Dark Knight Megathread

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Originally Posted by Zairava

At any rate, while the ideal is that more is going on with DRK than what we see in the benchmark, I'll take DRK confiteor over what is now easily. The combo itself could have something more going on, such as actually making use of Darkside for the first time in what, 5-6 years now?

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For sure. If what we are seeing is a Confiteor equivalent, I'm glad we're at least getting something heavy after 5.0. However, I'm still left disappointed from Endwalker after thinking Shadowbringer was gonna have its own interactions, only for it to be the most basic ability ever. Not even sure why it's locked behind Darkside in the first place. Flavor? Nostalgia for Dark Passenger?

Don't mean to be a doomer though. Nothing is set in stone until we get DT, and DRK can only get improvements at this rate. I know Yoshi said he wanted his design team to take more risks, so I hope that applies to jobs in the future too.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

it seems to be an Edge of Shadow or an upgrade of it.

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Please no... Linear skill upgrades are so boring... If it is, I hope it gets some unique functionality rather than being flat potency. It would be cool if we got an Edge of Shadow alternative (more potency but doesn't refresh Darkside as suggested by many people), but a flat upgrade would be the lamest way to go about that.

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Originally Posted by Sazuzaki

For sure. If what we are seeing is a Confiteor equivalent, I'm glad we're at least getting something heavy after 5.0. However, I'm still left disappointed from Endwalker after thinking Shadowbringer was gonna have its own interactions, only for it to be the most basic ability ever. Not even sure why it's locked behind Darkside in the first place. Flavor? Nostalgia for Dark Passenger?

Don't mean to be a doomer though. Nothing is set in stone until we get DT, and DRK can only get improvements at this rate. I know Yoshi said he wanted his design team to take more risks, so I hope that applies to jobs in the future too.

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Shadowbringer is a massive disappointment overall for me. The DS requirement is meaningless even if they wanted to add "flavor" and it essentially just looks like a ramped up Flood of Shadow. Underwhelming is an understatement.

I do hope they take more risks with jobs too, I just think it should be sooner rather than later if they really want the next 10 years to start with a bang.

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Originally Posted by Sazuzaki

Please no... Linear skill upgrades are so boring... If it is, I hope it gets some unique functionality rather than being flat potency. It would be cool if we got an Edge of Shadow alternative (more potency but doesn't refresh Darkside as suggested by many people), but a flat upgrade would be the lamest way to go about that.

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I think I wouldn't mind edge/flood so much if Darkside actually functioned as a job mechanic instead of a boring damage buff and nothing else. The rework feels incredibly incomplete. I gave them a shot and waited till Endwalker but we seen how that went. Give us attacks that use Darkside, not just require it. Let Dark Arts procs give Edge/Flood an added effect (like 400p heals) or let it empower your next oblation. Something.

We'll see down the line, I suppose.

Can't say I mind shadowbringer, in terms of the homogenized generic finishers that every job got for endwalker, it was probably one of the least egregious ones. It doesn't break the job's functionality like Doubledown, and it doesnt have an annoying animation lock like Primal Rend. I don't mind it for what it is, I'd kinda like to see a trait for it that lowers its cooldown for using Edge or something but its fine as what it is.

I'm hoping that new GCD combo they showed is more impactful though.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Can't say I mind shadowbringer, in terms of the homogenized generic finishers that every job got for endwalker, it was probably one of the least egregious ones. It doesn't break the job's functionality like Doubledown, and it doesnt have an annoying animation lock like Primal Rend. I don't mind it for what it is, I'd kinda like to see a trait for it that lowers its cooldown for using Edge or something but its fine as what it is.

I'm hoping that new GCD combo they showed is more impactful though.

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Honestly fair. I personally don't mind the jank/caveats that comes with skills so long as it's not a glaringly bad issue. My distaste for Shadowbringer comes from how safe they played Endwalker, and the worry that they'll continue to play safe in terms of job design for the foreseeable expansions. I really hope that combo was saw has more interaction than being another Confiteor.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

Can't say I mind shadowbringer, in terms of the homogenized generic finishers that every job got for endwalker, it was probably one of the least egregious ones. It doesn't break the job's functionality like Doubledown, and it doesnt have an annoying animation lock like Primal Rend. I don't mind it for what it is, I'd kinda like to see a trait for it that lowers its cooldown for using Edge or something but its fine as what it is.

