[Feedback] Wuk Lamat's English Voice

And thus has the well been poisoned and camps set up for people to preemptively fall into based on their political views, rather than their opinions on a subpar performance. The modern internet sure is a marvel.

I want paid time off too
https://i.imgur.com/Dinppue.png

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

This is easily the most disappointing thing about it but it's not the VA, it's the devs.

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It's both - make no mistake, I found the delivery very flat and uneven, too. It's just that the forced fake accent was the most insulting part about it. Though I agree that the decision to hire this VA was a very poor move on the dev's part, if they wanted someone that genuinely sounded South American.

You know what it vaguely reminds me of? Loba, from Apex. They hired a spanish woman to voice a Brazillian woman - and because of that, she commited the casual faux-pas of speaking portuguese as if it was spanish, and it was, once more, comically insulting.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

Is that what this is? Cuz I don't mind people disliking the performance (I think she's fine), but I dislike people going out and deadnaming her, misgendering her and saying that her voice sounds too much like a man. That's not 'Godwin's Law', that's just straight calling up what it is.

It's just suspicious to me that a thread so filled with transphobia against the VA is calling for her to be fired for her "Poor performance".

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You know what, I'll just say my mistake because I forgot how bad some peoples reading comprehension is. I'll do better next time and edit a quote to refer only to the part I was addressing, and not the entire quote because I was being lazy. Because its clear you read their first sentence and only the first sentence, when I was clearly addressing the last sentence they made.

I don't care what this person said on twitter, what their opinions are on anything, or their politics, but I know poor acting when I hear it and I'm switching to JP voices if this is going to be a prominent character going forward. Strange they hire some amateur from Kentucky for this lead role after the majority of the cast are professional actors from the UK. Especially after they went through the trouble to replace the previous amateur-sounding VAs from ARR. I could understand if they had talent, but this clearly isn't the case. Is there another union strike going on or what? Why the sudden 180 in casting procedure for this character in particular?

It also sounded like none of the actors were in the same recording session or even heard the recordings from the others during their takes. Is this a symptom of the new one being on the other side of the world from the rest?

Wow. It's funny to hear so many Spanish people get mad at a person who probably speaks a form of Spanish considering where the VA is from for not having the right accent for them. When even I a dumb gringo knows there are multitudes of Spanish and Spanish accents. Same thing for French cause almost anyone from France is going to point and laugh at a person speaking French-Canadian. This reminds me of the hate the English VA for Vanille got for not sounding Australian even though she was Australian. It is also funny that people are upset at the different pronunciation of Tural or Tuliyollal when Sharlyean has been pronounced every other which way from now til the heat death of the universe. It is also odd that people have forgotten that we won't just be in Southern Tural. That Solution Nine is practically in the PNW area. The character is also adopted, grew up with an Icelandic bun boy, has a cat boy and a lizard for brothers.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Wow. It's funny to hear so many Spanish people get mad at a person who probably speaks a form of Spanish considering where the VA is from for not having the right accent for them. When even I a dumb gringo knows there are multitudes of Spanish and Spanish accents. Same thing for French cause almost anyone from France is going to point and laugh at a person speaking French-Canadian. This reminds me of the hate the English VA for Vanille got for not sounding Australian even though she was Australian. It is also funny that people are upset at the different pronunciation of Tural or Tuliyollal when Sharlyean has been pronounced every other which way from now til the heat death of the universe. It is also odd that people have forgotten that we won't just be in Southern Tural. That Solution Nine is practically in the PNW area. The character is also adopted, grew up with an Icelandic bun boy, has a cat boy and a lizard for brothers.

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You said it yourself, you're a gringo. You can't get into the mindset of someone who speaks Spanish or is from a Spanish speaking country and might be offended by a performance that mocks their language.

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Originally Posted by LioJen

It also sounded like none of the actors were in the same recording session or even heard the recordings from the others during their takes. Is this a symptom of the new one being on the other side of the world from the rest?

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That's actually super normal for voice acting, most actors do their sessions alone, and it's up to the ADR Director to use the takes that go best together. This is why theater actors tend to do better at VA work out the gate than screen actors; they're trained to make their performance badical with or without the other cast's help.

Heck, in Japanese voice acting, the seiyuus don't even get to add their own spin on the performance. They see the premade animation, hear a beep at the beginning and end of the dialogue, and they have to fit everything into that. In the west, the whole thing's flip-flopped, and they draw based on the actors' performances.

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Originally Posted by Karious

You said it yourself, you're a gringo. You can't get into the mindset of someone who speaks Spanish or is from a Spanish speaking country and might be offended by a performance that mocks their language.

