PSA: Macro Sound Effects Harm People with Sensory Issues

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Originally Posted by Catwho

It's just be swell if they had their own separate volume control, outside from the rest of the system sounds, so I could still hear a Divebomb warning from the game and not have to deal with some rando's "DIVEBOMBS ARE COMING (BOOM BOOM) (BOOM BOOM) alarm alarm alarm" macro when I wasn't expecting it.

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THIS. Is this so hard to understand? This suggestion even benefits those who like macro sound effects.

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Originally Posted by Kisagami

I mean, goodness gracious, you’re acting like I asked for butt sliders or something.

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You should be! Butt sliders need to be a thing. XD

Seriously though, I support this thread 100%. Take all my likes! There should be an OPTION for a user to disable the macro sounds and some of the suggestions (listed on your first post) are very good. Hopefully the dev's are paying attention and we'll see some changes to this in the future. :)

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

First off no, just gave options and alternatives. Second get off your high horse and read carefully. In a perfect world yes everyone would hold hands and would put their online gaming experience on hold so that everyone can play perfectly, they would also listen to advice and stick to mechanics. The reality is that no, people want to get things done fast and expect others to take proper precautions beforeplaying a game that everyone knows is not MSE friendly. That time and time again has been brought up and little has been done. The few options and advice that has been given has had no acceptable results, based on the community forums standards who have this issue, everyone pays a subscription. While changes take time, probably will take longer do to the small percentage of world wide players being affected compared to the larger percentage that are not affected, people have choices. To expect everyone to be sympathetic about it and stop their world for those who need it would be nice. is it reality? No.

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You are being pretty insulting, Billykaplan had a fitting reply to you. I do not need a discord chat, you do not know me how having sound on helps my general awareness of the dungeon. I do not want someone's annoying macro to be triggering me for no reason, and when I said harassment, I mean harassment. Sometimes people give me crap about it instead of just removing the noise like a lot of people do. You do not need calls in macros anyway. I want my sounds to go into important chats like hunt ls, fc, special ls, because it helps me know someone may need something while i am in the middle of something else.

Lastly, you can take your own advice, if you need macros during fights, or even worse macros with calls on them, then you can also not have them and be on voice in discord if you need that so badly. This game is not hard enough to warrant calls in macros.

Sound adjusting should be a thing, and there should be some adjustments to character sound. There is this one miqo'te voice that made me leave a DF once. I had a minor headache going in the DF and that character voice was just obnoxious so i left because it made my headache too much to bare.

If you do not want extra options for more people to enjoy the game, i find it very odd...

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Originally Posted by Vstarstruck

Sound adjusting should be a thing, and there should be some adjustments to character sound. There is this one miqo'te voice that made me leave a DF once. I had a minor headache going in the DF and that character voice was just obnoxious so i left because it made my headache too much to bare.

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There's a separate volume channel for voices already - muting it will silence all players during gameplay and also turn off voices in the cutscenes.

They have an accessibility option called "Visual Alert", it shows you sounds in oscilliscope form around the screen edges.
It's something like that wave looking thingy they put in media players or your car radio when a song is playing.
Not sure if it applies to every sound or macro sounds. Is that something you're looking for?

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Originally Posted by uvuvwevwevweonyetenyevweugwemu

They have an accessibility option called "Visual Alert"

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That's intended for the hearing impaired. The op's sense of hearing is overstimulated by certain sounds that's like the opposite end of hearing difficulties. The only other way I know how to explain this very well is that suggesting visual alerts for over-stimulation is like telling someone who can't handle how bright the lighting in a room is to use a cane meant for the blind. Learning to use tools like that takes time and is asking them to give up on using a sense all-together if it's a problem versus allowing for adjustments to bring an overwhelming stimulation down to a tolerable level.

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Originally Posted by Texa

The op's sense of hearing is overstimulated by certain sounds that's like the opposite end of hearing difficulties.

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I see, I don't mean it like that. I do want something like this too because I play mostly at night and if the sound effects might bother people sleeping, I just toggle them on and off with an in-instance and out-instance macros. It's same one has been suggested with /systemsounds 0-100. But it is temporary, so even if SE provide a checkbox option for it we still have to open configuration and check it on and off everytime.

