Put the Chinese dress as a in game reward

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Originally Posted by Alberel

You clearly don't understand what Pay to Win means if you think referring to items that were available at no extra cost somehow makes the new dress on the mogstation less of an issue... Something being Pay to Win usually requires that you, you know, pay for it.

FYI a lot of cash shops that eventually fell into the P2W black hole started with offering stuff like this. People defended it, saying it wasn't P2W enough to be a problem, so the devs got bold and added more and more invasive stuff. That will happen here as well unless people tell them NOT to go any further. By defending this dress you are asking the devs to push their luck with the cash shop.

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Let them push their luck. Eventually there'll be a breaking point where people will have enough and the game will bleed subs.

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Originally Posted by LillithCale

So, does this mean you've nothing to say about the fact that the dress wasn't free in China?

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The cost of the dress in China would warrant the same issue as what i'm trying to argue right now. I think the major issue here is that SE looked at the begging thread and saw people willing to drop an insane amount of money on it. Basically... they took advantage of their fans cause they knew it would sell. In reality this dress would be better off suited in some event like how we gt Saint Valentionne's maid dress, etc. SO in SOME part I do blame people. Not every single beautiful glam item has to be on the cash shop and even if they are... there's no way this shite would ever be 18 dollars.

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

The cost of the dress in China would warrant the same issue as what i'm trying to argue right now.

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Valid statement.

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

I think the major issue here is that SE looked at the begging thread and saw people willing to drop an insane amount of money on it.
Basically... they took advantage of their fans cause they knew it would sell.

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Pure speculation and shouldn't be part of your argument. For instance, based on my own observations, the following statement is just as true as the above quote.

"Lunafreya, is griping about the $18 because their parents won't pay the insane price for a fake virtual good, when they are already paying for a monthly subscription to a useless MMO that just wastes their child's time."

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

Not every single beautiful glam item has to be on the cash shop

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The majority of glamour items is available in game, the few that are in the cash shop, is not enough to warrant your above statement. You don't need them.

You say they aren't worth $18. However, they are apparently valuable enough for you to spend 3 days championing against the injustice of an $18 dollar dress. At an average minium wage of $8/hr, you've just wasted roughly $576. That is the apparent value you've given this dress. Compared to that, the rest of us who payed $18 got it cheap!

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Originally Posted by Lan_Mantear

you just wasted roughly $576. That is the apparent value you've given this dress. Compared to that, the rest of us who payed $18 got it cheap!

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It isn't really speculation at all. SE have listened to people saying "we will drop 30 dollars on it!" As they did with the mog mount as well. The snark is pretty unecessary. I never implied that I would buy the dress at 18 dollars and I also never implied that it is costly for me. Reread the thread. I haven't spent 3 days at all. You are saying I've been in this thread 72 hours since I made it. All this thread is trying to do is show that a glam item SHOULD NOT BE ridiculously priced. Oh, and no... while FFXIV has some nice glamour items, most of the cool stuff like scion robes are on the cash shop. It would be easy as hell to implement these in game just like fantasias but SE prefers to grab your money.

Again... if people can't read... please don't post.

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

It isn't really speculation at all. SE have listened to people saying "we will drop 30 dollars on it!" As they did with the mog mount as well. The snark is pretty unecessary. I never implied that I would buy the dress at 18 dollars and I also never implied that it is costly for me. Reread the thread. I haven't spent 3 days at all. You are saying I've been in this thread 72 hours since I made it. All this thread is trying to do is show that a glam item SHOULD NOT BE ridiculously priced. Oh, and no... while FFXIV has some nice glamour items, most of the cool stuff like scion robes are on the cash shop. It would be easy as hell to implement these in game just like fantasias but SE prefers to grab your money.

Again... if people can't read... please don't post.

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I think this is where a lot of the miscommunication comes from. If the entire point is purely to say you don't like or want it to be so expensive, then that's that. There's really no argument on that matter. You'd like it to be that way, but you're not fighting some blind cause to point out the evil injustice that has just been committed for them pricing something considered expensive, around or slightly cheaper than the original source (obviously an over exaggeration... hopefully).

If however you're trying to champion a cause in attempting to force the market to be the way you want it to be, because you don't like the cash shop in general, then that's another story. You're spreading and provoking hate towards a market you don't realistically have a say in. Shaming or waggling that no-no finger at SE for it is like doing the same to the people who buy from it (or specifically bought the formerly China-exclusive items). You may not be pointing fingers, but you're indirectly trying to spread guilt towards those who are accepting of it. Thus, you get the hateful attention on you for it.

I can tell you this much, if that Yokai event had a buy-in option, you bet your ass a ton of people would have opted for that over the actual time they spent in-game getting things like the mounts. That's another matter though lol.