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I mean Im also Spanish but Im not super sensitive about the performance. Its always people blowing hot air over the minor things.

Im not saying that the ENG VA is perfect, and I also wouldve loved to see if they did the opportunity to bring in a South American VA for the role but the VA is fine and hopefully polishes some of her recordings in DT

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Originally Posted by Volgia

Is that what this is? Cuz I don't mind people disliking the performance (I think she's fine), but I dislike people going out and deadnaming her, misgendering her and saying that her voice sounds too much like a man. That's not 'Godwin's Law', that's just straight calling up what it is.

It's just suspicious to me that a thread so filled with transphobia against the VA is calling for her to be fired for her "Poor performance".

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Im trying to be respectful about it by saying ''deep undertone'' but what i mean by that is essentially under the umbrella of ''calling up what it is''

How am i supposed to word my issue with her voice acting?

I don't see what the fuss is about. In english, what I heard was the Wakka (Besaid) accent from FFX. I found it quite cute.

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Originally Posted by XiXiQ

I don't see what the fuss is about. In english, what I heard was the Wakka (Besaid) accent from FFX. I found it quite cute.

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Hey, don't you diss my main man, my legend Wakka. He sounded way better - go rewatch his scenes. DiMaggio knocked it way out of the park. Doubly so with dubbing that was done so long ago.

I was mixed with the acting some lines I thought were pretty well voiced and captured the character and other lines that I thought fell flat and had no emotion. But I like the character and still thought it was a decent first impression of the character and will most likely grow on me and like it more as I play through dawntrail.

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Originally Posted by Nepentha

Do all the VAs get this level of vitriol attention? Or just the one everyone knows is trans?

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I definitely see a lot of insults against her for being trans. It's fine to not like a VA for their performance, but a lot of people are outright deadnaming and insulting her for being too manly.

I'm always amazed at how anti-LGBTQ so much of the gaming community is.

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Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

Hey, don't you diss my main man, my legend Wakka. He sounded way better - go rewatch his scenes. DiMaggio knocked it way out of the park. Doubly so with dubbing that was done so long ago.

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How is that dissing it? It's clearly what they were aiming for.

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Originally Posted by XiXiQ

How is that dissing it? It's clearly what they were aiming for.

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I'm mainly lightly ribbing because I adore Wakka - but, to speak more seriously, it's actually fairly likely that they were going for something at least akin to Wakka (Though Wakka's inspirations are a bit less South American from what I hear, but instead *vaguely* Hawaaian or Maori, I want to say? But that's not an area I'm an expert on, so take that one with five grains of salt), but DiMaggio's performance kind of just knocks it out of the park. I wouldn't say his accent is perfect, because it isn't - but it's full of charisma, energy - and most importantly, /consistency/. Wuk's accent is flat, uneven and a mish-mosh of mixed, awkward pronounciations.

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Originally Posted by OliverQ

I'm always amazed at how anti-LGBTQ so much of the gaming community is.

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Disregarding how many of those people are in this thread to begin with (quite a few I'd give benefit of the doubt are just honestly arguing their opinions without having anything against the VA beyond her performance, while a few bad actors are poisoning the well):

Please do not mistake volume for magnitude. Just because they are very loud and visible thanks to how the internet works (being basically tailored to showing us things to get upset about since that bypasses our brain's defense mechanisms very well), doesn't mean there is a lot of them or that they make up a significant margin of the gaming population.

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Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

It's both - make no mistake, I found the delivery very flat and uneven, too. It's just that the forced fake accent was the most insulting part about it. Though I agree that the decision to hire this VA was a very poor move on the dev's part, if they wanted someone that genuinely sounded South American.

You know what it vaguely reminds me of? Loba, from Apex. They hired a spanish woman to voice a Brazillian woman - and because of that, she commited the casual faux-pas of speaking portuguese as if it was spanish, and it was, once more, comically insulting.

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How is it both? Sena is (seemingly) a white American. But the devs chose someone who isn't South American.

In other words, I would rather somrone who has the actual heritage instead of a fake accent, but it's the devs who opted for this.

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Originally Posted by OliverQ

I don't find her voice manly at all. Maybe some inconsistencies in delivery, but it's also rather amusing to complain about a fictional Hrothgar not being feminine enough. Maybe female Hrothgar are supposed to be more masculine?

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That's your opinion, quite a few people think it doesnt sound right, that the tone isnt right and that the voice is just way too deep, people have a right to their opinion, and it aint transphobia to have one.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

How is it both? Sena is (seemingly) a white American. But the devs chose someone who isn't South American.

