Bazaars are for transactions, not -bleep- storage!

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Originally Posted by ChickNorris

Okay, I am intrigued, how is the bazaar used in a way that is arguably cheating?

It is not the suggestion that is making people call it a QQ thread. It is the presentation. The hysterics and aggressive phrasing is also causing some of the responses.

In reality, there is nothing to it that needs to be defended on your side or convinced of by others. It is a simple preference issue.

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It shouldn't free up 10 spaces because you still have to "carry it" that's why I see it as cheating.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

Ya it is better, but doesn't change the fact I have made a few mil just from my bazaar in a few nights.

So what way am I dense?

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That's because you could have used the market wards to make those few mils, and probably a lot faster too.

Also, because people still do actually use their bazaars for trying to sell shit as well as for storage and clearly people check bazaars still so there's no problem here. Let the people who use some slots or even all as storage do what they want. Fact of the matter is unless SE makes the personal bazaars a lot more functional and appealing, people are going to continue to use it however they can benefit from it best regardless of if some guy makes a thread asking/telling them to stop.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

It shouldn't free up 10 spaces because you still have to "carry it" that's why I see it as cheating.

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That's fine and dandy. Makes sense. What I'd expect to happen if they did that wouldn't be more people legitimately trying to sell things though. Rather a lot more players with no bazaar icon up at all. Why? Because the market wards are better in every way!

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Originally Posted by Rokien

It shouldn't free up 10 spaces because you still have to "carry it" that's why I see it as cheating.

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It's not cheating. It's working as the development team (at least Tanaka's) intended. They designed it to take items out of your inventory rather than simply flagging it as in bazaar like it had been in XI.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

No, it's not. It's for selling things and making requests. It's not storage, it shouldnt' be used as storage, and shouldn't even be a seperate space of inventory. The bazaar is no longer a bazaar if it's not used to bazaar things- it's been degraded to a 10 slot storage space/hey look here's my cool item nobody cares about space.

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Actually, yes it is. Our bazaars are for whatever we feel like putting in them. If you want to dictate what goes inside of my bazaar then start paying my monthly fees, otherwise, deal with it. Mind you, I have all classes to 50 and I really don't have inventory issues to the point where I put things in my bazaar, but if I did, I'll be damned if someone else is going to tell me otherwise when I'm paying for my subscription. And don't bullshit me with "It wastes my time", you're playing a video game, your time is being wasted from the moment you log on to the moment you log off.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

That's because you could have used the market wards to make those few mils, and probably a lot faster too.

Also, because people still do actually use their bazaars for trying to sell shit as well as for storage and clearly people check bazaars still so there's no problem here. Let the people who use some slots or even all as storage do what they want. Fact of the matter is unless SE makes the personal bazaars a lot more functional and appealing, people are going to continue to use it however they can benefit from it best regardless of if some guy makes a thread asking/telling them to stop.



That's fine and dandy. Makes sense. What I'd expect to happen if they did that wouldn't be more people legitimately trying to sell things though. Rather a lot more players with no bazaar icon up at all. Why? Because the market wards are better in every way!

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-.- I do sell stuff, my npcs are full... can't put stuff in them(sell), so I put stuff in my bazaar... come on now.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

-.- I do sell stuff, my npcs are full... can't put stuff in them(sell), so I put stuff in my bazaar... come on now.

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/sigh.

Why I even bother with you, I don't know lol

We must have run out of valid topics for concern, discussion, and adjustment request, if we have reached a point where we are discussing whether the existent storage system is, in fact, a method of cheating.

Put succinctly, to the critics of the way people use their bazaars for storage: Do you have nothing at all better to do?

It is not at all your concern. o.o

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Originally Posted by Pofo

Actually, yes it is. Our bazaars are for whatever we feel like putting in them. If you want to dictate what goes inside of my bazaar then start paying my monthly fees, otherwise, deal with it. Mind you, I have all classes to 50 and I really don't have inventory issues to the point where I put things in my bazaar, but if I did, I'll be damned if someone else is going to tell me otherwise when I'm paying for my subscription. And don't bullshit me with "It wastes my time", you're playing a video game, your time is being wasted from the moment you log on to the moment you log off.

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Please, stop acting like i'm holding a gun to your head and telling you you have to do this or that. That's not what this is about. The point of this thread is revising the functionality of bazaars so that they are actually bazaars, and finding other ways to address the reasons people use them for other things (e.g. more storage space, carrying duplicate items, whatever). I don't care what universe you're from, it's bad game design if you create a feature with purpose A, and people don't use it for that and instead use it for some purpose B. Make Purpose B its own feature, seperate from the feature that was created for purpose A, and then you can have the best of both worlds.

Granted, I could have gone with a better topic title, but I can't change that now.