There will always be people willing to buy these things, and that's just fine. We get lots of cool gear in-game and as long as they don't start selling BiS raiding gear it shouldn't matter to anyone but the crybabies. I literally spit my drink up laughing at the person saying the exp buff on the Chinese gear is "the worst form of pay to win" or something like that.

If you don't like it, don't buy it, but guess what? For every one of you vocal people screeching about it being unfair there's someone like me who will buy one of the outfits for his wife because she thinks it's cute, and because I'm not a child paying with his moms credit card or a poor I can afford it.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

You clearly don't understand what Pay to Win means if you think referring to items that were available at no extra cost somehow makes the new dress on the mogstation less of an issue... Something being Pay to Win usually requires that you, you know, pay for it.

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Pretty sure you're the one who doesn't know what pay to win means. There is an item, given for free, that provides the same exp buff as an item you can pay for. If you buy the dress specifically for the exp buff (which requires all three pieces to be worn, btw, and provides worse stats than the ring you get from Hall of the Novice) then you're not paying to win. You're paying to be a dumbass.

The best part is the people claiming this will eventually sink FFXIV and S-E when this is, what? One of their most lucrative properties? The few of you in this hugbox claiming a cash shop in a P2P game is some betrayal by Yoshi P are the tiniest of tiny minorities. Most people will ignore the shop entirely and not let its existence ruin the game for them, and others might buy one or two items because they look cool, while (and this part you should take a lesson from, kids) -not- throwing a tantrum about it.

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Originally Posted by Radiosuitcase

The best part is the people claiming this will eventually sink FFXIV and S-E when this is, what? One of their most lucrative properties? The few of you in this hugbox claiming a cash shop in a P2P game is some betrayal by Yoshi P are the tiniest of tiny minorities. Most people will ignore the shop entirely and not let its existence ruin the game for them, and others might buy one or two items because they look cool, while (and this part you should take a lesson from, kids) -not- throwing a tantrum about it.

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Throwing a tantrum is like a right of passage in the OF.

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Originally Posted by Lunafreya

The cost of the dress in China would warrant the same issue as what i'm trying to argue right now. I think the major issue here is that SE looked at the begging thread and saw people willing to drop an insane amount of money on it. Basically... they took advantage of their fans cause they knew it would sell. In reality this dress would be better off suited in some event like how we gt Saint Valentionne's maid dress, etc. SO in SOME part I do blame people. Not every single beautiful glam item has to be on the cash shop and even if they are... there's no way this shite would ever be 18 dollars.

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But....shouldn't you be mad at the people who bought it in China then, not the people here?

Much as how people who pre-ordered ARR got the Caith Sith Minion, the people who joined up to play the Chinese versions were told "Hey, check out these exclusive items that only you can get for this amount of money!"

here's a picture of it in the chinese cash shop:

https://bucket.bluegartr.com/0487470...803730a8c5.png

Now, we can see here that it costs 12800 of, what I am assuming is, Yuan. Now, just pulling up a simple google converter and converting 12800 Yuan to USD we get: $19.18 which is very very close to the price we have in the mog shop.

So, I do understand where you are coming, I do, honestly but the thing I want to point out here is you are getting upset at the wrong people. Not to redirect, because markets are markets. The people who 'begged' (of which I am one) for those items to be brought over did not decide the price, the people at SE in Japan, did not decide the price. The value of that exclusive item was set by the outsourcing company they use to run FFXIV in an area with a closed market, and, it must have sold well because we are seeing a similar price here.

Is that frustrating? Yes, it is. But mind whom you direct your frustrations at because we, as a region, would never have seen this item were it not for asking for it, and, while it's certainly disappointing that it costs so much, I feel it's in bad taste to ask for it to be free when an entire region had to pay what we are paying for it.

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Originally Posted by LillithCale

But....shouldn't you be mad at the people who bought it in China then, not the people here?

Much as how people who pre-ordered ARR got the Caith Sith Minion, the people who joined up to play the Chinese versions were told "Hey, check out these exclusive items that only you can get for this amount of money!"

here's a picture of it in the chinese cash shop:

https://bucket.bluegartr.com/0487470...803730a8c5.png

Now, we can see here that it costs 12800 of, what I am assuming is, Yuan. Now, just pulling up a simple google converter and converting 12800 Yuan to USD we get: $19.18 which is very very close to the price we have in the mog shop.

So, I do understand where you are coming, I do, honestly but the thing I want to point out here is you are getting upset at the wrong people. Not to redirect, because markets are markets. The people who 'begged' (of which I am one) for those items to be brought over did not decide the price, the people at SE in Japan, did not decide the price. The value of that exclusive item was set by the outsourcing company they use to run FFXIV in an area with a closed market, and, it must have sold well because we are seeing a similar price here.

Is that frustrating? Yes, it is. But mind whom you direct your frustrations at because we, as a region, would never have seen this item were it not for asking for it, and, while it's certainly disappointing that it costs so much, I feel it's in bad taste to ask for it to be free when an entire region had to pay what we are paying for it.

