We have midcore content... just too little too late.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ayche

Also so it is not left unsaid, your subscription cost is just alternative way to pay for the DLC.
In an alternative world, FFXIV would have no subscription fee and each major patch would require 15-20 dollars to access.

---

Not the best example, because we would actually be saving money in that case.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Absurdity

Not the best example, because we would actually be saving money in that case.

---

Damn, I guess that means there is even more things to split into different mtx packages!
Good thing you caught that, we almost left money on the table there.

Everyone has varying definitions of Midcore Content and what it needs to have a longer shelf life.
Would you classify Eureka/Bozja/etc. as Midcore? I suppose you could. BA, Delubrum Reginae, etc could all technically count but these are instances within instances that require a grind just to unlock. The problem comes from the fact that these are kind of time sensitive grinds. If you aren't there when the content is relevant, you'll have a hell of a hard time actually doing any of that content with any frequency.
Variant/Criterion Dungeons should've been the answer since they essentially let you skip the prerequisite grind in order to unlock the content but due to a lackluster reward system and that the content is objectively difficult for the sake of being difficult, it fell off quickly since there wasn't really any reason to go along with it outside of whatever rewards you were trying to unlock. Sure, it appealed to those that like challenging content but since Savage already grants you difficult content and with tangible rewards to go alongside the work, it becomes less appealing. Since they're going to take another stab at Variant/Criterion Dungeons, all they would have to do is make gear that is equivalent to Unaugmented Gear but with a 3rd Guaranteed Materia Slot and the content becomes at least relevant. It wouldn't invalidate Crafted Gear for Raids since you can overmeld that, Unaugmented Gear has the benefit of being upgraded but for those people that want to engage with this type of content, there's a fairly nice carrot on a stick for them. If they don't want people to just grind for a full set of this gear, just do what they always do and put a limitation on the gear, be it weekly lockout, currency grinding, etc.

Now I'll be the 1st to admit that this is a shortsighted fix but the fact is that people like to see themselves progress. Be it level, gear, some collectables that they enjoy (Mounts, Minions, TT Cards, etc.) getting SOMETHING worthwhile does help to keep content relevant for longer than if it wasn't the case, hence the current state of V&C Dungeons. It's a bandaid fix instead of a full on solution but regrettably, solutions that don't require waiting until 7.0 aren't exactly going to happen either. Salvaging it for now would be for the best until a more permanent solution can be made.

I'd do content that is fun even if it hadn't a reward attached to it. But a reward is nice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DiaDeem

Zadnor is always filled with people. Mind you, not full but 9 out of 10 times you'll find a farm party and constant runs for Dalriada. Eureka is also surprisingly active, in all of its instances. When was the last time you visited those instances? Mind you they're not as active as when they were current content, but they're far from dead. Zadnor is still arguably the fastest way to level from 71 to 80, and people are using it for their classes all the way to 90, and the stuff you can buy for clusters and coins still sells really well in the MB.

Eureka surprised me cause I never ran it when it was current, but again: every time I go in there seems to be a train for FATEs and people solo leveling. I'm now well on my way to get my SCH book. I don't think there's a perfect type of content that's guaranteed to never lose its mass appeal, but Bozja and Eureka are doing much better than you may think.

---

Ive been to both a lot since I love said content and I know that they always revive when there isnt a lot to do in the game (which is very very often unlike popular belief) but my comment was more "the content is short" than "the content is unpopular".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Avoidy

Mid-tier difficulty in this game is weird, because it's difficult for people to come to a consensus of what it is (I know a lot of people who felt like bozja was casual and see midcore content as EX-difficulty stuff) and there's not much incentive to run it repeatedly. Casual content and savage content has weekly incentives to do it, but ... for example, with barbariccia EX, I noticed that interest in it dried up after the first week. Not saying people completely stopped doing it, but there was this weird perception of like, if you didn't get it that first week, all the groups still running it would be awful and nobody else would want to run it. And in my experience that's how it went. For the newest EX, I noticed that getting people to run it was like pulling teeth since unlike barb ex you didn't have the savage raiders running it to get their weapon before the new raids came out, since there weren't new 8man savages. Which just left people who wanted 525 weapons or people who liked the glams. I won't speak for everyone, but I watched people struggle to fill groups in the first week, which was kind of a feelsbad moment. Even I had like, 0 interest in getting it done personally.

idk. I wish devs would experiment with (Unreal) stuff in more than just old trials. Unreal alliance raids would be cool as hell imo. The high difficulty 24-man stuff we have now is all gated behind some of the most tedious grinds in the game and then you basically have to join a discord server just to get a reliable team to go in with you. Imagine if we just had a tweaked harder version of dun scaith that anyone could just go in and do after unlocking it, complete with weekly incentives to get it done. idk dude.

---

This is partially the side-effect of drip feeding content the way they do. People are so starved for new things to do they dogpile on whatever releases immediately. It will happen again once Deep Dungeon drops. At least with the accompanying relic there will be more meat on that bone.

As for Unreal. That remains one of the most underutilized ideas and it completely baffles me why. We've had a wealth of new players who have likely never experienced any of the older content at launch and all they've utilized it for is one EX every four months. I imagine it takes time to rescale everything up to our current level but I still think it's a wasted opportunity. Although, adding proper rewards is another problem. Criterion all but died a slow death because the reward were abysmal relative to the effect required. Especially the Savage version. So making any potential Unreal content worthwhile may be tricky.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amarande

This is a problem on both ends. Rewards did not used to be such a need. Remember older JRPGs where the reward was literally just bragging rights (like "Proof of Omega" from FF8)? Now everything needs a functional reward for some reason, you even see it in the FF mainline series (e.g., FF12's Wyrmhero Blade, which you get way too late to actually make any practical use of, but apparently, Yiazmat and Omega needed REWARDS!).

---

Single player games differ in that regard because both their challenge and progression are entirely at the individual player's desire. Omega can be completely curb stomped or cheesed if you know the proper setup. You're also not reliant on other players. Criterion didn't die because nobody did it. Those same players had no reason to go back, thus making it harder for newer players to find groups interested. You wouldn't have that issue with a super boss like Ruby Weapon or Omega.

It should also be noted people did complain about that "Proof of Omega" certificate being incredibly lame.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Minarisweet

Ive been to both a lot since I love said content and I know that they always revive when there isnt a lot to do in the game (which is very very often unlike popular belief) but my comment was more "the content is short" than "the content is unpopular".

---

The content isn't necessarily short. People like to blow through things at a ridiculous pace. I see people talking about how stressed out they are about frontlines when they hit 25 in only 2 weeks. I think I'm level 4. Island 10-12 was done in a day or two and people were actually bragging about having the gator. Meanwhile, I got it done in 13 days with minimal effort.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deveryn

The content isn't necessarily short. People like to blow through things at a ridiculous pace. I see people talking about how stressed out they are about frontlines when they hit 25 in only 2 weeks. I think I'm level 4. Island 10-12 was done in a day or two and people were actually bragging about having the gator. Meanwhile, I got it done in 13 days with minimal effort.

---

Island is still 1 hour of total content, which just happens to be split into two weeks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kazhar

Island is still 1 hour of total content, which just happens to be split into two weeks.

---

True, it's not much time, but the example still shows how people work harder, not smarter. The hour I spent was very chill compared to whatever time others might have spent.

Too late? too late for what? Are we going to a party? :P
And relic's last step always come out after the last hard stuff is out right?