I'm hoping that new GCD combo they showed is more impactful though.

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Yeah that's fair, I can't argue that. For the most part it gets lumped into "boring damage ogcd #17" for me, but rotationally it probably feels best to use between ShB, Primal Rend and Double Down. If there's a benefit to our current oGCD vomit is that we can more or less mix and match what we weave as we like/how it feels best so long as it doesn't clip our GCD.

Likewise for the GCD combo. Given the style of the animations, it leads me to believe that they might cost some of the Darkside timer, but that may just be wishful thinking.

If my hunch is correct though, it makes me wonder if it's possible that Bloodspiller itself is the catalyst and not Delirium. It opens up the possibility of more varied GCD's during downtime.

It would be fun if the new DRK combo procs off any Bloodspiller.

Agreed, but I wonder how Delirium would work then. Bloodspiller -> Combo -> Bloodspiller -> Combo -> Bloodspiller -> Combo

Honestly wouldn't mind it that much lol

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Originally Posted by Sazuzaki

Agreed, but I wonder how Delirium would work then. Bloodspiller -> Combo -> Bloodspiller -> Combo -> Bloodspiller -> Combo

Honestly wouldn't mind it that much lol

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Nah, using it so much would wear down the satisfaction of executing it quite quick.

I took the effort to compare both that animation before they give out the obvious 2 GCD's and Edge of Shadow, and they are not the same. If you look close, and I mean extremely close, you can see the Dark Knight swipe twice based on movement in the benchmark there (not withstanding the vfx themselves are different between the Benchmark and Edge of Shadow). You may have to slow it down to .25 speed like I did to really see it.

Given the amount of time it takes to go from one to the next, it is entirely possible it's another GCD. Which fits if they are essentially making Delirium DRK requiescat.

While the possibility of it being an oGCD anyway and they timed it as such on purpose is there, I think it's less likely now.

I still kinda hope Bloodspiller is the catalyst and they do something else with Delirium, either way. Who knows, maybe Delirium even becomes an attack with a potency again, lol.

True, but lets be real, it most definitely is at least a one minute burst. I honestly want them to reduce the focus on burst skills and focus on improving a jobs downtime since that's what everyone seems to hate on, including me. Don't get me wrong, I do look forward to not seeing bloodspillerbloodspillerbloodspillerbloodspiller, but in the end, the downtime still might be an actual snooze fest. Hope it doesn't seem like I'm trying to find reasons to hate on the changes, I do look forward to them and think they look way better than what we got in Endwalker.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

I still kinda hope Bloodspiller is the catalyst and they do something else with Quietus, either way. Who knows, maybe Quietus even becomes an attack with a potency again, lol.

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Trueeee, add some usage to AoEs that at least affect single target in some way. AoE skills feel like a waste of a skill slot, and honestly, could just be merged with our single target in favor of better skills. Some sort of incentive to use them during single target without looking like a dummy would be nice.

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Originally Posted by Sazuzaki

True, but lets be real, it most definitely is at least a one minute burst. I honestly want them to reduce the focus on burst skills and focus on improving a jobs downtime since that's what everyone seems to hate on, including me. Don't get me wrong, I do look forward to not seeing bloodspillerbloodspillerbloodspillerbloodspiller, but in the end, the downtime still might be an actual snooze fest. Hope it doesn't seem like I'm trying to find reasons to hate on the changes, I do look forward to them and think they look way better than what we got in Endwalker.



Trueeee, add some usage to AoEs that at least affect single target in some way. AoE skills feel like a waste of a skill slot, and honestly, could just be merged with our single target in favor of better skills. Some sort of incentive to use them during single target without looking like a dummy would be nice.

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Oops, I totally missed that I said Quietus in that post when I meant Delirium. I'll be editing that after this post...

Seeing as how we got our combo out of it, I highly doubt Quietus actually manages to survive going into Dawntrail and that the combo itself (post Bloodspiller) does aoe damage.

I really want to hold off on my pessimism until we know the full picture with DRK, because of right now outside of this combo we know nothing and can only speculate. I think even having just one more GCD to maintain would tremendously help our downtime not feel so monotonous.