Lalafell and Dwarves... Plot Hole Potential?

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I still can't see the size difference you're describing. The dwarf side is a few pixels lower than it should be, but the scale looks correct compared to the original picture.

The bottom edge of the tabard is off by a few pixels, and the base of the beard by about that same amount, and the outer 'plait' of the beard by again the same amount. That tells me the scale is consistent, or the degree of mismatch would be different between the top and bottom of the image.



The dwarf's eyes are definitely on the Lalafell's cheeks, and - if you assumed they're a different race simply borrowing the Lalafell body model for animation's sake - it changes their entire apparent appearance.

If that's where their eyes are, then assuming they have a "human-shaped" head with the eyes roughly in the middle, the top of their head would be somewhere around where the horns are on their helmet - but they're still using the body proportions designed for the Lalafell model.

Not having any visible hair to 'fluff up' the size of their head doesn't help either.

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I wouldn't be surprised if it's just a stylistic choice to make them resemble classic FF dwarves more.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

I wouldn't be surprised if it's just a stylistic choice to make them resemble classic FF dwarves more.

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I agree. The helmet-and-beard is just a glamour.

In regards to the whole picture comparison, looking at the originals themselves, you can see from the relative heights of the eye levels compared to the near side of the axe-blade that the lalafell does indeed have a higher-eye level.

On another note, BOTH of these pictures are on the official promotion site, which I believe is more evidence that the dwarves do indeed share the same head as lalafells and it was not a joke on the devs part.

Well if it is a Beast Tribe, for me we're likely to never see anything more than these models (with a few tweaks for any kind of leader for instance), because that's how beast tribes kind of work.

So I went back to the stream and what put me on that track is what Koji says (roughly at 1:45:00 mark); "what kind of model are they using?"
I really think that the picture is just there to make the connexion between the two, as they say "Never without the helmets but it's a keynot so we can take it off".

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Originally Posted by Mansion

Well if it is a Beast Tribe, for me we're likely to never see anything more than these models (with a few tweaks for any kind of leader for instance), because that's how beast tribes kind of work.

So I went back to the stream and what put me on that track is what Koji says (roughly at 1:45:00 mark); "what kind of model are they using?"
I really think that the picture is just there to make the connexion between the two, as they say "Never without the helmets but it's a keynot so we can take it off".

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If they're identical to their Source counterpart like all the other races(based on the cinematic at least), then NPCs taking off their beards and helmets so that they can emote during cutscenes is hardly a stretch. If you have a base model that's rigged, it makes sense to use it.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

If they're identical to their Source counterpart like all the other races(based on the cinematic at least), then NPCs taking off their beards and helmets so that they can emote during cutscenes is hardly a stretch. If you have a base model that's rigged, it makes sense to use it.

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Of course but they can emote while keeping them, right? If they are a beast tribe and I guess it's not that far fetched to assume they could be the crafting beast tribe quest, we don't need deep interactions with them really.
Now they can use lalafells models and their base set of animations for anger, panick, suprise, joy emotes, and just not include anything requiring facial expressions.

I'd personally rather have a real new beast tribe with Dwarves having a proper lore of these 12 000 years from lala ancestor to dwarves (like they could not fit in mines narrow corridors with fat lala heads). Have them have their own voices, gimmicks and all.

One of the main points of the Beast Tribe quests is to make the characters and players question why "Beast Tribes" are a thing at all. All Beast Tribes have the same mental faculties as the player races do and that has gotten more and more focus as the game has gone on.

The Lalafell's being a "Beast Tribe" is just progressing that idea even further. By now, "Beast Tribes" might as well be a gameplay term for a type of daily quest system instead of an in-universe term for races that are somehow "lesser".

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Originally Posted by Mansion

Of course but they can emote while keeping them, right? If they are a beast tribe and I guess it's not that far fetched to assume they could be the crafting beast tribe quest, we don't need deep interactions with them really.
Now they can use lalafells models and their base set of animations for anger, panick, suprise, joy emotes, and just not include anything requiring facial expressions.

I'd personally rather have a real new beast tribe with Dwarves having a proper lore of these 12 000 years from lala ancestor to dwarves (like they could not fit in mines narrow corridors with fat lala heads). Have them have their own voices, gimmicks and all.

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I meant with their faces, which is what humans identify the most. The non-player races(save for minor variations on their models, like Padjal and pureblood Garleans) don't have the rigging or even polygons to do much more than lipflaps.

The standard beast tribe models have no character variation (even for the human-faced Ananta) and minimal ability for facial expressions. As an equivalent beast tribe, the dwarves don't need it either, just because we know in other circumstances they could have it.