BLU for Duty Finder and Raids! Show your support!

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Originally Posted by jon041065

Yep, I still remember the days of brd being best raiding job and people switching to wanting paladins instead of warriors after leveling was done.

I feel that most on my side do hope that the open world and Carnival content does well. We just want "limited jobs" to fail. To me, that means that SE will hopefully see that they had a lot of people that were enjoying the game already and that they had some misses with side content for people that wanted things other than endgame. Then they see the Carnival do well and that leads them to putting resources towards content like that and getting a better focus on where to target their experiments. That they also see that those of us that were already enjoying the game don't want limited jobs and they fix that issue. Hopefully ending up with a better overall game for MORE players and less of a game that focuses on one group then swaps which group gets the focus.

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Except you can't do Carnival without doing a limited job. So if Carnival does well, so will limited jobs. It will be like Eureka: "Well, if people are running Eureka just for the relic, that means Eureka is doing well". Therefore for SE, "If people are running BLU just for the Carnival, that means limited jobs are doing well."

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Originally Posted by BubblyBoar

This topic was specifically for getting BLU in the DF and in raids. I really don't want a job to be missing out on core content.

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I agree. People come here protecting solo playstyle but lets be honest, once you hit level cap, got all your skills and also beat all stages of the masked carnival, got all the rewards from it - be it mounts, minions, glam. It will die out as a side content and then people will slowly realize that BLU is just wasted resources like Diadem.
And because I do not want this to happen to any other future limited job, I support this thread as well. Better act earlier than later, so you dont regret it.

Edit: Also, meme time!
BLU: Hmm I want to do some trials, I have to go with a party finder group, I guess...
BLU: Oh look there is a open party, a slot for a DPS!
You join the party.
BLU: Oh 3 other BLU's, how cool!
3 hours later, 1 Healer joined.
Healer left the party.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Except you can't do Carnival without doing a limited job.

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While that was completely not the intended design, I will liken Carnival and BLU to Palace of the Dead and RDM. RDM is more or less the only job that can reliably make it that down, and as far as I know, the only job who cleared it. PotD is RDM's solo experience, its own Masked Carnival. And it can perform well enough in all other forms of content. PotD is all the better an example because PotD caps you at 60, while RDM right now is at current 70 cap and will rise to 80 comes ShB.
There is nothing stopping them from pursuing a similar design, this time intentionally, with BLU, or any job they wish to introduce in the future with a similar system. Hell, I actually join people who say to give all jobs something like that. It awards the people who already play the job, and lures people who don't at the same time. Plus, more content, which is what we're all into.

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So if Carnival does well, so will limited jobs. It will be like Eureka:

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And if it doesn't, they'll just put something a lot of people want behind it, like they did with Eureka. It's successful for all the wrong reasons and there will be a time where no matter the carrot, people will refuse to ride the treadmill. This is all the truer for BLU where by definition they can't put something truly relevant to other jobs behind Masked Carnival. Eureka at least catered to all jobs. Carnival doesn't.

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"If people are running BLU just for the Carnival, that means limited jobs are doing well."

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To be fair, given what BLU is right now, there is no other "definition of success" available. Though I'd say it's BLU that's doing well, not limited jobs. For one, we only have the one right now. Second, there's no guarantee that even if they introduced more limited jobs in the future that they'd follow similar success.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Except you can't do Carnival without doing a limited job. So if Carnival does well, so will limited jobs. It will be like Eureka: "Well, if people are running Eureka just for the relic, that means Eureka is doing well". Therefore for SE, "If people are running BLU just for the Carnival, that means limited jobs are doing well."

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Did you just read a few words of my post and then replied? The Carnival itself can do well and show SE another successful form of side content they can make like they have with deep dungeons and avoid making more things like Diadem. The Carnival doing well doesn't translate to "jobs that we rather not balance to make work in the full game so will put them in the own special box in the game" is a good idea.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

Did you just read a few words of my post and then replied? The Carnival itself can do well and show SE another successful form of side content they can make like they have with deep dungeons and avoid making more things like Diadem. The Carnival doing well doesn't translate to "jobs that we rather not balance to make work in the full game so will put them in the own special box in the game" is a good idea.

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You can't do Carnival without BLU. If Carnival will be doing well, that means BLU adoption rates are high. Which is a success for BLU in SE's book.

If somehow most of the playerbase boycotts BLU, Carnival will barely be ran. Which will make SE consider BLU a failure, because people both haven't unlocked BLU and ran Carnival.