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I believe she's Puerto Rican (not South American either, but considering their studio is UK based, maybe it's the best they came up with.)

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

That's your opinion, quite a few people think it doesnt sound right, that the tone isnt right and that the voice is just way too deep, people have a right to their opinion, and it aint transphobia to have one.

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I think the only people who think it sounds too manly are the ones being transphobic. The ones who think the delivery or emotion are off are the ones who have a more legitimate criticism.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

How is it both? Sena is (seemingly) a white American. But the devs chose someone who isn't South American.

In other words, I would rather somrone who has the actual heritage instead of a fake accent, but it's the devs who opted for this.

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It's possible for someone that's not South American (or any other ethnicity for that matter) to put on a fairly good (or at least fun) south american accent that isn't offensive. While I'd say that "sure, I prefer someone that has a similar heritage" too, if the VA is good enough to make me go "Screw it, I like this, it's got charisma", I'm happy to accept it. DiMaggiio with Wakka ,for an example, absolutely did that. Wuk Lamat...doesn't.

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Originally Posted by Karious

You said it yourself, you're a gringo. You can't get into the mindset of someone who speaks Spanish or is from a Spanish speaking country and might be offended by a performance that mocks their language.

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Dude your problem is that it's not an accent of your liking. A Puerto Rican spanish accent is going to sound different from someone who grew up in the South Western states, let alone from ones from Mexico, or Spain. I'm sure that someone from Columbia is going to do a head tilt if they heard someone from Texas or even Cuba speaking Spanish. We also don't know if Wuk Lamat is from Southern or Northern Tural. We don't know if she is meant to have a South American accent or not. Heck I bet that there's a difference in accents between people from Argentina and Venezuela. I know that people from Portugal say others who speak Portuguese who are from Brazil or Cape Verde have a difference in their accent.

Let's take a look at American accents. It would probably be hard for someone who normally speaks in the slow twang that you can find in Texas to try and get a perfect Bostonian accent since a lot of the time they drop their Hs and have a faster clip. Or for that Texan to sound like a person from New Jersey. Even in Texas there are two distinct dialects and that's just one state.

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Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

It's possible for someone that's not South American (or any other ethnicity for that matter) to put on a fairly good (or at least fun) south american accent that isn't offensive. While I'd say that "sure, I prefer someone that has a similar heritage" too, if the VA is good enough to make me go "Screw it, I like this, it's got charisma", I'm happy to accept it. DiMaggiio with Wakka ,for an example, absolutely did that. Wuk Lamat...doesn't.

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I don't think being good at a fake accent makes it any less insulting. But you do you. I think that kind of logic is extremely problematic.

But apparently they may be Puerto Rican so, idk.

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Originally Posted by OliverQ

I think the only people who think it sounds too manly are the ones being transphobic. The ones who think the delivery or emotion are off are the ones who have a more legitimate criticism.

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The transphobic people are the ones who purposefully misgender or deadname her, not the ones who simply express criticism of the voice in game. If they don't like the voice, that's that. Nothing wrong with it and nothing to be done about it. You can't feel wrong. Even if their point of criticism is that they wanted a more feminine voice for the character, that doesn't mean they wish harm upon the VA or want to treat her badly. Sure, there are some bad actors in this thread, but to put out such blanket accusations is not helpful.

As another user put it earlier...

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Originally Posted by EliaStormblade

And thus has the well been poisoned and camps set up for people to preemptively fall into based on their political views, rather than their opinions on a subpar performance. The modern internet sure is a marvel.

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I want to give most people here the benefit of the doubt and assume they just want to honestly discuss their opinions of the VA's work, not the VA's personage. Tastes vary, and there is no such thing as "feeling wrong". If you enjoyed the voice, okay. If you didn't enjoy the voice, that's also okay.
Sure, there are definitely some transphobes trying to stirr up drama in the thread and the OP clearly started this with trolling intent knowing it would happen, but to assume everyone criticising the voicework to belong to that crowd is neither helpful nor fair. At the same time, the other side accusing those defending the voicework of only doing so out of similarly external reasons is equally silly. I wish we could all just take a deep breath and calm down, but alas, this is the internet and the official forums to boot.


On the actual topic, I don't really have a horse in this race, as my native German's dub is awful (mostly its utterly poor voice direction) and when I started playing I had a choice to switch to one of two foreign languages whose sound I was at least somewhat used to - sorry, French. I vibed with the JP dub more than the EN one and have stuck with it since, grating though JP Tataru is on my ears and I wish I could have something closer to the English dub for her - you win some, you lose some.
I've not listened to the English dub much since, outside of trailer material and watching some streamers who play with EN dub, so for what it's worth, the only time I've heard Wuk Lamat's English VA so far was during the Fanfest trailer, where I thought she sounded fine.

