Our passive characters and why the 2.55 story fails (BIG SPOILERS) (rant warning)

I still think they're going to tie in the main story with that of Phoenix in the coil.

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Originally Posted by Delily

Snip.

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I missed no point whatsoever. Ilberd was busy soapboxing about how Raubahn was weakened by his service to Nanamo. Would that have afforded the time to teleport? Not in the slightest. I was stating that the "tired" argument has no basis and used an exaggerated example of a far fetched and yet viable situation from a plot POV. As far as Teledji and his thugs are concerned numbers are of the smallest concern considering allies were in the room, two of which were cowards who let their friend ride the storm unaided. Hang civil war for who would be left to proclaim war after the very heads of the rebellion had been removed? The Brass Blades? The people despise them already. The Crystal Braves? No more organized than a ragged band of thieves starved for money and lusting for the same. Civil war was already in the making, Carteneau, if you don't understand. In case you were unaware, the very object from the start until Raubahn stepped in was to kill us. The excuse was already there, Lust. Lust for power and money.

Once Teledji had spilled the beans it was no holds barred. Exfil is planned before action, action taken, then leave. Not the opposite. But I waste sense on those who will not hear of it. If the blind lead the blind, both will fall into the ditch.

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Originally Posted by Intaki

No one, no matter how strong, will ever be able to beat an appropriately sized mob of thugs. You need to kill all of them, but only one of them needs to kill you.

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Thancred casually soloed them, hell a group of them died to the side-effect of Illberd vs Raubhan super-human fight. Are we playing the same game?

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Originally Posted by Wizarus

Thancred casually soloed them, hell a group of them died to the side-effect of Illberd vs Raubhan super-human fight. Are we playing the same game?

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How did Thancred do against the second group he fought with Y'shtola?

I want to add my 2 gil to this here cactpot.

I think the reason why the Scions didn't intervene was because, as Minfilia said earlier in the storyline, they wanted to remain as neutral as possible, as aiding any of the three nations could make things a little bit rough, politically. Those weren't her exact words, but that was what I got from her speech when the Scions were moving from Waking Sands to Mor Dhona. Had there been no politics involved, the Scions and the leaders probably would have jumped at the chance to help Raubahn. I think Teledji was pretty a pretty crafty villain, myself, if annoying. I won't lie, I had a smile on my face when Teledji started playing out his schemes. He was just like the devil.

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Originally Posted by Intaki

How did Thancred do against the second group he fought with Y'shtola?

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So you aren't denying my previous claims? And he was injured by signifcantly better trained Crystal Brave.

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Originally Posted by Wizarus

So you aren't denying my previous claims? And he was injured by signifcantly better trained Crystal Brave.

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Your previous claim was "he beat some people". That's great, I'm sure the WoL could beat some people too. But they can't beat ALL the people.

Basically if we put up a fight we would just be making ourselves look more guilty. While we might not know what is up, most people don't. Even we couldn't take on the cities entire armed forces and even if we did its likely the populous would believe the Monetarist's claims as we would have basically seized power over Ul'dah's lawful rulers. We would be facing major civil unrest and the collapse of the ruling institutions. At that point the other city states aiding us would only make us look more guilty.

The only option we had was to prove our innocence and that cant be done by brute force. We need the public at the very least firmly on our side and believing us. Slaughtering Ul'dah's standing police force wouldn't do that.

We can currently move around Ul'dah because there is doubt of our guilt so the majority of the populous simply wont report us unless we make a ruckus. Outside of Ul'dah, the Monetarists strength wains but due to the crimes levelled against us it makes it difficult for other powers to risk supporting us too openly. Garlemald is on the horizon and Eorzea cant afford a full blown conflict between the three city states.

Outside of that though Limsa and Gridania are still on our side. Gridania wont recognise the accusation and the Elder Seedseer has publicly said this. On top of this the Seedseers have been consulting the Elementals in hopes that they can find the missing Scions for us.

People also seem to be forgetting we weren't the only ones defending Ishgard. There were major battles at the Stone and Steel Vigils as well. Those were re enforced by soldiers, many of whom the other scions recruited from the cities. During the quests you can even find the Scions in those cities recruiting.

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Originally Posted by Intaki

Your previous claim was "he beat some people". That's great, I'm sure the WoL could beat some people too. But they can't beat ALL the people.

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You didn't say "all the people". You said a group of thugs, which Thancred soloed, Illberd/Raubahn soloed as a side-effect, and the WoL should have definately been able to solo due to previous feats that put the WoL on a completely different tier than Brass Blades.

I haven't read the whole thread, just the OP. I overall agree wholeheartedly. A few comments:

Regarding submitting to the guards, I can see that working. I was obviously framed and killing soldiers may just make things worse from a legal standpoint. Fine, that is believable. However, abandoning Raubahn was inexcusable.

The one thing you didn't point out that really irks me is Merlwyb. The Merlwyb we've known throughout the rest of the story is courageous, loyal, and doesn't put up with bull sh**. Last time sh** went down when she was present, she whipped out her guns and started shooting Sahagins.

Raubahn, Merlwyb, and Kan-E-Senna are comrades-in-arms going back to before the calamity. They watch the Sultana get murdered. Raubahn and the warrior of light, to whom they owe their lives, get betrayed. They see Raubahn get his arm cut off and they just walk away and leave him and the warrior of light who is still bound in their greatest moment of need.

"The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." 2.55 delivered a truckload of that crap. I think I speak for a lot of people in saying that one of the reasons I enjoy fantasy or superhero movies is the idea of seeing someone be powerful enough and courageous enough to fight evil and win. When it is a video game, I am living this vicariously through my character. To watch everyone, especially my character, be so spineless and dumb in the face of clear evil is truly painful.