny how we now get a log for doing group content...with a job that was told to us to be solo. And since this content need a full group and cant be unsynched doesnt that mean that people will need certain skils to just survive it? Sounds like a rotation for me..So seemingly that limited, solo job gets most of its skills from group content and now has "new" content that is only for groups..

I really get the feeling that even SE does not really know what to do with it..and that being the new blue content is lackluster..just reusing old one again..It really is "great" that we lost a whole full job for this..

To everyone who comes in here like "Yay they added DF content"

This is unlikely to be a BLU df as it has separate recruit and duty commence buttons, meaning its likely just a fancy PF ui. Even if this does have a portion of automated matching, its still not in df with the main classes when there remains little reason to keep them separate.

It's a shame too. Like, they make it all fancy and try to hide it like it's an actual DF, but it's totally just PF with a DF wrapper.

So BLUty finder is just a reskinned Party Finder it seems. And you'll need to do 24mans for Blue Log. That's... bad. Yep, i'll go with bad.

https://i.imgur.com/6fpS5Ao.png

Seriously just let it be able to queue into df with main jobs please, oh no someone only has water cannon ok kick feature enabled, be no different than the ice mage or the floor tank and getting the response "You Don't Pay My Sub mgrgrgrgrgr".

:rolleyes:

HAHAHAHAH

24 man BLU content. . .

That's going to be dead in a week. Good luck ever getting those spells afterwards just like all the other BLU content (still missing Jump and Ink jet here)

But more on topic:

If you really want an all 24 BLU raid content you need no sh!t tanks and healers, and if BLU can fill those roles adequately (which I doubt they will be able to):

WHAT IS THE POINT OF EXCLUDING THEM FROM DUTY FINDER?

If they can tank/heal a 24 man, they can tank/heal anything else that comes before it.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

BIf you really want an all 24 BLU raid content you need no sh!t tanks and healers, and if BLU can fill those roles adequately (which I doubt they will be able to):

WHAT IS THE POINT OF EXCLUDING THEM FROM DUTY FINDER?

If they can tank/heal a 24 man, they can tank/heal anything else that comes before it.

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Because you have to go get the skills first to do it. If you don't have the skills, you can't do anything. I suspect it's incredibly hard for them to set up a system that checks which abilities you have and don't have, so rather than adjust PF for that (which at this point is pure spaghetti code) they'd prefer to just give a BLU only one since the playerbase itself will sort things out.

I personally can't wait to see how this is going to end and watch how quickly it also does out. Hopefully not as fast as last time

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Because you have to go get the skills first to do it. If you don't have the skills, you can't do anything. I suspect it's incredibly hard for them to set up a system that checks which abilities you have and don't have, so rather than adjust PF for that (which at this point is pure spaghetti code) they'd prefer to just give a BLU only one since the playerbase itself will sort things out.

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They literally have a system that checks what spells you've learned for the job quests, translate that system into a "blue mage licence" from a job quest which checks what spells you've learned and boom, duty finder

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

https://i.imgur.com/6fpS5Ao.png

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You know, I wouldn't be surprised at all if this is exactly how development works at times.

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

They literally have a system that checks what spells you've learned for the job quests, translate that system into a "blue mage licence" from a job quest which checks what spells you've learned and boom, duty finder

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One small nitpick. You have to equip said spells. I learned all the spells, but i want to be self-destruct mage. So i only set up Toad Oil and Selfdestruct. Oh and Flying Sardine! Because fish, lol.

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Originally Posted by Flay_wind

One small nitpick. You have to equip said spells. I learned all the spells, but i want to be self-destruct mage. So i only set up Toad Oil and Selfdestruct. Oh and Flying Sardine! Because fish, lol.

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That is straight up no different than ice mage and no DoT smn, kick feature tends to get rid of them :P

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Because you have to go get the skills first to do it. If you don't have the skills, you can't do anything. I suspect it's incredibly hard for them to set up a system that checks which abilities you have and don't have, so rather than adjust PF for that (which at this point is pure spaghetti code) they'd prefer to just give a BLU only one since the playerbase itself will sort things out.

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Long ago, like ARR beta days lol, Yoshi had came out with a rough plan of Blue Mage (it's basically been this concept that we have now since ever, which he called a hunting mini game sort of concept)- at that time beyond saying please don't, I had suggested that they could keep a similar structure to other jobs and systems by making Blue Mage gain experience via learning spells.

This learning spells = leveling concept can be broken into a few pieces that I think while not "perfect" I believe would have been accepted better by the general public than purely limited. I say purely limited in that I think many of those who wanted to play Blue Mage in standard group would either like or not care about the limited side if it was in addition to standard features (not everyone who is upset hates the idea of weird stuff, personally I'm for advanced job concept, just that, myself included, had really wanted to play Blue Mage in DF / as a main).