The one thing I do want to push back a bit against is the "compare it to JP" argument that keeps cropping up. Fact is:

Square Enix does not and has never tried to keep character interpretations by their VAs consistent across languages.

This is true for both long-established characters and newcomers alike. Some examples have already been named in the thread, and I'd like to add Tataru, Alisaie, or even a really minor part like the magician's voice in P9(S) to the list.
JP Tataru sounds nothing like EN Tataru, EN Alisaie emphasises completely different traits in her performance than JP Alisaie, the P9 magician soul is a young witch in JP and Gruntilda from Banjo-Kazooie in EN. Not to mention EN had the whole VA cast swap after ARR, none of whom tried to sound much like the character's previous VA. And who knows how it is with the French and German dubs. Many of these characters are well liked, in spite of these glaring differences that if we subscribe to "diffent = bad" they should receive an equal amount of pushback.
Best faith assumption is that those interpretations, while not the same, did not bother people, so they feel no need to compare in the first place and now that it does, they start doing so and suddenly notice those differences.

If so, that's okay. I hope they compare a few of the other voices and will find that this is not about Wuk Lamat's voice, but about all of them. If that's a problem, then the criticism should be directed at this phenomenon in general.

I don't know if it's only me, and I hope this doesn't come of as offensive, but the Wuk voice reminds me of the character "Angel Dust" from Hazbin Hotel. Also, as I stated before, the main criticism I have is VA's voice inconsistency, which can be iron out with practice and so on, and I hope the VA takes rational criticisms and strives for perfection.

I hope that we can talk and discuss this topic civilly and focus more on skills and merits instead of personal stuff; It's "Voice Acting" and its a skill-based job.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

I don't think being good at a fake accent makes it any less insulting. But you do you. I think that kind of logic is extremely problematic.

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I'm literally South American, and I'm quite literally telling you if I see a character voice acted by someone that isn't a South American, but they put in a good enough job in understanding the pronounciation and accent from one of our regions, and knock it out of the park, I don't mind, yes. But the casting decision was bad, and the VA was bad. So I don't like it.

But thank you very much for telling me that I should be offended on your behalf, when it's my culture we're talking about, I guess? Savior Complex, much.

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Originally Posted by KuroMaboroshi

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the P9 magician soul is a young witch in JP and Gruntilda from Banjo-Kazooie in EN.

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You just made my day with this LMAO

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Originally Posted by Mecia

Im trying to be respectful about it by saying ''deep undertone'' but what i mean by that is essentially under the umbrella of ''calling up what it is''

How am i supposed to word my issue with her voice acting?

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Sorry did you read what I posted. I have no qualms with people not liking her voice acting. The people who defend her identity as a trans person didn't poison the well on this discussion, the people who came with the bigotry did.

Wuk Lamat sounds like a female Wakka and I can't unhear it. It's hilarious in hindsight.

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Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

I'm literally South American, and I'm quite literally telling you if I see a character voice acted by someone that isn't a South American, but they put in a good enough job in understanding the pronounciation and accent from one of our regions, and knock it out of the park, I don't mind, yes. But the casting decision was bad, and the VA was bad. So I don't like it.

But thank you very much for telling me that I should be offended on your behalf, when it's my culture we're talking about, I guess? Savior Complex, much.

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It may be the case that the accent used for this character is just the way Sena talks. I am unsure as I am unfamiliar with this person.

But on the subject of devs hiring random Americans to fake accents for roles clearly inspired by particular regions (when that does happen), i don't think that's the right choice and you're not going to change my mind. This is like saying we might as well just use AI if it's good enough, or blackface is ok if it's done right. I just don't agree on any level and your nationality is totally irrelevant.

But I don't need your approval.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

It may be the case that the accent used for this character is just the way Sena talks. I am unsure as I am unfamiliar with this person.

But on the subject of devs hiring random Americans to fake accents for roles clearly inspired by particular regions (when that does happen), i don't think that's the right choice and you're not going to change my mind. This is like saying we might as well just use AI if it's good enough, or blackface is ok if it's done right. I just don't agree on any level and your nationality is totally irrelevant.

But I don't need your approval.

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Ahh, so it really is a savior complex. Got it, Mighty Whitey. Please colonize me some more.

