This is another really good example of how much the lips and irises got messed up.
And the one above this post, oh no.
Printable View
Yeah, these are the lips for mine (face 4)
they just got sooo destroyed. Theres no fixing them or using this face until Square gets their shit together
https://i.imgur.com/RhHbFiQ.png https://i.imgur.com/vZ7Sdjj.png
I wrote up a post on some feedback for Male Viera face 3 (eyes, lips, and lip color) over here: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...50#post6439150
Tossing it in this thread in case my thread gets buried. Hopefully the devs see everyone's feedback :)
Face 3 bungirl here...
- Her lips no longer have a subtle shine.
- Her top eyelashes are so much darker and make her appear more mature.
- Her eyebrows are lighter.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...023c5f92feaa1&
I do think it helps to look at them in the actual benchmark cutscene. CharGen lighting is always rough, imo, I was a little apprehensive until I saw them in action. Having been through some rough character model updates in Destiny and Warframe that completely ruined my look, I'm pleasantly surprised by how good my pair came out.
https://i.imgur.com/GFrIFk7.png https://i.imgur.com/LVdsGxk.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/5D0iTAP.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/aotLWEv.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/3hedxFZ.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/OOCqy3Q.png
Adding my mutilated girl to the thread as proof of how shafted we were. I genuinely don't understand how this passed QA. I hope SE listens to player feedback and YoshiP delays the release of Dawntrail to put more time into fixing these awful face "updates." I'm absolutely, 100% willing to wait longer for a higher quality experience than this. The current graphics look like an improvement to the new ones.
And, before anyone comes in saying "bUt ThE BenChMarK": I've tweaked graphics settings, changed gamma, tweaked colors on my character itself, ran the benchmark to see her in different lighting- absolutely none of it fixes bad textures, bad shaders, and bad model updates.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLJYLa5X...jpg&name=large
Although the eyes do seem to look better in 'live' lighting, the pupils for Veena remain much smaller than they used to be, and the mouth changes felt even worse in the benchmark trailer than in Chargen, to me at least.
The loss of the "cupid's bow" for the top lip, the changed shape of the bottom lip, and the much darker color of the mouth (for fair-skinned characters) are hugely off-putting when taken together for some of us.
I'm one of the many Face 3 players, so maybe it's worse for some faces than others, but seeing the textures and models in action sadly isn't a cure-all.
I never thought I'd be using the forums either but here we are...
My girl got massacred using Face 4 as well. Hoping to find another who shares the same thought's I had.
I'm using face 4 mouth 3. Lips now look like they had injections... The lipstick also feels really awful now in comparison.
https://i.imgur.com/0syrbJr.png
https://i.imgur.com/hLtDX7E.png
Everyone else I've asked says they barely see a difference. All I hope is that this is a work in progress.
I hadn't noticed until I went to make a proper visual comparison, but Face 3 also has an altered (more rounded) chin shape, and the eyes I'm using (Style 4) have an altered shape because the eyelashes are faint and sparse.
https://i.imgur.com/NgEidtN.png
Anyway. I hate to repeat all the complaints I've already shared so I'll leave it with a visual comparison to go with the text. Endwalker on the left and Dawntrail on the right, if that wasn't obvious.
Hello! Made a forum account to talk about this ^^
Cons:Pros:
https://gyazo.com/7b9a487e2fd52ce06353250a5e074f9c.jpg
Glowstick earsI'm uncertain if this was intentional or not, but in certain lighting the ears look like glowsticks?LipsThe lips now have a lot less depth to them/appear washed out but have a stronger color, I have tried messing with the lip color options and between light/dark there's not really a way to get a natural looking pinky/red lip that reflects what he used to have.EyesThe eyelashes have become a lot more sparse even with the lashes setting checked. The eyeshine is less of an issue but I will admit in certain lighting (if not all) it makes him appear more lifeless/soulless.EyebrowsThe eyebrows are incredibly more sparse now, which is not very flattering on my boy especially with his light hair. I hope for an eyebrow color toggle so I can darken the hair color a bit so they come back!
https://i.gyazo.com/7d95b56e01b19026...fdd76f541f.jpg
Strange Lightinghttps://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...b8cd75436a6c5&
In a lot of the lighting its making my character look a lot more, harsh? Than he normally looks. It washes out the already light eyebrows, and intensifies the darkness around the nose. Previously he was able to look good in these areas, but due to the lighting updates it now looks very unnatural and strange. I feel like due to this lighting he's loss depth in a lot of places that he used to have some, making him look very flat.