I'll just throw this out there for those on Gungnir. My personal Bazaar does have items for actual sale. so please buy them. :D

I really don't care what people choose to use it for. I look here and there. If your selling i might be buying. If not i can atleast see what you are holding onto, and maybe try and sell you more of it :D

My opinion, do whatever you want.

I do understand the desire to have it be an actual shop. but the only way to really change that is either decide the prices for players, lower the price cap a player can set so theres real risk someone will buy it but that will just mean people will put the cheapest item in their inventory up for the max coin.

The only way i can see it ever becoming an actual bazaar is if folks can forseeably not fill their inventory with stuff they need. And thats likely to only become possible with the manequin system and maybe a bank style storage thats somehow accessable in the field (maybe for a price, maybe with an item)

Till then its 10 extra possible slots. People will use them.

OK since Alhanelem changed topic from "Use bazaar for lower priced items than 999mil just because I think im cool enough to tell you what to do!!!" to "Sry, nvm thread title - i dont rly know what im typing... lets just come up with new ideas of how to make bazaar sales popular again or remove bazaar completely cause im cool enough to tell devs what to do" i will just say that imho bazaar will never work as good as it did in XI (not that it really worked that much better) but it was a bit more popular because:

1. Lower taxes than in AH (in XIV bazaar taxes are higher than in wards)
2. Slower mobility (where it took you x5 times longer to get from one place to another cause you couldn't just teleport whenever-wherever you want so you would rather buy overpriced shit from RMT bazaar near Selbina than go all the way back to AH)
3. Some items could only be sold in bazaar and not in auction house. (leaving no choice for the player but to use bazaar)

Take away these reasons and you will see that 90% of ppl will stop wasting their time on putting their shit for sale unless they have nothing better to do. That's whats going on. No point in trying to improve bazaar, theres nothing wrong with it, ppl just use it how they see fit. And even if you don't like how majority uses it, doesnt mean that devs have to change something or remove something just because you said so. At least not before they change things that actually matter and are more important than this crap... and that would be pretty much anything lols

You know, with all of the actual problems this game has, and all of the areas with VAST room for improvement.... it's kind of amazing and pathetic we have a 13 page thread about what should be considered Proper or Improper Bazaar Utilization.

On the checklist of things needing to be looked into, this falls right after "Determine if marmot tails are fluffy enough."

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Okay, I am intrigued, how is the bazaar used in a way that is arguably cheating?

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Using it to carry multiples of the same unique-tagged item from a raid to turn in for extra Notes. Those items are flagged Rare for a reason, and circumventing that is exploitive at a minimum (even if you think we should be able to do that, which I could get on board with, it's clearly not intended )

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Originally Posted by Impulse

• No notification whatsoever, let it be text based or visually cued by an icon.
• Players checking bazaars are frozen in place, and due to the lack of a notification for being examined, the other party will continue to run around as they see fit and run out of trading range
• The inability to check the bazaar of a character who is not loaded up on your screen. You're forced to wait until the client happens to load up the person who was shouting about selling X item in their bazaar

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You raise some good points, and I'm expecting an "in 2.0" response if I were to get one, as far as fixing those problems (e.g. can't move while checking bazaar and have to be a certain distance away)

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On the checklist of things needing to be looked into, this falls right after "Determine if marmot tails are fluffy enough."

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I disagree, on the basis that throughly functional bazaars, with all the problems above addressed, are a good feature and something that the game should have.

Oh, and marmot tails need to be 40% fluffier.

The general consensus is people need more inventory space.

Perhaps there can be a non bazaar/non trade interface box within the moghouse kind of like mog locker but made specifically for DOL/DOH classes to store their materials crystals, gathering yields only. I know that some completed armor is considered a crafting recipe material but that armor is sometimes usable outside of just a recipe material.

Remotely accessible only while in that DOL/DOH class.

Make it attainable only from a specific level of crafting class like the average level where people's crafts start filling up inventory. I mean that it should be available 1/3 to mid cap or some substantial time before capping the class specifically, because mats are produced at such high amounts while leveling up the craft.

Make a quest or key item to unlock it. Like the materia quest, the specific DOL/ DOH class could go to activate and fulfill the quest objectives once they reach level 20 or something near the levels where inventory for materials becomes an obstacle.

It can be rentable and with lock down on expiration date like in XI.

Perhaps opening more space when multiple craft classes are leveled to that specific unlock level, at the same time via a graduating set of quests. Maybe achievements could be incorporated into it as well.

I think that the economy could do with less people being forced to NPC vendor sell their level up products because they need space for mats or DOL/DOH product.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I'm really tired of checking people and finding a pile of items being listed for 999,999,999 gil.

The bazaar really needs to not free space from your inventory, so people dont use it as storage when that's not what it's there for. INSTEAD, *gear* is what shouldn't be taking up space in your inventory. You're wearing it!

