FF14 is not made for hardcore players.

I didn't read all 10 pages that were new but the necro got some fantastic mileage out of it. This thread really did not need to be rehashed.

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Originally Posted by CrayonsAndPaint

kid ur bad

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This is the sort of toxicity and elitism that OP was warning against.

Elitism is one of the reasons why WoW is dying and FFXIV is now the king. We can go back to WoW and get Mplus keys over level 15 deal with the toxic gatekeepers that check for a 2000 Raider.IO rating and rage quit the second we wipe.

I seen to many "hardcore" players cry when anything goes wrong and just bash on others. That is not giving advice, that is just raging. If you like the challenge sooo much, the so call "bad" players can make your duties harder, right? Thats sounds good to me.

I played WoW for like 12 years and I did mostly normal/heroic and I only "got gud" after wiping to the bosses over and over till I learned what the bosses do. I wont blow CDS before like phase 2 when the bosses just talk and more. Asking random people to do the same 99% parse after the elites did the same bosses 300 times is just silly.

I enjoy being a casual here and the FFXIV community. The people is so nice and chill and I never trade it for my old MMO days.

What's the whole point of this? The game isn't a hardcore but casual game.

I would argue there isn't a single very popular and large MMO that revolves around being hardcore. Making an MMO like that is sure death.

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Originally Posted by iheartlove42

The games content focus actively discourages this, because it's not focused solely on end game raiding. And Square Enix isn't gonna go and hire hardcore raiders to dev their game like WoW did and then hand them the keys after selling to a bigger corporation (no seriously Ion belonged to and ran a forum and guild called Elitist Jerks, Blizzard hired them to basically take over WoW post-Cata). If they do hire any hardcore raiders to dev they'll be forced to stay the current coursel because Final Fantasy games are vision oriented. So even when YoshiP has moved on to whatever he does next after FF14 and FF16, it's likely they won't be able to turn it into a l337 hardcore raider game. I could only see that happening if YoshiP or SE was like "we're making a new FF mmo", putting FF14 into a less heavy focus since it's likely much of the population will migrate there.

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Most of the hardcore WoW raiders I know turn casual once they come to FFXIV, the rest are happy to keep trying the Ultimates. One thing to keep in mind is WoW is extremely endgame oriented AND Blizzard wants that endgame to be an esport with all the publicity that comes with that. FFXIV isn't that. It would need a pretty deep change in design direction to get a WoW style endgame. And without the WoW style endgame this breed of tryhard won't have the chance to develop here.

...Note I am not saying trying hard is bad, I am talking about those people who ran guilds in WoW like they were going for world first. It's a very weird experience to see people playing like they're trying to place in a race they're not in.

Ultimate Savage Endgame is glamour kupo. Everybody can participate! <3 kupo

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Originally Posted by Krojack

What's the whole point of this? The game isn't a hardcore but casual game.

I would argue there isn't a single very popular and large MMO that revolves around being hardcore. Making an MMO like that is sure death.

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That says more about people at large then it says about the games doing that. Most don't gravitate towards things being hard

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Originally Posted by MilitaryVet123

The toxicity aside, what this shows is that players expect Extreme/Savage-level competence from casual players

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Id like to see where anyone has said this. In fact from the “git gud” side of things, I’ve seen arguments for competence yet they have explicitly said no one is expecting players to optimize to hard core and raid levels.

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Originally Posted by Izanagi_Fiaresu

Here's the thing with guilds like Limit, Echo, Method etc coming over from WoW? I can see the game skewing to a more meta end game focused community. People copying them, and being better players than they think they are. That's my worry

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Those groups are struggling to get respect from FFXIV players, so I doubt they're going to gain any serious influence here. Limit faking their blind prog kind of soured a lot of people.

It should be pointed out that the OP is the type to start controversial threads consistently. From calling the community toxic, to poc and lgbt representation, to requiring trigger warnings.

While this community (the forum community) is usually quick to dismiss people as trolls, this guy for some reason has been entertained throughout all the controversy they stir.

Nothing will make this individual satisfied. You’ll never check enough boxes. But the bait will keep coming