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Originally Posted by SwadTheFrog

Ahh, so it really is a savior complex. Got it, Mighty Whitey. Please colonize me some more.

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I'm interracial and in a relationship with an Ecuadorian. I quite literally don't give a single f that you're an apologist.

And tbh it doesn't make sense regardless. It's 2024, actors are widely available- cultures are not some obscure inaccessible thing.. If there's a young bi lingual Portuguese actor who is perfect for Wuk Lamat is looking for a chance to get into the industry but the role is shuffled off to a 37 year old (Sena Breyer age) white American actor (which Breyer apparently isn't) that will always feel redundant and disappointing especially given the resources and knowledge we have today, right now, in 2024

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

I'm interracial and in a relationship with an Ecuadorian. I quite literally don't give a single f that you're an apologist.

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Okay, bro.

What the hell happened here ? Pop-corn time ?!

Just to throw in my 2p;

I have no issues with the voice in general, I generally am not expecting perfection and just take it as it as it comes. However, this doesn't stop me from noticing weird ways in which lines are said or that they don't necessarily feel as emotive as you expect. I can even take a clip that someone posted earlier for comparing EN and JP voices to show what I mean.

The clip in question: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CfnJsSZeyg&t=27s

The start, 'Think you're cleaver, huh?' I find fine, generally no issues here.

The next bit, 'I'll rip off that beak...' Again, this bit, fine.

The last bit, 'and roast you on a spit!' This is the bit that ruins it for me. The less egregious bit is how she says 'roast', it's almost there, but more emphasis on the roast would have made it better, but the worst bit is the end, there is a weird pause before she says spit and even how she says spit is weird. It just doesn't quite flow and really stands out as being out of place.

Again, this is my completely unprofessional view, but it is these places where you need to properly articulate the emotion that make the most impact in your performance. If these fall flat, it doesn't matter how good the rest is.

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Originally Posted by Mikey_R

Just to throw in my 2p;

I have no issues with the voice in general, I generally am not expecting perfection and just take it as it as it comes. However, this doesn't stop me from noticing weird ways in which lines are said or that they don't necessarily feel as emotive as you expect. I can even take a clip that someone posted earlier for comparing EN and JP voices to show what I mean.

The clip in question: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CfnJsSZeyg&t=27s

The start, 'Think you're cleaver, huh?' I find fine, generally no issues here.

The next bit, 'I'll rip off that beak...' Again, this bit, fine.

The last bit, 'and roast you on a spit!' This is the bit that ruins it for me. The less egregious bit is how she says 'roast', it's almost there, but more emphasis on the roast would have made it better, but the worst bit is the end, there is a weird pause before she says spit and even how she says spit is weird. It just doesn't quite flow and really stands out as being out of place.

Again, this is my completely unprofessional view, but it is these places where you need to properly articulate the emotion that make the most impact in your performance. If these fall flat, it doesn't matter how good the rest is.

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I'm just not hearing it, idk. I think the line sounds fine.

I've said before some lines sound flat, but that's the case with all of the actors in this game, especially in their earliest sessions.

The inconsistency in the accent really threw me for a loop. It sounds forced to me and whenever a more complicated word comes out, the accent starts to dissolve and you're left with regular American English.
I wish they had cast someone who had the accent that was wanted, like they did for the Thavnairians who have very natural sounding Indian accents because they cast people who have those accents in their natural speech.

She's fine.

Just for the future: Always remember that a VA is doing as instructed by their director, as that's really their job. If you think a VA doesn't fit their character, your should probably be looking the way of the director and the casting crew more than at the VA themselves. An actor's job is to portray the writer and director's vision of a character. This is very much so the reason why some of ARR VA sounds weird, despite the cast itself being rather good. Poor direction can ruin the best VA (or actor in a film).

That's all. I like her just fine, but we like and dislike things and I won't pretend I can dictate someone else's taste or opinion. Just keep in mind what I said above. Also, JP VA has always been good so you can't go wrong with just sticking with that. Japanese also doesn't lend itself to weird Shakespeare or accent variations, so you get a more straightforward consistent experience, if that's more your thing.

Honestly, I think she did a fine job. Her accent was fine but at times her lines fell a little flat but that's no real issue right now. This is her first section of the game that she's doing so there's going to be growing pains while she gets used to Wuk's voice, personality and range. Look at Zero, she started off rough to me but by 6.3 she sounded much better.

And with as far ahead they are with recording it's possible the devs weren't exactly sure how they needed her to sound which will likely be fixed when expac drops.

In any case, I'm looking forward to seeing more of her and can't wait to see how much better she inevitably gets.