Carnival success is tied inexorably to BLU success. Even if people pull an Eureka with BLU and just get BLU solely to run Carnival, it won't be considered just a successful Carnival but also a successful BLU.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Carnival success is tied inexorably to BLU success. Even if people pull an Eureka with BLU and just get BLU solely to run Carnival, it won't be considered just a successful Carnival but also a successful BLU.

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The comparison is flawed because you don't really have anything to do with BLU OTHER than the Carnival. If you're not going to run the Carnival, you might as well not pick up BLU at all, with how the system's set up, they're interchangeable.
And I guarantee to you that a lot more people would've tried the Masked Carnival if BLU wasn't a limited job. Because if they already unlocked the job, they'd give the Carnival a try. The other way around, though? Where BLU is limited and all you have to do with it is the Carnival? You'd see lower numbers, by far.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

You can't do Carnival without BLU. If Carnival will be doing well, that means BLU adoption rates are high. Which is a success for BLU in SE's book.

If somehow most of the playerbase boycotts BLU, Carnival will barely be ran. Which will make SE consider BLU a failure, because people both haven't unlocked BLU and ran Carnival.

Carnival success is tied inexorably to BLU success. Even if people pull an Eureka with BLU and just get BLU solely to run Carnival, it won't be considered just a successful Carnival but also a successful BLU.

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Oh boy. What part of "Then they see the Carnival do well and that leads them to putting resources towards content like that and getting a better focus on where to target their experiments." are you having a hard time with??
I never said any job besides blue mage can be used in the Carnival.

The success of the Carnival wouldn't have to be a strictly "how many players are running it" thing. There could be a lot that run it once to finish and then move on but still say that they liked it. The player approval rate could be high without the actual player engagement with the Carnival being high and still be considered a success. It gives the devs more proof of the correct direction to go with side content.

Also, the success of blue mage and the Carnival are not the same. The Carnival could be amazing content but still have a lot of players feeling that blue mage was not the right way in which to interact with such content. Likewise, people could love blue mage and wish it was available in the full game while saying that they didn't enjoy the Carnival.

I'm also not convinced the Carnival can't exist without BLU.

The way they've been talking about it, it reminds me of the old Warlock green fire questline from WoW. For the folks that don't know what I'm talking about- the green fire questline involved a Warlock player going through their own solo scenario before eventually reaching an extremely difficult boss (for most people anyway, unless you over-geared the fight) that expected you to utilize spells and abilities that you'd almost never use in serious content but were unique to the Warlock class to get through. Sounds almost exactly like BLU, except BLU will have more than one fight.

Here's the catch though- when the next expansion rolled around they created the 'Mage Tower' which was similar to the Warlock green fire boss, except it was adapted to have several different versions depending on what class you were.

Atleast, this is what it sounds like to me. That and maybe a combination of the Brawler's Guild. Anyway the point I'm trying to make is this- the natural progression of this concept seems to be allowing all jobs to do something similar to it. Which is what they should have done from the start if they were actually serious about giving people more solo content. As it stands now, the Carnival doesn't exactly sound skill based. I may be wrong, but it looks like your success in it will be completely dependent on what abilities you bring in with you. I don't really see a future for the Carnival once you have all your abilities and the boss fights are discovered, not without adapting variations of it for other jobs.

I'd much rather the Carnivale be expanded for any other limited jobs they release, consolidating those resources into one avenue like Eureka, instead of just one thing for one job.

Thematically it could work well. Beastmaster could have a lion tamer/circus ringmaster vibe to it, Mime would fit right in there, and Onion Knight could have a kind of toy knight or joke weapon theme to it.

This way you provide a decent avenue for limited jobs that doesnt strip resources from the rest of the game (if it takes the place of eureka tupe content) while benefiting more people with just one type of content.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

I'd much rather the Carnivale be expanded for any other limited jobs they release, consolidating those resources into one avenue like Eureka, instead of just one thing for one job.

Thematically it could work well. Beastmaster could have a lion tamer/circus ringmaster vibe to it, Mime would fit right in there, and Onion Knight could have a kind of toy knight or joke weapon theme to it.

This way you provide a decent avenue for limited jobs that doesnt strip resources from the rest of the game (if it takes the place of eureka tupe content) while benefiting more people with just one type of content.

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Go look at the onion knight/freelancer ideas then and I mean ideas beyond just the name of the job. Does what you say here (minus the Carnival specific things you mentioned) but doesn't limit other jobs that DO have options to make them work with the full game. "Limited job" as something like that would have a lot more support.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ue-Limited-Job