MoleSelf evident but something went wrong with his mole :(
https://gyazo.com/0e70aa5f7208781a26540322a0f65efa.jpg
Watching the actual benchmark didn't really fix a lot of these issues either, and you can start to tell just how inconsistent he looks, the starting scene did NOT help his lifeless eyes at all LOL
https://gyazo.com/fe131b2fd131749a870ec61bdb228052.jpgOverall in basically every other lighting he looks worse to me, I've tried to mess with the gamma, and to mess with the color settings of his lips/eyes/hair with little success of getting rid of the "weirdness".
He looks less cursed and actually decent in exactly this angle and lighting from the Limsa character creator BG.
This is ridiculous and needs to be changed. They really messed up the eyes, lips and skin lighting. Now my bunny looks soulless and deaD.:(
And no this is not a character creation lighting issue. My character looks so different and off even in the benchmark.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...f615a7ce45993&
I feel like I wasn't shafted nearly as much as others on here but it still hurts to see how dirty they did my rava boy, especially when he looks perfectly fine as a veena TT. I've heard heaps of people talking about how the graphics update will fix all the issues with darker skin tones but it still feels like the same is happening again :C. Why does he look simultaneously ashy *and* covered in oil, and the skin looks so translucent and textureless. The extra shine on the nose makes the nose look even less viera-like than it already does, and the eye whites being so much lighter than 6.58 makes him look uncanny from far away.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLKuMeAb...pg&name=medium
veena for comparison (why is the skin so much better TT):
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLKu77Ga...png&name=small
and original for comparison (I'm shocked by how much warmer the La Noscean Lighting is here too what happened :C):
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...efa40a017fbed&
I hate to say but I actually like that I can tell what colour my Veena's eyes are now. Even if they made the pupils bigger but kept some actual saturation it'd be fine, but in pre- 7.0 I have light pink eyes and everyone (and I mean everyone) thinks they're grey or olive green (somehow) unless looking EXTREMELY closely. I'd like if they could keep some saturation and brightness to them while having some distinction, but I'd prefer what we have now over the dull muddied eye texture we had before.
Well, I'm not sure why, but the tattoo I used for my Viera boy's look is also totally weird now; I couldn't recreate it the same way in the character creator, and I fear the only way to do so is lightening his skin color which I DON'T want to do, so I hope they can at the least fix this since it seems simple enough. (Sorry about difference in image size)
Before
https://images2.imgbox.com/7a/c0/da0r0xxJ_o.png
After
https://images2.imgbox.com/11/8c/xC9F40Xn_o.png
The nose changes are a crime as well... :confused: Looking at all of the before and afters, the large majority of Viera looked way better before! Please fix this, Square...
I am soooooo unhappy with the Viera changes. My bunboy looks absolutely soulless now. His lips are way darker than before and it just... He does not look like the same guy. First image is from when I first made my bunboy in the ew benchmark. The following two images are from the dt benchmark. He looks waxy and lifeless now. He lacks emotion and he does not look like my viera anymore. I tried my best to get as close to the angle and camera position as I could from the screenshot, but it's not exactly the same.
I don't understand why they had to change such small things. Update the graphics, yes, please, just don't change things that really didn't need to be changed, like taking the life out of his eyes and giving him wax lips.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLLdPF5X...pg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLLdRjzW...pg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLLdS0VW...pg&name=medium
The actual trailer and not the character creator is how I first viewed my bunboy, but he just looks...awful... He really looks like he's a wax figure or something. He doesn't look like the same bunboy.
https://i.ibb.co/vzjb2R4/GLLWWGu-XEAAFr-Yo.jpg
I was able to find a better angle screenshot from the ew benchmark to compare to a current screenshot from the dt benchmark and yeah he still looks terrible in the dt one and gamma and hues aren't going to change it, and neither will changing his facial features, since then he really won't be the same anymore.
