Demiatma drop rates are unacceptable

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Originally Posted by Valence

I still don't know where people are still getting that the complaint was about the actual length of the grind, but keep at the windmills.

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The basic complaint is literally about the length of the grind: Specifically, the fact that the length is potentially unbounded because there's no fallback protecting you from RNG giving you zero progress indefinitely. To quote the OP:

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Originally Posted by Arongar

I've spent roughly 7 hours grinding fates between zones and have gotten ZERO drops.

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The problem is that in this forum's characteristic fashion, there is apparently no middle ground between free-and-instantaneous and takes-until-the-heat-death-of-the-universe.

It’s because this is a functional grind people just don’t really understand probability and tend to remember bad events but not good ones

Here’s some stats for anyone interested. These aren’t perfect because distribution of Fates and CE’s on OC is not even but it gives you a ballpark figure

If you only participate in CE’s the mean number of CE’s you need to get 18 atma’s assuming they are 6 sets of 3 generated indecently and all excess is worthless is 90

Mean= 90 (18000 silver)
84% of people will have 18 before 109 (21800 silver)
97.5% of people will have 18 before 128 (25600 silver)
99.85% of people will have 18 before 147 (29400 silver)

Okay so what if you also do fates. Using 3 fates per CE

The mean number of “CE blocks” (3 fates and 1 CE) to get 18 demiatma again assuming 6 independent sets of 3 with all excess being useless is 51

Mean=51 (14790 silver)
84% of people will have 18 before 61 (17690 silver)
97.5% of people will have 18 before 72 (20880 silver)
99.85% of people will have 18 before 83 (24070 silver)

So the overwhelming amount of people will be either at or just short of the goal by the time they buy their first +0 set and only a vanishingly small minority would take till they have enough silver to get +1 to get the drops needed

For anyone interested based on requiring 3 of 6 independent atma assuming that each atma is equal (it’s not but I can’t simulate how unevenly they are distributed) the mean number of atma needed to be collected to get 18 “correct” atma is 22.2

If I was to take an extreme generalisation of bias on the distribution of the atma’s and say the two most quoted rarer ones (malachite and vedegris) are half as likely to show up as the other 4 then 99.85% of people will still have all of the atma after 147 CE blocks which is JUST enough to have enough silver to get one set of gear to +1 ignoring gold

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Originally Posted by AmiableApkallu

The basic complaint is literally about the length of the grind: Specifically, the fact that the length is potentially unbounded because there's no fallback protecting you from RNG giving you zero progress indefinitely. To quote the OP:



The problem is that in this forum's characteristic fashion, there is apparently no middle ground between free-and-instantaneous and takes-until-the-heat-death-of-the-universe.

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That's what I'd call a problem of feeling of injustice and a lack of respect from the game and not a problem of time. It's a criticism about the rng aspect of it, not the time it takes, which is similar to someone dangling a carrot in front of your face and taking it away every time you accomplish something by telling you "nope, better luck next time.... maybe, but you won't know for sure and by the way keep at it because your friend was a lot luckier and is already done with it so why not you?".
That and the lack of options to trade off the surplus atma for the one that never wants to drop.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

If I was to take an extreme generalisation of bias on the distribution of the atma’s and say the two most quoted rarer ones (malachite and vedegris) are half as likely to show up as the other 4 then 99.85% of people will still have all of the atma after 147 CE blocks which is JUST enough to have enough silver to get one set of gear to +1 ignoring gold

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Who gives a crap about Occult gear if they don't run Forked? Most people are in there just for the relic. I would have been legit mad if I had to do twice more CEs than I did in there just to grab all the malachites and/or verdigris.

Because it’s a point of comparison

Occult gear isn’t that long of a grind. If 99.8% of people would have gotten the atma by the rough time you accumulate the silver for ONE set of +1 gear then that’s not a long grind. RNG is a type of grind and RNG with rates as high as 5%/20% doesn’t have rare chase item frustration built in unless your tolerance for friction is 0

You can say “it’s not the grind it’s the RNG” but if the overwhelming majority statistically get it before even a minor milestone like +1 then there is consideration that people are just allergic to any type of grind because it’s only a vanishingly small minority who are doing a longer grind than simply +1 and more than half do less than +0

AND remember this is 3 standard deviations above the mean. More than half of players will get the atma before they even get +0.

It has nothing to do with Demiatma, but I think it still counts. Right?

https://i.imgur.com/5lKtjex.png

Still no Berserker pj after so many hours. It's frustrating.

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

Still no Berserker pj after so many hours. It's frustrating.

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And how actively were you going after it? Were you trying to spawn the CE? How often did you do the CE? All important information in determining how many chances you actually had of getting the Berserker Soul because, in theory, if you never saw that CE and yet mastered all jobs, since you never done the activity that leads to the drop, your chance of getting it is 0%.

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

Still no Berserker pj after so many hours. It's frustrating.

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RNG gonna RNG. I havent put in the time to master as many jobs as you yet(im only on 3 or 4). But my RNG has been the opposite. Almost every time i participate, i get another crystal for Berserker. The other ones that come from CEs? Havent seen a single drop yet, even though i give those my highest priority when im in zone.

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

Still no Berserker pj after so many hours. It's frustrating.

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Wow. Some insane RNG going on here. I hope you get it soon!

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

The drop rate is about 25% from CEs, so I recommend those.

I've got 8 Atma from 34 CEs, which is pretty good considering CEs spawning constantly. The drop rate probably isn't very good from FATEs, considering I've got 0 from 12 FATEs.

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When am I supposed to get them I'm at like 8 hours straight farming every CE I can get my hand on and I've gotten like 1 in the past 6 hours

I started this farm between working a full time job when it first released. I've played off and on for 2 hours each day. This is post update of 7.41 and the drop rates are still crap! I've done the Bozja and Eureka grinds and neither were as bad as this one! They just released the next series of phantom steps and I'm still stuck on the early stages! Why not an increase to the drop rates of the demiatma? It's just stupid, the grind in OC doesn't seem worth it, the game doesn't respect the player's time and offer enough reward to do the task. Dawntrail has truly left myself and so many fans disappointed. Even the grindy content is stale and dry as an old man's fart. :mad::mad::mad::mad:

$15/mo is hardly worth it anymore. I feel like I'm lying to myself thinking 8.0 will be any better.