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No offence meant but 12800 yuan is $1917 USD not $19.17 that is actually 12800 coupons which you buy using yuan at a rate of 100 per 1 Yuan through the website. Yes the dress costs around $19 as I pointed out earlier in the thread but just want to make sure it is factually correct. Also let us not blame those of us who bought this in the Chinese version. If it was not popular in China I doubt they would have released it ever in North America cash shop or otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Yurimi

No offence meant but 12800 yuan is $1917 USD not $19.17 that is actually 12800 coupons which you buy using yuan at a rate of 100 per 1 Yuan through the website. Yes the dress costs around $19 as I pointed out earlier in the thread but just want to make sure it is factually correct. Also let us not blame those of us who bought this in the Chinese version. If it was not popular in China I doubt they would have released it ever in North America cash shop or otherwise.

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*squints really close to screen*

Wow. So, I can't read. Sorry for that mistake, I totally missed where the . was in the converter I was using. Time for me to put on the cone of shame.

And just to clarify, I'm not trying to pin blame on anyone, though I can see how it can read that way. My intention was moreso to point out to OP that the name calling and otherwise...defensive nature that has been shown towards other people supporting the product was less than needed when considering all the facts behind the origins of the item. Apolgoies if I didn't come across that way.

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Originally Posted by LillithCale

*squints really close to screen*

Wow. So, I can't read. Sorry for that mistake, I totally missed where the . was in the converter I was using. Time for me to put on the cone of shame.

And just to clarify, I'm not trying to pin blame on anyone, though I can see how it can read that way. My intention was moreso to point out to OP that the name calling and otherwise...defensive nature that has been shown towards other people supporting the product was less than needed when considering all the facts behind the origins of the item. Apolgoies if I didn't come across that way.

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I still love you FOREVER for providing that info. Thank you, hoping now people can see it and make clearer complaints. All jokes aside I didn't know it was 19 over there too so this helps. -superomegahugsofjoycauseyouawesome!- Ok I'm done now.

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Originally Posted by LillithCale

*squints really close to screen*

Wow. So, I can't read. Sorry for that mistake, I totally missed where the . was in the converter I was using. Time for me to put on the cone of shame.

And just to clarify, I'm not trying to pin blame on anyone, though I can see how it can read that way. My intention was moreso to point out to OP that the name calling and otherwise...defensive nature that has been shown towards other people supporting the product was less than needed when considering all the facts behind the origins of the item. Apolgoies if I didn't come across that way.

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It is fine I play the Chinese version off and on as well as the NA version (mostly because of the patch timing difference) so I just like to help people understand the differences between them and changes between facts and community created fiction.

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Originally Posted by SessionZero

Pretty sure you're the one who doesn't know what pay to win means. There is an item, given for free, that provides the same exp buff as an item you can pay for. If you buy the dress specifically for the exp buff (which requires all three pieces to be worn, btw, and provides worse stats than the ring you get from Hall of the Novice) then you're not paying to win. You're paying to be a dumbass.

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All three?


The thought of someone trying to use the set in actual dungeons for the exp buff is even more terrifying now....

No. It won't happen. Mog station isn't going anywhere, things will always be sold through it. If you don't like it don't buy it. Etc. Etc. Etc.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

No. It won't happen. Mog station isn't going anywhere, things will always be sold through it. If you don't like it don't buy it. Etc. Etc. Etc.

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Oh look another person missing the point. This thread isn't about "don't buy it if you don't want it"

Let me get this straight... In order to obtain these items in China you had to buy them from the cash shop? Not only that, but the price in their cash shop is pretty similar to what we have had to pay? If that is indeed correct... Every single person who complained about the price, and every single greedy person demanding it for free should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. This is objectively no different than Japanese promotional items. It's one thing to complain about regional exclusives being unfair. It's completely different to demand something for free when other regions have to pay money or do some tacky promotion to obtain it.


Edited for clarity. Thanks, Yurimi.

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Originally Posted by Kerii

Let me get this straight... In order to obtain these items in China you had to get them as a pre-order bonus or buy them from the cash shop? Not only that, but the price in their cash shop is pretty similar to what we have had to pay? If that is indeed correct... Every single person who complained about the price, and every single greedy person demanding it for free should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. This is objectively no different than Japanese promotional items. It's one thing to complain about regional exclusives being unfair. It's completely different to demand something for free with other regions have to pay money or do some tacky promotion to obtain it.

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This is incorrect somewhat. It was NEVER a pre order bonus. It was strictly added ONLY to the cash shop for China for 12800 coupons but back then it was only 16 USD or so after conversion but close enough really. Kind of a "hey we are adding stuff appropriate for your culture you should pay attention to us." deal.