Actually as an aside I think if a game was designed from the ground up with the idea that limited is main and balanced is "limited" that you'd have a potentially interesting mmo on your hands- such that the extreme content and pvp was balanced (so our current kit) but the really weird highly specific to that job systems (each job being VERY unique) would be the standard MSQ / normal / "hard" kit. Would mean a lot of different ways to approach the main game and experience it, but still everyone plays together and in the content where every little % of damage matters the jobs would be better balanced (so your job isn't useless because it doesn't use a blunt weapon or have magic or what have you).

Back on the leveling thing though- Some concepts that add flexibility to the idea of leveling via spells could include tiers. Imagine our hunting log, change that to spells- now Blue Mage can't join content without having the spells required to level. SE could still add weird stuff or minor variations for color / debuff choice lol (or even have an advanced job concept), but those spells wouldn't be part of the exp requirements.

In this way the DF doesn't have to check anything but level, like it does for other jobs, and any blue mage at level 25 would have the expected skills because they COULDN'T be level 25 without them. Some minor variation of have and have not like most jobs in FFXIV since you might be in a level 15-19 dungeon where some players have level 17 skills and some don't, but that's natural variation. To add if not obvious like the Hunting Log you can't get way later tasks done without doing your current bracket, so there is no way to run away level your job. The worst part (for design) is having to pick spells in an order that makes sense play wise and be available for each leveling group, which is a bit limiting but that's why if you notice I've just moved onto a variation of the concept. That variation in short if someone cared is basically having two job stones, the limited (chained) and unlimited (unchained) side (conceptually thinking of flipping/turning the stone in hand)- where the chained side is for DF / current content and is held back by the gilded spells in your book (DF approved spells they've learned/not learned) and the unchained side is do whatever the heck you want but you can't do current content. So using the leveling concept introduced here on the chained side you could say there is a connection between chained and unchained like SMN/SCH, but that the chained side is level capped at it's highest gilded spell in the book (highest spell that's not been skipped, so if you had 20's and 25's but not 22's then you'd only be level 22), such that the job can't join relevant content without having it's relevant kit (but your unchained side could readily go about at a much higher level and learn the skills for your chained half, making it not really stressful to learn your DF kit).

Anyway a bit late for that now.. haha, but I still think all the issues presented with blue mage could have been overcome, and ultimately there was no reason other than "they didn't want to" for the reason why blue mage is the way it is right now. Which is to be expected to happen sometimes.. I mean.. They are designing the game and all. One would expect to hear this reason come up sometimes, "I'm the driver and I really don't want to do that route, thanks". Also I imagine the cost of adding these jobs is just getting higher and higher and not doing it all is much easier. Of course, doing less costs less, but I kind of wish they didn't use the blue mage name and came up with a new concept then- allow me to stay hopeful even if it's a false hope. So ultimately that at least when I hear "we didn't want people to join in without the expected skills" or other stuff like that I don't actually find that very satisfying as it sounds more like an excuse rather than an unsolvable problem. Or to put it another way "why didn't you do what I said?" "because the door was locked" "yes, but you know to go ask Karen to get the keys" "well I just told you why I didn't do it, what more do you want?" "to go get the keys". One might say "yeah but some of those solutions are freaky/weird", but I'd say there is a decent number of people who find the current implementation of Blue Mage weird/freaky so.. c'est la vie? lol.

One thing they could have done is have a requirement on the Job Quests to Learn 4-5 spells on each one and require the final job quest to be done in order to do certain content.

BLU Mage So-and-so, for this job quest you need to go out and learn X skills!

Why can't they just stop building useless BLU only content and actually reallocate those resources into making BLU into an actual job.

They wasted a whole year to build a BLU party finder rather than working out the kinks on BLU and testing it in the regular duty finder.

The reality is that not everyone is going to play one job that's why we party up with the other jobs. Not everyone in the community wants to be a BLU so adding their own party finder or duty finder isn't exactly great.

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

They literally have a system that checks what spells you've learned for the job quests, translate that system into a "blue mage licence" from a job quest which checks what spells you've learned and boom, duty finder

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Exactly and with these new group duties Blue will have its own rotation anyway because you will need certain skills to survive it..good luck going at this with 23 people or 7 in the extreme trials and then noticing that a lot are missing skills and thus cant beat it.

Edit: And seeing how you have to do these things snych too makes BLue just another content for mostly the hardcore players, or those who have a whole group of good people. So limited and not casual at all.

Oh dear gods, Thordan EX with an all-BLU party will be hilarious.

sync'd a8s and a4s on blu
XD

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Oh dear gods, Thordan EX with an all-BLU party will be hilarious.

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Originally Posted by Crushnight

sync'd a8s and a4s on blu
XD

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https://media.giphy.com/media/l3vReO...aARG/giphy.gif

I am one of the .01% that is looking forward to this, but I do understand why people are not fond of current BLU I still play it regularly with friends just for the memes, even so I do understand why people are displeased, but I will say I would also be displeased if they limited the collection aspect or the potential for silly combos for the sake of structure.