The problem for devs is optimization of most sound cards, they are only allowed opening x number of sounds going on and those already assigned to bgm, boss fx, player fx, ambient sounds, system sounds, chat sounds etc. Just bottom lining that volume for every individual sound effects maybe not doable because the slots are already used for many/other things. -But- it's doable if the sounds effects tied to the visual alert because macro effects have distinct spike on it. At the very least, when we turn off /systemsounds, it should still show some alerts for those moments we need to pay attention to something.

edit: Don't think of an accessibility option as a utility for the handicapped. Think of it as utility to perform better under non-ideal situation/condition. A cane also helps elderly walks, not just the blind. :)

i'd love to mute certain macro sounds, the ping ping noise from tells i cannot stand and a lot of people use it in macros. i dont think it would honestly be that hard of a thing to put in a mute button for certain sounds, its not game breaking or game changing in the slightest. I have to stop what im doing and mute my setting when i get a tank or healer that has constant noise macros for everything, attack this target im pulling etc, it gives instant migraines and to have something where i dont have to always turn off system sound would be nice.

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Originally Posted by uvuvwevwevweonyetenyevweugwemu

edit: Don't think of an accessibility option as a utility for the handicapped. Think of it as utility to perform better under non-ideal situation/condition. A cane also helps elderly walks, not just the blind. :)

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Bro, you have no idea how a probing cane works compared to a support cane if you say something like that it is not built to bear full weight from an adult and aid in balance those two things are in no way interchangeable. Blind people who need both USE both.
https://i.imgur.com/I1LIdht.jpg

Also I AM physically and cognitively handicapped. I will think of accessibility in all shapes and forms as I please as it's an issue I deal with every day of my life online and off. What can just be a minor annoyance for the abled can be a complete barrier from entry for the handicapped. Trying to water it down as a "utility" takes away from the fact that we need a certain amount of awareness for the deaf (visual alerts), colorblind (graphic design color theory classes that cover how to create palettes for them), autistic (sound and visual customization options), and the chronically in-pain people (controller options) to be able to access games at all. Sometimes things added for us can benefit everyone and that's fantastic! But it shouldn't have to in order to justify whether or not it's needed.

I fully support the fix for this problem.

Also, an in-chat report option for idiotic chat macros wouldn't hurt either. Not that hard to identify since it could be identified through things such as spotting sound effect cues in text, tracking timers of text inputs, or simply and proudly admitting that every chat macro is idiotic.

I really appreiciate the love and support here. I am eternally greatful this playerbase I have found here for the most part accepts me even with all my quirks and flaws. I’m not a perfect person; I just wanna be able to play a game where I have found actual friends I feel safe to interact with, which is crazy since I have PTSD. The idea of meeting them one day with the company of my boyfriend is exciting.

Thank you all for making me feel not so alone and here is me crossing my fingers a fix will be introduced in a patch.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

There's a separate volume channel for voices already - muting it will silence all players during gameplay and also turn off voices in the cutscenes.

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then it makes it too low to hear everything else, that one voice is simply too loud. (well least that one combat noise, i doono about the rest)

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

Also, an in-chat report option for idiotic chat macros wouldn't hurt either. Not that hard to identify since it could be identified through things such as spotting sound effect cues in text, tracking timers of text inputs, or simply and proudly admitting that every chat macro is idiotic.

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You would probably have better luck convincing SE to remove macro sounds altogether than to implement a report option for using game features the intended way.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

You would probably have better luck convincing SE to remove macro sounds altogether than to implement a report option for using game features the intended way.

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A 20-line macro where each line is nothing but spamming every single macro sound is doubtfully the 'intended way'. I am not making this up. That said I doubt they'll add that for anything other than RMT because most other things require context

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

A 20-line macro where each line is nothing but spamming every single macro sound is doubtfully the 'intended way'. I am not making this up. That said I doubt they'll add that for anything other than RMT because most other things require context

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If I ever encountered someone who did this to me, I would immediately uninstall the game and cut my losses...

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

A 20-line macro where each line is nothing but spamming every single macro sound is doubtfully the 'intended way'. I am not making this up. That said I doubt they'll add that for anything other than RMT because most other things require context

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Yeah, most other things do require context. The macro you described would probably fall under spam, which I believe is already against the rules. The person I quoted considered every chat macro to be idiotic and wanted a report option for idiotic chat macros, which would mean reporting every chat macro. It's just not going to happen as long as SE supports the ability to make macros with sound.

I wonder if blacklisting prevents one from hearing macroed sound effects. Can't remember if it has been mentioned in the thread yet. That would be the easiest available way to prevent discomfort without having to turn off system sounds or requesting others to make changes in their game play.

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Originally Posted by Cakekizyy

But you can't blacklist while in duty, right?

