Genius Move from SE

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Originally Posted by Ajisaii

Ruining all the jobs and then completely abandoning them for one button combo PvP jobs is something I never would have thought of.

I'm just so glad they decided to pull this off after Dawntrail ruined what was once fully complete jobs (dragoon, dark knight ect) making them shallow vessels of their former selves.

"but you can just play the reborn mode!!!" What's the point if you're dealing less damage and in White Mages case you need to stand still to cast abilities instead of being a phys ranged.

At least have the heart to revert the changes Dawntrail did to fun jobs that didn't need to be changed in anyway before you take them out back and send them to the shadow realm.

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Yup they have literally made the game an ARPG and thats not what I pay to play. I am very disappointed.

I didnt want FF16 combat, I don't like it. But here we are.

More buttons doesn't mean its more complex or more skillful. Look at dark knight for example, many of the buttons do the same exact thing "do damage" but are different buttons for some reason. If they make 10 abilities but they all feel unique and impactful that's way better than having 50 buttons that all do variable amounts of damage but nothing unique or different. It's a bit silly to start raising pitchforks before we really know anything yet.

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Originally Posted by Kelg

More buttons doesn't mean its more complex or more skillful. Look at dark knight for example, many of the buttons do the same exact thing "do damage" but are different buttons for some reason. If they make 10 abilities but they all feel unique and impactful that's way better than having 50 buttons that all do variable amounts of damage but nothing unique or different. It's a bit silly to start raising pitchforks before we really know anything yet.

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And yet look and the BRD & WHM they showed. Bard lost all its RNG and identity, all its EA management, its dot and WHM was gutted.

Nothing about this is complex. They are 100% making an easy mode for new players that is controller focused. I want a classic MMO that's what I pay for not an ARPG

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Originally Posted by Hanzz96

They are 100% making an easy mode for new players that is controller focused.

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If you think about it, it makes sense considering they are also launching on switch 2 now.
Perhaps it was part of their goal? Two birds with one stone. Then they can ween players off the more 'congested' combat system and go the path of convenience and simplicity and use it as justification for why they will introduce these kinds of changes, the community will then spend several months fighting against itself over this and blame the loss of complexity on switch players, yada yada.

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Originally Posted by Hanzz96

And yet look and the BRD & WHM they showed. Bard lost all its RNG and identity, all its EA management, its dot and WHM was gutted.

Nothing about this is complex. They are 100% making an easy mode for new players that is controller focused. I want a classic MMO that's what I pay for not an ARPG

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They explicitly said these were early builds and would probably change into release. It's jumping the gun a bit to say they just ruined every class when you don't even know what most of them will do.

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Originally Posted by Kelg

They explicitly said these were early builds and would probably change into release. It's jumping the gun a bit to say they just ruined every class when you don't even know what most of them will do.

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Except its not jumping the gun in the slightest. We have been complaining about SMN since BEFORE Endwalker released and its now becoming the norm. This isn't some "we can forgive" change or a 1 off job rework, this is an entire system overhaul that is being pushed towards something that the majority do not like. SMN is still one of the least played jobs in the game. DRG is being turned into "Hit 3 positionals, get a big burst", BRD is being turned into "hit 3 songs, get a big burst". The skill floor is being drastically lowered, for what seems like an also drastically lower ceiling.

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Originally Posted by StarryVera

DRG is being turned into "Hit 3 positionals, get a big burst", BRD is being turned into "hit 3 songs, get a big burst".

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This is something I noticed as well and it's concerning. Will this be the flow of all the DPS? Unless they promise some kind of addition as we level through the xpac or in a future update, that's not going to go down well for many people who were looking for less homogeny. This would be a top tier example of the worst kind of homogeny.

I figured they showed two DPS for balance and to break up the showcases but now I am wondering if DPS aren't all being shown side by side because well....they're all very similar outside a unique finisher or gimmick of some kind.

It could be helpful if maybe next time they showed us an example of what they showed on the slide and talked about with the agency and alternate rotations so it doesn't seem like, y'know, a scam.

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Originally Posted by StarryVera

Except its not jumping the gun in the slightest. We have been complaining about SMN since BEFORE Endwalker released and its now becoming the norm. This isn't some "we can forgive" change or a 1 off job rework, this is an entire system overhaul that is being pushed towards something that the majority do not like. SMN is still one of the least played jobs in the game. DRG is being turned into "Hit 3 positionals, get a big burst", BRD is being turned into "hit 3 songs, get a big burst". The skill floor is being drastically lowered, for what seems like an also drastically lower ceiling.

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It is jumping the gun, because they already showed that they can make skills more interesting with dragoon's new jump ability. There's no reason to doom about this before we have a good grasp of what they will be doing. The 2 minute meta made every fight stale and formulaic so if changing the way job gameplay works opens up windows to new fight design its completely worth it imo. Also they also already said they don't want to make things overly simplistic so I doubt they will make all the jobs braindead.

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Originally Posted by Kelg

It is jumping the gun, because they already showed that they can make skills more interesting with dragoon's new jump ability.

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You mean the 4 second boring as hell GCD? That's not interesting in the slightest. That's literally just flashy to be flashy. You can't soak an aoe for uptime because you'll still get a damage down, you can't ignore pitfall mechanics because the hitbox is still on the ground due to game functionality. The only cool thing this could be used for is making a DRG take a tank buster, which would be a negative anyway because the main tank wants to take it to increase their damage. This is especially bad if it is something you are forced to do during the normal rotation of the fight, an average savage is 7+ minutes, if DRG is in a 60 second loop (which is already a stretch by what we've been shown) you are sitting in the air doing nothing for almost 30 FULL SECONDS during a fight. That's 7% of a fight where you aren't hitting any buttons whatsoever. And that's only in the exact scenario I mentioned, it becomes even worse when you tie in downtime phases adding even more "nothing" to a fight.

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Originally Posted by StarryVera

You mean the 4 second boring as hell GCD? That's not interesting in the slightest. That's literally just flashy to be flashy. You can't soak an aoe for uptime because you'll still get a damage down, you can't ignore pitfall mechanics because the hitbox is still on the ground due to game functionality. The only cool thing this could be used for is making a DRG take a tank buster, which would be a negative anyway because the main tank wants to take it to increase their damage. This is especially bad if it is something you are forced to do during the normal rotation of the fight, an average savage is 7+ minutes, if DRG is in a 60 second loop (which is already a stretch by what we've been shown) you are sitting in the air doing nothing for almost 30 FULL SECONDS during a fight. That's 7% of a fight where you aren't hitting any buttons whatsoever. And that's only in the exact scenario I mentioned, it becomes even worse when you tie in downtime phases adding even more "nothing" to a fight.

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With all due respect, that's just your opinion.
As someone who has DRG as their designated Melee next to my ranged preferences, such a High jump with damage dodge/reduction is exactly what I always wanted from that job.
Jumps are the defining trait of that job after all and this does open up some fun shenanigans imo.

The vuln also isn't really important, otherwise Manaward on BLM would also be useless.
Even in Savage you sometimes just take a vuln stack if it makes a mechanic easier to solve.

A job not just being designed around Raiding encounters and having more interesting skills with unique effects is exactly what people, me included, wanted. The implementation like the cut BRD Dots are a fair discussion but that jump is an absolute win for DRG imo.