FFXIV moved away from auto-attack while WOW went without... how odd.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

I don't know what classes you play but I never have said problems. On top of that the wait is way less when compared to having to wait for 100% TP in FFXI. The current system does has a few flaws but nothing game breaking. As a Lancer you should never have to wait long for you attacks especially with Speed Surge up.



By the way lag comes from the server side problems that is well known in the game right now and is going to be fixed. The problems doesn't come from the combat system, if you knew anything or had a lick of common sense you would understand that much.

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Just because you have "less wait than XI" doesn't make it reasonable in this day and age. Maybe there are people who, like yourself, enjoy the completely passive mode of playing where you sit there and wait 5-10 seconds to do anything. (and that wait is pretty inarguable when it takes an action 1 to 2 seconds to register and an additional 3 seconds for the animation to play).

The current combat system is horrible. Does it function? Yes. Is it game breaking? That depends on your description of game breaking. Clearly for you anything that "functions" is ok as long as it has the FF label on it. But in a world of modern games and MMOs, many people want something that is both more fluid and more engaging. That is what FFXIV needs to succeed.

Sitting around waiting for attacks to register, waiting for animations to finish playing, and waiting for your very slow auto attacks to play is beyond tedious when it comes to combat. That, tacked onto the horrible, horrible targeting system makes for completely broken, even if functional, combat.

And the comment about speed surge II is cute. Yes, go from waiting 3.7 seconds between auto attacks to 3.4 seconds! What a sea change in speed! Only needing 3 attacks to fill up the TP gauge is still over 12 seconds. Even throwing Ferocity, Raging or MI in there still makes for incredibly, incredibly slow gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Shipp

Did I say it came from the combat system? No. I said there is lag when it comes to combat. Learn to read.

The point that it comes from the servers is proof that EVERYONE has it, so these people stating that they don't are either lying or have no clue what we're even referring to.

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You said that the combat system is horrible because of the lag more or less. So that could be easily misunderstood to what you was actually trying to say. I experience the lag sometimes and then other times it is completely lag free and it could be partially due to my isp and the fact that I play wireless.

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Originally Posted by Hachiko

Just because you have "less wait than XI" doesn't make it reasonable in this day and age. Maybe there are people who, like yourself, enjoy the completely passive mode of playing where you sit there and wait 5-10 seconds to do anything. (and that wait is pretty inarguable when it takes an action 1 to 2 seconds to register and an additional 3 seconds for the animation to play).

The current combat system is horrible. Does it function? Yes. Is it game breaking? That depends on your description of game breaking. Clearly for you anything that "functions" is ok as long as it has the FF label on it. But in a world of modern games and MMOs, many people want something that is both more fluid and more engaging. That is what FFXIV needs to succeed.

Sitting around waiting for attacks to register, waiting for animations to finish playing, and waiting for your very slow auto attacks to play is beyond tedious when it comes to combat. That, tacked onto the horrible, horrible targeting system makes for completely broken, even if functional, combat.

And the comment about speed surge II is cute. Yes, go from waiting 3.7 seconds between auto attacks to 3.4 seconds! What a sea change in speed! Only needing 3 attacks to fill up the TP gauge is still over 12 seconds. Even throwing Ferocity, Raging or MI in there still makes for incredibly, incredibly slow game play.

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I will offer you the same advice as I offer all who just complain like you do. Quit the game and try again once the real final product is released. Don't get on the forums and complain about it because it makes you look like the rest of the trolls out there who come December will have their forum privileges revoked. I understand your opinion but you haven't left it at simply stating an opinion and you have went into a cacophony of whining and moaning and calling the game garbage. The players know already that the game they are playing is still semi broken and FFXIV 2.0 is the fix, it's a year away so take it or leave it.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

I will offer you the same advice as I offer all who just complain like you do. Quit the game and try again once the real final product is released. Don't get on the forums and complain about it because it makes you look like the rest of the trolls out there who come December will have their forum privileges revoked. I understand your opinion but you haven't left it at simply stating an opinion and you have went into a cacophony of whining and moaning and calling the game garbage. The players know already that the game they are playing is still semi broken and FFXIV 2.0 is the fix, it's a year away so take it or leave it.

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Telling people to quit, instead of giving feedback (Read: complaining) makes you the only troll here. Perhaps you should take an ounce of your own advice instead of being a sycophanic yes man.