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Well... damn.

But you can't blacklist while in duty, right?

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Originally Posted by Reinha

You would probably have better luck convincing SE to remove macro sounds altogether than to implement a report option for using game features the intended way.

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I'll take it!

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

I'll take it!

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Your response made me laugh. “Problem Solved!”

Not at home to check, but I’m certain that some of the default chat channels (/sh comes to mind) filter/mute any sound effect entries.

I use them in my hunt callout and relay macros, but only in /p, and I’ve actually been thanked for that by people who had to afk and would’ve missed out had they not heard the sound effect. So such effects can be used positively.

4.2 is coming and I’m hoping there will be some surprises with the patch notes. Here’s to hoping good things come for the new year!

I'd been following this thread partly because I do also have Asperger's and anxiety and can sometimes get frustrated by game noises - though more often due to frustration than specific noises (eg. the longer I've been going in circles trying to find something or solve a puzzle, the more ambient sounds and BGM start to grate on my nerves - in a physical gut-feeling 'I can't take this any more' way - and I'll have to mute it until I can finish the objective and move on).

Fortunately I don't seem to get affected by the macro sounds, but I've just recently gotten White Mage to Lv50+ and found my own nemesis.... the "Lily Gauge filled" sound effect. Nasty sharp sound that made me feel a bit 'funny' after hearing it. Not enough to stop playing, but.... ugh. And the cast sound for Stone III is not quite so bad, but similar and still unpleasant. I want this to be one of my main classes, but suddenly it's become a bit less appealing. :(

EDIT: Having leveled a few other classes to this point now, I've realised it's a general and not white-mage-specific "gauge filled" sound effect.

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Also I've come across a few people in Duty Finder who use the more piercing sound effects in conjunction with Provoke and use it to start every enemy encounter..... which, even if that was the correct usage of the ability, telling the other players seems to have no gameplay use at all. Of course the tank is going to draw the enemy, and we know which enemy has been targeted because their health bar turns red. I can't see any point to announcing that an enemy has been provoked.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I can't see any point to announcing that an enemy has been provoked.

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There's actually one singular reason why you'd need to do that: tank swapping fights to let healers know to switch their main target. I know, not exactly a necessary thing, but it does make life a bit easier for harder content that involves that mechanic.

And yes, with 4.2 around the corner, hopefully there will be something to better change or modify sound effects like the gauge fill, because that ratchet sound really is quite annoying.

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

There's actually one singular reason why you'd need to do that: tank swapping fights to let healers know to switch their main target. I know, not exactly a necessary thing, but it does make life a bit easier for harder content that involves that mechanic.

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Ah, that's quite a different context to be using it in! That makes more sense than in a standard dungeon run. And it would be used sparingly, I assume, and not just their opening attack for every mob? So I guess other players have seen them doing it and copied the idea without understanding the actual purpose (or correct use of Provoke), and it spreads that way until all tanks think that's what they're expected to do when provoking....

I haven no sensory issues. I just find it damned annoying sometimes. Options are good. I'm fully behind a way to customize the sounds I want to hear or if I don't want to hear any.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Ah, that's quite a different context to be using it in! That makes more sense than in a standard dungeon run. And it would be used sparingly, I assume, and not just their opening attack for every mob? So I guess other players have seen them doing it and copied the idea without understanding the actual purpose (or correct use of Provoke), and it spreads that way until all tanks think that's what they're expected to do when provoking....

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I remember when warriors used to overuse it along with ciuntdown and sound for each second.

hope something comes out of your thread, good luck

I’m pretty disappointed that there was no added optoon just to disable macro sounds in 4.2. Just another reason I’ve decided to play another MMO for the majority of my freetimr. It’s a pitty, but what else can I do?

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Originally Posted by Kisagami

I’m pretty disappointed that there was no added optoon just to disable macro sounds in 4.2. Just another reason I’ve decided to play another MMO for the majority of my freetimr. It’s a pitty, but what else can I do?

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I have some questions about their priority this patch. The MSQ change makes me wonder if it was really the right decision to invest that much time into the recording and Perform changes. Hope they add it soon, it's a pity to see someone leave over this :(

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

I have some questions about their priority this patch. The MSQ change makes me wonder if it was really the right decision to invest that much time into the recording and Perform changes. Hope they add it soon, it's a pity to see someone leave over this :(

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Yeah, overall 4.2 is a major disappointment for the Western World. Its going over okay in Japan, not so much here.