I'm sorry, but it's really frustrating. counting both retainers and ignoring crystals you can hold 500 items. If you aren't using it and you aren't selling it, put it on a retainer or something, don't waste the time of people who think you might have something to sell.

-edit- Since some of you seem to feel this is just AWW BOO HOO QQ!:

I propose that everyone be given 10 more inventory space instead of the bazaar being it's own inventory space. This way you all get more storage and bazaars might actually return to their intended purpose. I would like to reiterate that this is a suggestion, not a QQ. this situation left me scratching my head because the bazaar was created to let people sell stuff out of their inventory, and people don't really actually do that. This simply doesn't make a whole lot of sense and should be adjusted.

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People do use it to sell things. I browse bazaars too, but I don't get upset about anyone using it as storage. It's their choice to use it that way...like I use mine for materia or sometimes selling food if I have some. Out of all the things that are wrong with this game, it just feels a little petty to me to be treating this like a huge injustice or something.

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Perhaps there can be a non bazaar/non trade interface box within the moghouse kind of like mog locker but made specifically for DOL/DOH classes to store their materials crystals, gathering yields only. I know that some completed armor is considered a crafting recipe material but that armor is sometimes usable outside of just a recipe material.

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There was a common suggestion in FFXI to have something called a "showcase" where you could put items you want to show off (even rare/untradable items) but not sell- and with this, you wouldn't even have to enter a price, much less an unsellable price. E.g. the perfect place for those heart chocolates, and other items you can't use but want to let people know you have (in particular i'd put important items for fights in there so that people could look at me and know I'm ready to go).

I realize that the bazaar functionality has some pretty crippling limitations at the moment that contribute to the current situation- so I hope that these issues, like being frozen in place when checking a bazaar, can be addressed.

Well i suppose in stead of arguing about what people should and shouldn't do i guess i'll throw my thoughts on what the system lacks and what could be helpful since we've already discussed most of the "problems" and uses.

my personal addition: Nothing even shows or looks like your selling things. its possibly the blandest possible selling mechanic there is, right next to your average AH setup. Very blah and not appealing. I realize many folks feel meh as far as ambiance and visual mood for many things but i tend to like when doing something there should be visual ques to the action or state.

Add an option to those 10 slots, one is sell, one is stow. one has a price tag and shows in the bazaar the other doesn't. Then you'll know whos selling and who isnt. But also give real visual ques to a seller besides an Icon.

Heck if you have items for sale in your bazaar and afk for a few minutes have them put a "Shop" sign at your feet and a vendor tray in your hands (like Hot dog venders at the baseball game or the consieres at the casinos) I love that kind of flavor.

Game named Mabinogi has blankets you'd put out and that was your shop. either you manned it or your pet (kinda like your retainer) did. Its no AH system, and it had no search feature and i'm not so much advocating the system itself as i am the visual representation of a shop. You knew at a glance that items were for sale here.

All in all best "short term" fix we could hope for is to just get items that people want for extra space not to show up as for sale at all. Then we just wait till SE has time for something better/faster/stronger.

I'm feeling like a smartass tonight, so I'm gonna make a smartass suggestion

Items that do not sell within a day drop 50% of it's current value each day if over 25mil, and 20% each day for under 25mil, and will continue to do so each day unless the price is reset by the player. This applies to players and retainers, so if you decide to leave your retainer or afk in town for days (weeks even) anything in your bazaar can drop enough to potentially be bought by others.

It takes 6 days to drop below 25mil at 50% (Stopping at 15.6Mil)
It takes 8 days from post date to drop to 10Mil.
It takes 20 days it'll drop to 687k.

I think that's plenty of time for people to move their stuff out of their bazaar, and if it gets bought I guess that just means they didn't care enough about the item to begin with to really risk losing it.

Though it really would have some merit by eventually readjusting the market price for peoples items who sell for much higher than they're worth, but are too lazy to adjust them to reflect the market.

The main advantages of bazaars over market wards are that the market wards are immobile (factor in your own travel time/expenses into all your purchases) and will list all competitors' prices at once, encouraging all the undercutting people are complaining about in other threads.

When 90% of the stuff being bazaared isn't realistically on the market, the bazaar platform itself becomes unviable, driving more people to the wards (specifically the Ul'dah wards), making the game experience worse for everyone.

Of course, I've been on these S-E forums to know that most of you are too dense to see past your own noses, so I'm more in favor of the scorched earth solution: a 1% bazaar listing fee.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Because the market wards are better in every way!

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In every way? :rolleyes: Imagine a place where you can't access the wards (like, outside of a city). Yep, that's what bazzars are for. :D

I root for the OP. Keep it going, man! /cheer

Also, I didn't even know that you can store unique items in your bazzar and optain a 2nd one. lol Going by the word unique I can't see how that is not cheating. :cool:

Just my two cents. ;)

And no need to flame me. I just want to be heard by the devs. ^^y Thanks for reading.