In fact, you were the first one to even make it personal by accusing another of not having half of a brain. If the forums are truly limited to people such as yourself who are espousing that combat is "fine" as it is, the final product of 2.0 won't be worth playing to anyone.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

You said that the combat system is horrible because of the lag more or less. So that could be easily misunderstood to what you was actually trying to say. I experience the lag sometimes and then other times it is completely lag free and it could be partially due to my isp and the fact that I play wireless.

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This is why you don't run off at the mouth and accuse someone of having no common sense when you aren't 100% what they meant. Seems to be a popular trend here amongst several posters, though.

The combat system on its own is slow and unresponsive. The server lag, which everybody experiences and there is absolutely no connection in the world will fix (besides possibly a lan connection at SE), make it even worse. Thus these people I was talking about saying they don't have lag or combat is 100% fluid are completely lying, deluded, or have no clue what actual fluid combat is.

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Originally Posted by Shipp

This is why you don't run off at the mouth and accuse someone of having no common sense when you aren't 100% what they meant. Seems to be a popular trend here amongst several posters, though.

The combat system on its own is slow and unresponsive. The server lag, which everybody experiences and there is absolutely no connection in the world will fix (besides possibly a lan connection at SE), make it even worse. Thus these people I was talking about saying they don't have lag or combat is 100% fluid are completely lying, deluded, or have no clue what actual fluid combat is.

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I didn't run off at the mouth before I knew what you meant. I was sure what you meant but you failed into wording in properly and I recede my comment. To Hachiko, I am not being a yes man because I genuinely like the game and understand it is currently flawed and I am not the one calling it a crappy game. If you act like a troll and talk like a troll then it must be a troll is the idea of calling you out. You may not be a troll but you sure been acting like one. Also I didn't make it personal I was simply stating a fact that if you don't understand the simple mechanics of the game then you must have no common sense.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

I didn't run off at the mouth before I knew what you meant. I was sure what you meant but you failed into wording in properly and I recede my comment.

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Clearly it is my fault for you jumping to conclusions over my wording and deciding to say I have no common sense. I am clearly at fault.

Stop insulting people and maybe people won't have to snap back at you for making an error.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

I didn't run off at the mouth before I knew what you meant. I was sure what you meant but you failed into wording in properly and I recede my comment. To Hachiko, I am not being a yes man because I genuinely like the game and understand it is currently flawed and I am not the one calling it a crappy game. If you act like a troll and talk like a troll then it must be a troll is the idea of calling you out. You may not be a troll but you sure been acting like one. Also I didn't make it personal I was simply stating a fact that if you don't understand the simple mechanics of the game then you must have no common sense.

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orly: Let's review.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

I don't know what classes you play but I never have said problems. On top of that the wait is way less when compared to having to wait for 100% TP in FFXI. The current system does has a few flaws but nothing game breaking. As a Lancer you should never have to wait long for you attacks especially with Speed Surge up.



By the way lag comes from the server side problems that is well known in the game right now and is going to be fixed. The problems doesn't come from the combat system, if you knew anything or had a lick of common sense you would understand that much.

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You are being a yes man. You conceded that the current system has flaws, but implied that they weren't big flaws. And then later you went on to say that the problems with the combat system aren't in the system itself, but in the latency alone, which is straight up untrue. While the latency has a huge negative effect, there is still a ton of "downtime" in combat in which you are doing nothing but waiting for a couple auto attacks to go off/waiting for long CD skills to come off of CD.

Second, you did run off at the mouth by implying that Shipp didn't know anything or have a lick of common sense, and his comment was clearly worded and anyone with a lick of common sense wouldn't have gone running their mouth before they understood it.

Finally, you're the only one trolling here. Just because your super pro ffxiv doesn't make you not a troll. Telling people to suck it up or gtfo, makes you a troll. Just because I don't like the combat, and think that the combat system on top of the targeting system makes for a completely garbage experience doesn't make me a troll. It just means I'm stating my opinion and that is: The combat system sucks. Just because you have a severe emotional response to any criticism to SE or FFXIV doesn't mean that anyone criticizing it is a troll.

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Originally Posted by Dargoth_Draconia

You said that the combat system is horrible because of the lag more or less. So that could be easily misunderstood to what you was actually trying to say. I experience the lag sometimes and then other times it is completely lag free and it could be partially due to my isp and the fact that I play wireless.



