I think it's time we start seeing some data in regards to the changes being made.

There's a balance to be had between crunching the numbers and working on experience, data crunching content ends up soulless and exploitative so I'm not about to complain that they're just going by their best judgement if, most of the time, it works out well.

The Mch ping issue is hard to understand or even fathom if you live near the servers. Or in a country that has great infrastructure. It's hard to believe that a country like the US and some parts of Canada has ok to how are you even connected to the game levels of infrastructure when it comes to accessing anything on line.

I might as well jump into the they do send out surveys and listen group. I got one when I was still on the trial and before EW came out. Heck even when they try to explain the why's and how they're able or not able to do some things some part of the community will and has flipped their collective lids. Anyone remember when we asked for GNB's sounds to be changed and they did so soon after and then "everyone" went all "NO NOT LIKE THAT! WE DIDN'T WANT IT TO BE CHANGED TO THAT! CHANGE IT BACK NOWS!" or the next time we asked for a sound to be changed and Yoshida groaned and basically went "ok, but remember how you reacted last time?" And to no one's surprise people went and flipped their collective lids. So while yes it would be nicer to get more interaction and information, but why should they when the times they do a loud vocal part of the community takes zero seconds to start behaving like spoiled children.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

There's a balance to be had between crunching the numbers and working on experience, data crunching content ends up soulless and exploitative so I'm not about to complain that they're just going by their best judgement if, most of the time, it works out well.

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Say what? how do you think professional software development works, especially larger firms like se/ they don't just flip a coin to make decisions. Yes, experience factors in, but "data crunching' as you refer to it, is very likely used as a basis for many decisions and there's no reason for stating that it is necessarily 'exploitative'. SE is a business, they're going to use it to justify many decisions. It could be for any number of decisions- like whether new data centers are needed, and where they should go. They do have management and shareholders, after all.

Sorry - edited as i saw you explicitly said "content' - however that 'data crunching' is still often run to justify development costs. it's part of building the business case. it's not soulless unless you consider corporate life to be soulless .

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Originally Posted by Nethereal

I personally don't think they effectively compile the data at all. Just my thoughts on how the company has been ran the past 3 years.

As far as we know changes simply come from: The Bros

And sometimes a little from streamers.

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In Lost Ark the CM's kept referencing '' surveys and research '' for their extremely unpopular changes.
And no one knows wtf they're even talking about...

It really just comes across like they're pulling something out their ass to try and make it sound like it's only a small vocal minority who dislikes it and that the majority are actually in favor of it.
Sadly I think a lot of devs do listen to Streamers too, Streamers don't have the same experience as the average player and also just have personal biases and opinions that are just irrelevant on a grander scheme.
They're just randos who Stream games and sometimes happened to become popular their opinions are really not anymore relevant than just one person on a forum ( unless maybe if they're pro E-sports players, but even then it's not necessarily reflected that comes with other more niche experiences ).

The truth is probably that and also opinions at the office and market research that has nothing to do with the game or perhaps even video games altogether.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

The Mch ping issue is hard to understand or even fathom if you live near the servers. Or in a country that has great infrastructure. It's hard to believe that a country like the US and some parts of Canada has ok to how are you even connected to the game levels of infrastructure when it comes to accessing anything on line.

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The world isn't just the US, Canada and Japan. I'm Indian and the minimum ping I get is ~150 on EU DCs. I've seen people from South America and Southeast Asia raise their voices plenty regarding this problem.

Not even asking for a special DC just for me, by the way. I really just want them to mitigate whatever goes on under the hood when it comes to weaving. If modifications can, why can't they? They were listening to feedback right?

I suspect they avoid going into too much detail because they know it would expose any poor decisions and cause potential uproar.

For example, they nerfed Expedient on SCH because it was "too strong", but didn't go into the exact situations it was overpowered, why it deserved a nerf more than something like Macrocosmos on p3 and the thought process behind the decision. Changes are if they did, it would be some nonsense like "it let us finish dungeons faster than intended" or whatever excuse and the healer forums would undergo a nuclear explosion. But by being vague, players assume there must be some sort of logic that the devs see that they don't and merely grumble a little.

If you're going to explain your decisions publically, you need to be able to back up your choices and show you really know what you're talking about. What you say will be examined critically. If you say nothing, there's nothing to examine and no faults in your logic to point out.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

I suspect they avoid going into too much detail because they know it would expose any poor decisions and cause potential uproar.

