PLD dps needs to be buffed, current dps a joke

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie-Amber

war physical tank dark magic tank and pld a second physical tank that isn't needed but for some reason has healing ability's. but unless they lower clemency's mp cost or buff plds mp its still a gimmick skill.

gladiator quest lv 20 or 25 I know the lead gladiator used medica so if you queue pld que as a healer hybrid rather than a tank and adjust its ability in healing like so.

Heck even whms can tank and last as long as a pld.

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Hybrid, I think a few people asked for such a class, buy Yoshi-P San said not a fan of doing hybrids. I stand to be corrected on that.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

No the problem was having a tank focused on "surviving"...whereas it's only the basic requirement of tanks.
It's like saying WHM is the healer than can...keep everyone alive.

Duh...

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Well that would mean somewhat giving all tanks equal survivability with equal DPS?

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Originally Posted by Faeon

Well that would mean somewhat giving all tanks equal survivability with equal DPS?

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Well, no...that would mean giving tanks equal survivability and something unique that could create different setups (based on OT, basically) where each setup would have the same overall DPS.

Here's what I posted on another topic (The idea is still that if you have a PLD as an OT, you only need one healer, and if you have a DRK as an OT, you don't need Songs or Turrets to give ressources) :

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Let's suppose the following DPS numbers (Numbers probably not accurate, but the idea is there):

• MT : 600 (Since we're talking hypothetical adjustments, why not all tanks doing around the same DPS when MT'ing? :p)
• Healers : 300 DPS when they don't have to heal all the time, 0 when they're on full heal duty
• "Refresher" : 800 DPS since they have to reduce their damage to refill MP or TP
• Full fledged DPS : 1200
• WAR OT : 1000 (It'll be used as a base to adjust other tanks OT DPS)

First setup :Any MT/WAR OT/2 healers who can DPS/1 Refresher/3 DPS
600+1000+300+300+800+1200+1200+1200 = 6600 overall DPS.

Second setup :Any MT/PLD OT/1 healer full healing duty/1 Refresher/4 DPS
600+x+0+800+1200+1200+1200+1200=6200+x overall DPS.
=> So a PLD OT would need to do around 400 DPS. Even less than when MT'ing since he'll probably use most of its GCD on healing duty and probably only do incomplete Riot Blade combo to refill its MP.

Third setup :Any MT/DRK OT/2 healers who can DPS/4 DPS
600+y+300+300+1200+1200+1200+1200=6000+y overall DPS.
=> So a DRK OT would need to do around 600 DPS.
Same as MT. It could mean that neither of its stance should really affects its damage output, or that he'd use both stances even when OT'ing.

Again, my numbers are probably not really accurate but the ratio could be calculated to obtain the same results.

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Originally Posted by Faeon

Well that would mean somewhat giving all tanks equal survivability with equal DPS?

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Tanks are already at arguably equal survivability with DRK being badly behind in Physical mitigation while not that far ahead in magical. The problem is there isn't much to differentiate between them aside from DPS and utility.

There are, as I imagined, no PLD changes in patch 3.07, whereas DRK got a bit of a buff with their TP usage under Blood Weapon, so I guess PLD is going to continue to rot as the non-meta tank because SE thinks its fine and its not quite horrible enough of a class to go entirely unused like AST was.

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Originally Posted by NFaelivrin

so I guess PLD is going to continue to rot as the non-meta tank because SE thinks its fine and its not quite horrible enough of a class to go entirely unused like AST was.

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Possibly because the issues, if there are in fact issues are only in a very small part of the game, outside of alex PLD has no problems. At that it just seems like its alex savage too. So maybe in 3.1 the may offer up something, but theres only a 50/50 chance they will and theres only a 25% chance of that.

^Balance changes are usually made with the highest difficulty content in mind. Monk had no issues outside Savage either.

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Originally Posted by NFaelivrin

There are, as I imagined, no PLD changes in patch 3.07, whereas DRK got a bit of a buff with their TP usage under Blood Weapon, so I guess PLD is going to continue to rot as the non-meta tank because SE thinks its fine and its not quite horrible enough of a class to go entirely unused like AST was.

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Balancing a class based on current content alone is a bad move. Right now you think DRK is "balanced"... But DRK is "bad", remember when these forums full of threads about DRKs getting kicked out of Ravana/Bismarck Ex groups? DRK is only in a "good place" because it is "balanced" for Alexander Savage. Try tanking Twintania as a DRK with ilv90.

When SE fixed WAR's mitigation because Turns 4 and 5 (the only content that WAR couldn't tank like PLD), they "took away" a lot of WAR's self healing in order to give it mitigation. What are you willing to give away as a PLD in order to get DRK's DPS?

Also according to "actual data" collected from around the web and posted on another thread, PLD DPS isn't a joke. It is actually on par with DRK. And before people argue this is of no consequence like they argued video parses, this serves as an INDICATOR, just like how dummy parses do. That's their purpose.

In any regard, the only reasons someone wouldn't take a PLD to raid while still looking for a tank is either already having one or sheer stupidity.

EDIT: MNK has the issue of not being the top DPS position it was supposed to be. DRG and NIN raise raid DPS while MNK doesn't. MNK being behind DRG and NIN while still not providing raid DPS like them just signed the seal of them being left out.

I'm sure the game testers have played the game with different party make-ups for all content and has been cleared. So is it the mentality that if " I can't do it, no one can" or "its my game and I want to beat it now". I know no game is really fully tested until it reaches the general public. If DPS checks aren't met is it really the fault of the tank, PLD specifically, because it has the lowest, which we know is intentional. So are the DPS classes off then? The age old controversy of tank DPS, which isn't their primary concern. I see some people want PLD to be all 3, tank, DPS, healer. Where does it stop? If PLD gets an adjust to more DPS then what will be the flavor of the month next? Because it will shift to something else, it'll never stop.

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Originally Posted by Phoenicia

SNIP.

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But that is how SE is going to balance the jobs, they said so themselves, "will wait till savage to see what needs to be changed"