I will offer you the same advice as I offer all who just complain like you do. Quit the game and try again once the real final product is released. Don't get on the forums and complain about it because it makes you look like the rest of the trolls out there who come December will have their forum privileges revoked. I understand your opinion but you haven't left it at simply stating an opinion and you have went into a cacophony of whining and moaning and calling the game garbage. The players know already that the game they are playing is still semi broken and FFXIV 2.0 is the fix, it's a year away so take it or leave it.

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Why should people have to quit, is the game not going P2P in a month or so ? that means the game is pretty much, up to standards right ? wich means any valid complain, concern should be looked into :/

Oh and simply saying "GTFO" is the most trollish thing to say :/

I don't see what the problem is. . . for my pug I can probably get off my 2k tp cost skills after 10 ish seconds. . .


TEN. SECONDS. If that's too long for you then i suggest you go camping for a week. No electronics. Then you can truly appreciate time as it should be.

Also, this is an MMO, boy, and SUPER OMEGA ACTION is not exactly a title FFXIV should foster, nor is it attractive for most MMORPGs.

Does AA make the game boring? Im only a lvl 26 PUG with a lvl 13 THM. I don't find it boring at all! I am always casting SOMETHING and its not easy either, especially with the games clever(IMO) Hate mechanics, i am always trying to keep teh squishies from diein'

Is this situation the same for other classes? I dunno! You tell me :)

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Originally Posted by XxOstiaxX

Why should people have to quit, is the game not going P2P in a month or so ? that means the game is pretty much, up to standards right ? wich means any valid complain, concern should be looked into :/

Oh and simply saying "GTFO" is the most trollish thing to say :/

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I gave constructive criticism by saying quit and come back later on when the game is in better shape and you guys magically turn that into me saying GTFO and for your information Hachi I never called you a troll. I simply said you are acting in a trollish manner by the way you are getting offensive or overly into your point of view when someone replies to you. Sure I could have heeded my own advice and said it simple and clean but you was really rubbing me the wrong way. Would it have changed how you replied back to me? Doubtful. Anyways enough of the shenanigans I got other classes to get to 50, peace.

I personally, was never a fan of the TP portion of the battle system. I prefere something like a mana pool, or attac pool or what ever you want to call it, in which you have X amount in the pool, and it is used for all abilities, WS, buffs, debuffs and what not.

That may or may not be the way to go here, but I definently dislike having to attack a mob just to build up the ability to hit it with my real attacks.

Granted I was pretty general in my ideas, but I just dislike the TP portion and would like to see something workable without it......but thats just me.

Frankly I spend so much time using actions that I barely notice auto attack anyway. They might have added auto attack to the game, but that doesn't mean it's central to combat.

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Originally Posted by Soda

From a Blizzard Developer on the issue of auto attack:

"The monk not having auto attack was controversial around the office too, we are not even 100% sure the monk will keep it. And removing auto attack for other classes will just feel like a huge change. We do crazy things on new stuff, not on old stuff. There are some downsides too - if a monkey has 5hp left they have to wait to push a button again were as a Rogue would just kill it with its auto attack."

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Sounds to me like Blizzard is full of crybabies.

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Originally Posted by KamikazeMan

I hope they get rid of it. Combat seems less strategic for certain classes because of this and auto attack for some classes seem stupid, imo (archers and conjurers for example). I'd rather they work on servers to increase the response time, THEN get rid of it...and allow us to stack actions and have them executed when there is enough stamina for them >_>

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Agreed. I wouldn't mind auto-attack so much if I knew they'd look into implementing a non-AA system.

Honestly, I believe that what needs to be tweaked is the TP system. It's a universal combat system that was incorporated to different classes. It just slows down battles a lot, hopefully this is one of the priorities they have planned for 1.20(skill overhaul) or 2.0

The TP system is fine the way it is, the way that it's so dynamic is how abilities cost different amounts to use, and on different timers. It allows a strategic, ever-changing mechanism for battle that forces you to constantly think of the best way to make use of your TP.
The auto attack feature, for now, may look very bland, but it allows for things such as haste, tp gain based on delay, coming from ffxi store tp, and dps of weapons based on dmg/delay. In the future I'm sure that they will add things that have a greater influence on auto attack. We still have normal attacks that are on timers, I know I use all 3 on my lancer, in case people forgot about heavy thrust, pierce and full thrust, as well as the other classes' counterparts.