It feels like all the goofy, minor stuff a few devs as napkin ideas got created and messed with over like, EUREKA. I don't get it either. It makes this patch feel very small.

I have some sensory issues, too. I literally cannot play Dark Knight as the metallic sounds the basic combos make make me cringe so bad that I couldn't stay at it beyond one quick dungeon.

https://i.gyazo.com/thumb/1200/3f846...2ff9a6-png.jpg

Was sent this, still an issue apparently, the person with the trick attack macro was rude to a person in question.

You can turn sound effects off not to be rude or anything of course but if you have these issues there are ways around it if someone is using an annoying macro that has sound turn off the sound effects or blacklist the person (yeah u cant blacklist in duty I know). Likewise you can mute your speakers or what not. Yeah I find an over abundance of them annoying but the sounds are also agood way to get ppls attention for mechanics mostly in df where you cant really communicate with anyone aside from text.

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Originally Posted by KokoChibata

You can turn sound effects off not to be rude or anything of course but if you have these issues there are ways around it if someone is using an annoying macro that has sound turn off the sound effects or blacklist the person (yeah u cant blacklist in duty I know). Likewise you can mute your speakers or what not. Yeah I find an over abundance of them annoying but the sounds are also agood way to get ppls attention for mechanics mostly in df where you cant really communicate with anyone aside from text.

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That should be another way to quickly and easily to address it? Changing it so you can BL while in the duty I mean

I only use one sound effect in one macro (raising with a single ping) but, until they offer the option to mute such macro sounds I will remove it from them. There's no reason WHATSOEVER I should do something in game that I know may negatively affect someone. I wouldn't do it in the real world, so why in game?

I do get affected by multiple macro sounds myself because they irritate me, which can lead to exacerbation of non-related health issues. So even though I don't have the same problem as the original poster it would be beneficial to me too if they implemented a "macro sounds" slider. They did it for Performance sounds quickly enough (thank the Twelve) so it's obviously not a game-breaking thing to do.

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Originally Posted by Luxpheras

We understand that muting all system sounds may not be the ideal solution for those who are specifically disrupted by sound effect macros, but wish to hear other system sounds. Please rest assured that we'll be sharing this feedback and your comments with the appropriate dev. teams.

In the meantime, we hope that these macros may be of assistance to any players who wish to avoid sounds that are disruptive to their experience while adventuring in Hydaelyn.

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May I ask why there was time and resources spent on making an unneeded change to MSQ dungeons while we hear no word on this?

I’m pretty sure they *didn’t* spend time on the MSQ changes, and that’s why we got the all-affecting change to how the cutscene plays (which I assume is the digital equivalent of flipping a switch) instead of whatever additional programming work would be needed to support and integrate a currently-not-existing “decision-making” process to make it skippable or not according to certain circumstances.

So I just want to get this straight...Say you enter a fight like Os7...and you have a party of 8 folks with you. The battle starts, and all the DPS are going crazy. The mage is casting fire and ice spells, the ninja is using skills, the Drk is spinning with the giant sword, Guardian is blasting its Giant beam. Noise, and combat everywhere! Then you hear a macro noise to notify that a healer is rezzing joe who ate an Aura Bolt...and that triggers you guys? Its the instant message sound that does it...but not the chaos of the fight? Asking seriously here because this intrigue's me

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Originally Posted by Lycia

So I just want to get this straight...Say you enter a fight like Os7...and you have a party of 8 folks with you. The battle starts, and all the DPS are going crazy. The mage is casting fire and ice spells, the ninja is using skills, the Drk is spinning with the giant sword, Guardian is blasting its Giant beam. Noise, and combat everywhere! Then you hear a macro noise to notify that a healer is rezzing joe who ate an Aura Bolt...and that triggers you guys? Its the instant message sound that does it...but not the chaos of the fight? Asking seriously here because this intrigue's me

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I don't know much about triggers or anything, but when it comes down to it a lot of tiny things can end up being such for people. Personally I've heard of atleast a few stories of people (specifically war vets) getting twitchy due to a squeky wheel on a grocery cart. Human biology can be wierd.

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Originally Posted by Lycia

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Specific sounds are what do it.

Mind, macro noises are especially high pitched and sudden by their nature of grabbing everyone's attention. For me, it's like listening to music when, without warning, someone scapes a chalkboard two inches from my ear. But like, the gross sensation of the sound takes a very long time to go away.

The worst cases of audio sensitivity feel more like radio static suddenly interrupted by a nearby gunshot.