For example, they nerfed Expedient on SCH because it was "too strong", but didn't go into the exact situations it was overpowered, why it deserved a nerf more than something like Macrocosmos on p3 and the thought process behind the decision. Changes are if they did, it would be some nonsense like "it let us finish dungeons faster than intended" or whatever excuse and the healer forums would undergo a nuclear explosion. But by being vague, players assume there must be some sort of logic that the devs see that they don't and merely grumble a little.

If you're going to explain your decisions publically, you need to be able to back up your choices and show you really know what you're talking about. What you say will be examined critically. If you say nothing, there's nothing to examine and no faults in your logic to point out.

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But....people are already doing that anyway lol

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Originally Posted by SannaR

The Mch ping issue is hard to understand or even fathom if you live near the servers. Or in a country that has great infrastructure. It's hard to believe that a country like the US and some parts of Canada has ok to how are you even connected to the game levels of infrastructure when it comes to accessing anything on line.

I might as well jump into the they do send out surveys and listen group. I got one when I was still on the trial and before EW came out. Heck even when they try to explain the why's and how they're able or not able to do some things some part of the community will and has flipped their collective lids. Anyone remember when we asked for GNB's sounds to be changed and they did so soon after and then "everyone" went all "NO NOT LIKE THAT! WE DIDN'T WANT IT TO BE CHANGED TO THAT! CHANGE IT BACK NOWS!" or the next time we asked for a sound to be changed and Yoshida groaned and basically went "ok, but remember how you reacted last time?" And to no one's surprise people went and flipped their collective lids. So while yes it would be nicer to get more interaction and information, but why should they when the times they do a loud vocal part of the community takes zero seconds to start behaving like spoiled children.

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Take a look at this. I've seen some other articles, but this one https://techblog.comsoc.org/2021/12/...nked-by-cable/ lists Canada as significantly lower than the US in terms of download speed, which I would believe- and that's an average. I live in the suburbs of one of Canada's largest cities and I simply cannot get even the speed in that article with the largest telcos, and they will not upgrade the infrastructure in the foreseeable future. Add a ping that is easily around 100 if not more due to where the servers are located, and no, not everyone in has the nice experience as someone in a country with a small physical geography and excellent infrastructure like Japan, OR even people located on the West coast NA.

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Originally Posted by RobynDaBank

The world isn't just the US, Canada and Japan. I'm Indian and the minimum ping I get is ~150 on EU DCs. I've seen people from South America and Southeast Asia raise their voices plenty regarding this problem.

Not even asking for a special DC just for me, by the way. I really just want them to mitigate whatever goes on under the hood when it comes to weaving. If modifications can, why can't they? They were listening to feedback right?

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I know there's more places than Japan, Canada and the US. I was mostly writing from personal experience and knowledge about how crappy the infrastructure in the US and Canada can be in spots. Compared to those who live in countries that have great infrastructure when it comes to the net. Along with how the distance from said servers can help impead on one's experience when playing. One of the earliest times the problem was brought to Yoshida's attention the answer was basically people should be able to play not only the job but the game easily with 200 ping. The player base basically replied with "In what country!?".

Thus the whole it's hard to test let alone realize how craptastic some countries infrastructure is when it comes to the internet. Especially when your connection is always smooth as silk. When you can't replicate the situation your players are having it's hard to find out the best way to fix it. I'm just glad we have the dev team that we do. If this was the FF XI back before Tanaka left to start on XIV we'd get radio silence for the most part and when we'd finally get any response it would be them telling us to basically hush and to be happy we have a game to play.

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Originally Posted by IDontPetLalas

Take a look at this. I've seen some other articles, but this one https://techblog.comsoc.org/2021/12/...nked-by-cable/ lists Canada as significantly lower than the US in terms of download speed, which I would believe- and that's an average. I live in the suburbs of one of Canada's largest cities and I simply cannot get even the speed in that article with the largest telcos, and they will not upgrade the infrastructure in the foreseeable future. Add a ping that is easily around 100 if not more due to where the servers are located, and no, not everyone in has the nice experience as someone in a country with a small physical geography and excellent infrastructure like Japan, OR even people located on the West coast NA.

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Oh I know how ridiculous it can be. I also know how horrible Roger's can be to their customers who are paying for their top package and still get abysmal download speeds. I'd have crap ping even back when the servers were in Montreal and I was living in Ontario. I'm just more familiar with the US and the rural US where many of those parts might not even have broadband.