This is like, "Can we have Fenrir?" "We have Fenrir at home!"
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLLi0FXX...pg&name=medium
The Fenrir at home:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLLdRjzW...pg&name=medium
Call me dramatic but I genuinely may not touch my sweet viera again if this is how they stay looking because I get so uncomfortable looking at that waxen and soulless face
https://i.imgur.com/YZrdAOu.png
I'm really happy with my bunboy overall and I don't understand how seemingly only my character's lips did not get mutilated beyond recognition [had to stop to put Ween on]
that being said I really want them to do something about the altered highlight patterns on certain hairstyles. For me It looks like there's a whole chunk of white highlight missing from the front of the hairline. You can even see one strand just cuts off and it's making the hair look like it's just been AI upscaled with no oversight >.>
I'd prefer it if the devs could address the beesting mouths [not mine tho, i'm happy with mine!] and the backlit skin first but I would love to see it fixed - I can't cover it up with a hat after all!
Is this Face 2, by chance? Many of us complaining about the botched mouths are Face 3 players, though Face 4 for M Viera was dramatically impacted too.
Your character's lips also seem darker than they used to be, but the shape change looks much less dramatic than I've seen in my character.
I'm using face 2, yeah! Overall I think the changes to the lips I used [4? i think?] were positive and the cupid's bow bit in particular looks much better. I did have to change the lip colour as even with the same settings the lips were like a gnarly dark red like they were grazed up. Had to swap to a flat grey to get a similar colour. Literally the only change I had to make though for me my problems begin and end with the wonky hair.
Oof, I'm not surprised the color was way off at first. The lips seem way darker than they used to be across the board. I had Lip Color turned off on my character and had to enable it just to try and get close to what I had before. (Which I was willing to consider only because 'Lip Color' doesn't come with a super glossy effect anymore. Not sure what I'll do if they add back the glossiness but don't adjust the color.) Glad to hear the changes to the mouth shape worked out for the better, though! I honestly hadn't really looked at the other faces outside what I've seen here. Too devastated by my poor Face 3 bun.
left is current graphics, right is 7.0
https://i.imgur.com/j2UkSk3.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/nuYNmPH.png
this is nose 6 i believe? on face 1 male viera, and i know they wanted to smooth the models a bit to make it higher quality, but i feel like they've smoothed things down a bit TOO much, and it's removed much of the personality and uniqueness in some of the facial features. i really like the little nose bump and pointed end of this nose, but now it looks so rounded, and it gives off a completely different feel :( the dark nose marking is also barely visible, and i'd like to see it restored to its original colour
I do appreciate all the work the devs did with the update but I agree with a lot of the complaints here.
The eye tattoo (Tattoo 1) is a lot lighter compared to before, the nose is a bit too dark (I didnt choose the darken nose option for this either and it also still looks too dark even in the light), and the lips without the gloss is very bland/strange.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...ed6fd65e4b293&
Old (Left) - 7.0/New (Right)
I hope someone from Square can pass a lot of the comments from here to the team or I hope JP is also giving the same kind of feedback about Vieras on their side.
I am honestly baffled by the changes... My Viera is one of those affected by this and I'm not happy at all.
Top is the current and bottom is the one in the benchmark
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLHNi2Mb...g&name=900x900
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLHNgvCb...g&name=900x900
He completely lost his cute and soft vibes, skin color became yellowish compared to the pinkish in the previous one. His beauty mark is gone and don't get me started on the lips... I really do wish they somehow fix this whether it's sooner or later just give me back my soft cute pretty bunboy...