If they add a system to allow BLU into DF I do hope SE just lets the community police themselves and simply allow groups to exercise the right to remove the player. I hope SE does not go around to a larger degree trying to "balance" skills. That is my major complaint with BLU they should have let the team working on the job have more fun with abilities and really go over the top with them give BLU a real reason to be excluded from current content outside the collection aspect.

To everyone who will invevitably say tomorrow that BLU is OP because they can do dungeons with just BLU parties

https://clips.twitch.tv/FuriousMoldyMuleBCouch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50kFN0bnXBQ

Stacking Jobs to clear content is already done and already effective to very successful degrees in some cases

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Originally Posted by Awha

I am one of the .01% that is looking forward to this, but I do understand why people are not fond of current BLU I still play it regularly with friends just for the memes, even so I do understand why people are displeased, but I will say I would also be displeased if they limited the collection aspect or the potential for silly combos for the sake of structure.

If they add a system to allow BLU into DF I do hope SE just lets the community police themselves and simply allow groups to exercise the right to remove the player. I hope SE does not go around to a larger degree trying to "balance" skills. That is my major complaint with BLU they should have let the team working on the job have more fun with abilities and really go over the top with them give BLU a real reason to be excluded from current content outside the collection aspect.

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I can see BLU being fun content if you have friends in the game willing to participate in the same. I don't. In fact, I don't even have time to trawl through PF, so I rely on DF and matchmaking for getting through content. That makes even learning BLU's abilities a nigh-impossible task for me, and I'm sad to see that 5.15 changes nothing about that (i.e., not even granting access to squadrons or PotD).

I'm happy to see they added dungeons and raids to their content but I still wish BLU was more of a regular job. I am not someone who has played a lot of FF games but the idea behind BLU is so unique and could've been a nice selling point to this game but...yup. At least allow us to do GC things with them too. Special missions maybe?

Wow, the new spells are basically more of the same, with some added tanking and healing utility, I am shocked at this innovation

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

To everyone who will invevitably say tomorrow that BLU is OP because they can do dungeons with just BLU parties

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BLU was "OP" because you could solo dungeons at the level required to unlock them...but not enough OP since you couldn't do that with lvl 50 trials

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

Wow, the new spells are basically more of the same, with some added tanking and healing utility, I am shocked at this innovation

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Well, to be honest, there's quite a bit more than that. There's an actual damage ward now, 500 potency single target heal, Raise on 5min timer, but every BLU in the group has access to that. 4 more OGCDs. Perpetual Ray sounds interesting. Also your dedicated healer BLU can still do a lot of stuff, while not healing.

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Originally Posted by Flay_wind

Well, to be honest, there's quite a bit more than that. There's an actual damage ward now, 500 potency single target heal, Raise on 5min timer, but every BLU in the group has access to that. 4 more OGCDs. Perpetual Ray sounds interesting. Also your dedicated healer BLU can still do a lot of stuff, while not healing.

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Perpetual Ray I will need to see in action, because i very doubt they'll let you stun unstunable bosses. 500 potency cure, only if youre in healer stance (more on that later), the damage ward only works in healer stance and is just worse succor. The bells and whistles added, while nice, still don't justify blu's limited existance, if anything they just add to the idea of having different specs. Speaking of specs, that stance system looks incredibly dumb and clunky

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

Perpetual Ray I will need to see in action, because i very doubt they'll let you stun unstunable bosses. 500 potency cure, only if youre in healer stance (more on that later), the damage ward only works in healer stance and is just worse succor. The bells and whistles added, while nice, still don't justify blu's limited existance, if anything they just add to the idea of having different specs. Speaking of specs, that stance system looks incredibly dumb and clunky

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I don't think stances are that clunky. Essentially aside from dedicated Healer BLUs everyone is getting +20% crit/DH. And while healer BLUs work on keeping party alive, anyone can toss an extra White Wind when needed. The worst part is 70% damage penatly on the designated tank BLU probably, since tank stance doesn't actually lets you tank it seems. =)
I dunno, i hope all that (and the rest of the yet unreleased spells and raised level cap) will actually makes BLU fun to play, and maybe gradually it will become something close to a full job some time in the future.

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Originally Posted by Flay_wind

I don't think stances are that clunky. Essentially aside from dedicated Healer BLUs everyone is getting +20% crit/DH. And while healer BLUs work on keeping party alive, anyone can toss an extra White Wind when needed. The worst part is 70% damage penatly on the designated tank BLU probably, since tank stance doesn't actually lets you tank it seems. =)
I dunno, i hope all that (and the rest of the yet unreleased spells and raised level cap) will actually makes BLU fun to play, and maybe gradually it will become something close to a full job some time in the future.

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The clunky part is turning the stances on, having to copy them from a normal job is pretty whack, also tank blu looks miserable, barely doing any damage already + having to spend gcds on mitigation