I'm very pleased with the changes made to my female Miqo'te (face 4), but my Viera definitely suffered. I'm being slightly over-dramatic, but her mouth shape is wrong now, she lost most definition and the little dip that the top lip usually has. The coloring on her nose also seems to have been made worse, I've seen posts about this issue for male Viera as well.
Also, I believe that there's some kind of bug where all Viera are using Rava pupils, because this doesn't seem "Veena" to me.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...feddda2215839&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...b5c5c7c06beb3&
This is my first time using the official forum so pardon if the format comes off looking odd but i really gotta get this out of my system :(
Adding in my girls (Top/Left is Current, Bottom/Right is Benchmark)
For reference sake, I'm using Face 1 with Eye 3 and Mouth 4 options (Rava) and Face 1 with Eye 4 and Mouth 4 (Veena)
Using Max Graphics settings as well
Rava
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...ba5dd01e594b8& https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...b4868abf5fb69&
Veena
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...5b78fafc12924&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...3656bcf1744ae&
The prominent features that can be seen are the eye shape and the mouth shape for both buns. I will be using my Rava as examples in the images below:
EYES (this is WITH facial features + eyeshadow facepaint)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...0009fac471776& https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...89adf3587f773&
EYES (this is WITHOUT facial features + eyeshadow facepaint)
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...0210e4cc773ce&https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7982a9b191528&
Mouth/Lips
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...ac8d34c5cbdac& https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...9155ea840812f&
I have tried using them in the benchmark cutscenes and while yes, it does look better in comparison to the CC, it doesn't change that our Vieras eye and mouth shapes are changed and it does irk me....
Hopefully they would take a look into the forums and are able to change!
after keeping track of this thread and seeing all of the male viera that were done dirty from the update, I was very afraid on how my main would turn out.
https://i.gyazo.com/79c0b253de5f7f3b...3f9dd43617.jpg
all things considered though, I got off incredibly lucky. he's practically untouched outside of a few minor gripes. not a fan of how lips are handled, but I can live with it because the shape didn't change that much. I was always impartial on the rabbit nose, but I can completely sympathise with people being upset at its current implementation because it looks pretty scuffed. eyebrow roots definitely need to be darker/thicker all round though, they appear to be very thin for most chars I've seen in general.
my condolences to everyone that was wronged by the graphics update, and I hope SE can make changes to not alienate so many people. I haven't seen general discussion this hopped up like... ever.
My face 3 bun also got disrespected by the benchmark;; He looks so flat and lifeless now, and they somehow managed to make the dull colours even duller -- plus the lips are too stark, and the nose feels totally wrong :') I really do pray they'll rework it, i don't think i could keep playing bun like this....
https://i.imgur.com/GoMTf8b.png https://i.imgur.com/AvG9xNC.png
Face 2 female Viera. Not super pleased with the flatness of the face. She is missing a certain warmth and roundness that she possessed previously. Her lips have minimal dimension, shape, or shading. I mean... it isn't awful, and I'm sure a lot of work went into this, but I think it missed the mark. She's not the character I originally created and that's disappointing. I hope things improve before launch.
Before:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...f49b79348c360&
After:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...87571c319aa9d&
I originally made my Viera with big candid eyes to reflect the way she was discovering the world around her. I've always had this idea in mind of her learning how the world works and being welcoming, heart warming despite all odds. Which was great given the story actually turned out to fit perfectly around this.
With the update it feels she lost all her warmness and candid face. She has a stern cold look, and can't stop smirking. It feels like another character entirely.
https://i.imgur.com/A7nugly.png
https://i.imgur.com/arMTVOW.png
https://i.imgur.com/UPa0RiG.png
https://i.imgur.com/dvvLPdz.png
Veena: Face 4
I really am displeased with how my Veena turned out, her lips are terrible for one. Her eyebrows look to be painted on. The skin being.. flat also makes her look more harsh, and well, lifeless. It feels like she's lost all her visual personality.
The Veena pupils being smaller is also really disheartening, I really am a fan of the small differences between the 'clan' options in game.
During the benchmark cutscenes, it helped her look a bit better than the character creator, but those lips man.
The first picture is current, the second picture is benchmark.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...324c9ec017786&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...cfed8d66e3aef&
actually made a forum acc cause of the changes. A lot of people have said the same kinds of things but face 3 m viera just look... off?
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...a070b411ba9d5&
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...3fa3ee6d7756c&
First is EW second was the benchmark. He looks kinda waxy now and i had to adjust his skintone a little cause something about the original looked off. Definitely nerfed his eyelashes :(
my little beauty mark wasnt working properly but i havent seen others have this issue so might just be my benchmark being funny.
I think the nose mark was nice being subtle since the other faces had more prominent ones.
And others have said this but the ear textures def are not finished, and the catchlights being gone make them look pretty dead inside.
Hopefully its a wip? fingers crossed :eek:
I love that Veena now have bright eyes like Rava, not arguing against anyone that doesn't like it because if you liked the older ones they're very different now so that's entirely fair, but for me personally that is a big upgrade. And other than a few exceptions that have some wonkiness, I think the hair looks wonderful as well.
My biggest complaints though are the eyebrow textures, and the lips. The lips have lost that subtle curve between the lips, it's a straight line now that changes the expression of the mouth and makes them look more sausage like.
Eyebrows already had kind of poor definition, and Veena especially has sparse and thin brows, but now they also became so... smudgy? I also tried it on one of my Rava presets, and it's way too easy to make your eyebrows melt into your skin now even with their fuller brows.
In the live game right now it was already a little difficult to make them show if you want to have lightly tanned skin and a creamy blonde hair, but now even the compromised skin + hair I settled on doesn't work anymore. Even in the benchmark lighting.
Face 3 Veena for reference.
How she looks now vs. after
https://i.imgur.com/717EPyQ.jpg
Browless and confused in the benchmark
https://i.imgur.com/1cP06Od.png
https://i.imgur.com/aLOz5J8.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/OGVmA20.png
Before / After
- There's that glitch with the beauty mark on male face 3 where it just shows up as a thin black line.
- The flat mouth line removes detail and makes the lips look less defined.
- His eyebrows have been lightened and look sparser.
- The inner corner of the eyes has been shortened, which noticeably changes the eye shape.
- Eyeliner shape is jagged.
- The bunny nose detail has been darkened (at least on his fair complexion). Personally, I actually don't have an issue with how it looks, but I do agree that this should be something that players should be able to toggle.
- His lashes also seem sparser? This is especially noticeable in the lower lashes.
Overall, the face also just feels like it lacks dimension now. Obviously, some of this has to do with the lighting changes, but there's something to be said about how these other minor changes to the model are definitely not helping.
https://i.imgur.com/dvViw91.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/kjsGkUf.png
I was lucky that my viera remained pretty much unscathed, he still looks great after the update even though he does suffer a bit from the lip issues, just not as prominently as many others. I also personally like that face 3 got more prominent nose marking but not everyone is happy about that, it should be optional. Still really sad how dirty they did vieras with this. I hope they will at the very least address the mouth situation before the release.
Also it's so weird because in the fanfest preview the updated viera looks much better than what we got?? How did they come out so drastically different in the benchmark?
https://i.imgur.com/vOo3RL2.png
I'm... I'm not going to lie. this is just a video game. but I'm kinda...devastated. I love my girl so much and she's just...not the same.
why was the highlight placement in her hair changed? it looks like emo shit in the 2000s. even the base color is too bright.
why are her lips the wrong shape and with no subtle shine? where's her puffy bottom lip?
the nose could be better but I could also live with if I had to.
but it's the eyes... the eyes......!!!!!!!! they ruin everything. I could probably learn to live with everything else if the eyes were right. but instead of a wide-eyed adventurer, I get a dead-eyed zombie.
I want my girl back :( Yoshi-P, please, fix this... I know you and the devs have already done so much work and still have so much to do, but so many of us are so upset... I was at the US FanFest and this is not what we saw and what we were promised...
https://i.imgur.com/gAHPPLL.png
https://i.imgur.com/s3gMG8i.png