Warrior pretty much the Go-To tank for now.

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Originally Posted by Tila

Highest DPS? Yep
Burst? Why yes, thank you for restating the first point, you're obviously not trying to be biased.

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I did read the entire thread, but something to point out to be a devil's advocate:

He didn't restate his first point; there's a difference between burst and DPS. Burst is how quickly you can pile up damage on demand, and DPS is sustained over the course of time.

It's actually different because even if you can knock the living bejeezus out of something, that may mean blowing all of your cooldowns and leaving you at subpar DPS for a while following the burst.

dots, bonus auto-attacks, good potency combos, stun on demand, best defensive cooldowns, best "ultimate" cooldown, protect, stoneskin, clemency, divine veil.

Damage, tanking, heals and shields: you want the class that does it all? You want Paladin!

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Originally Posted by Jandor

dots, bonus auto-attacks, good potency combos, stun on demand, best defensive cooldowns, best "ultimate" cooldown, protect, stoneskin, clemency, divine veil.

Damage, tanking, heals and shields: you want the class that does it all? You want Paladin!

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Shit Aoe dmg............
shit aoe aggro keeping.....

Stop feeding the troll.

First, he never bring you more information than "Of course, I am right, you're stupid to not see this".
Second, he didn't even respect other people to quote properly, always replacing by "You're wrong".
Third, it's at least the third topic where he spouts his nonsense

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Originally Posted by Zordrage

shit aoe aggro keeping.....

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Eh? "Flash moar" no longer works?

From what I see Paladin still has alot more mitigation, but Warrior wins hands down in terms of DPS.

Dark Knight I haven't really tried yet, but from what others have told me, they are guy in the middle, more mitigation than Warrior and less than Paladin, more DPS than Paladin and less warrior. Can't wait to try it after I get Paladin to 60.

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Originally Posted by Syfer22

Eh? "Flash moar" no longer works?

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AFAIK it's never been enough for the truly high end DPS that do single target. For example, if you've got a BLM and a MNK... Yes, Flash spam on a large group will keep the AoE-spamming BLM from pulling any, but if the monk decides to demolish one at a time.... you aren't going to hold hate using only flash if he's decent.

Generally though, and for 99% of the time in DF, I would call it 'sufficient'.


More generally about DRKs:
At level 60 in ilvl gear, it seems there are a select few that can really output a chunk of DPS. I would expect them to outdo the average duty finder DPSer, but these are not average tank players it's coming from.

As more people get to level cap and gear up, it will be interesting to see where the numbers fall...

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Originally Posted by Faytte

Clemency is without outside buffs, healing for the same as equilibrium (fact--there are posts and pics of it hitting around 2.7K at level 58 and scaling off strength and weapon damage). You can cast it twice without any pause (also a fact) and you recover enough mana to cast it again after 1 sheltron and riot blade combo. If you look at your math before, half was from one ability, which is something a paladin can spam in a jiff, and something that is effected by cova (which paladins have a better version of. There is no defensive cd warriors have an improved version of that matters, given foresight is a joke). If you think IB heals mean anything in raiding, then I laugh at you--IB is used strictly for its 20% debuff before a tank buster (you should be topped off before that). It honestly sounds like you are speaking from dungeon experience, which means nothing in raiding.

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I've actually critted for over 6.5k with Clemency (no Convalescence) at level 60 with 180 weapons. The best part about critting someone else for 6k+ is that I also gain back 3k+ hp myself. If we're at a point where I'm having to heal another party member, it almost goes without saying that I'm probably hurting for HP as well. Clemency is an incredibly strong support skill and despite the high mana cost I can keep using it just by spamming Sheltron off cd (restores 700+ mana) and throwing in some Riot Blade combos. Sheltron itself is an amazing cooldown considering that tank busters tend to lean toward physical damage. An automatic block once every 30 seconds is pretty strong, plus that 700+ mana restored is nothing to sneeze at. I'm really enjoying the enhanced utility that paladins have with the new skills. ^^

As far as warrior goes, I'm expecting to see Raw Intuition's auto crit heals get fixed and Fell Cleave to get beat with the nerf stick. A warrior on my server supposedly routinely hits for 11k+ with it, which just seems ridiculous. >.>

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

snip

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People keep forgetting that DPS will scale way better with gear for damage. So as of now, WAR seems OP. Get some gear, WAR wont be hitting as hard in comparison to DPS.

Wouldnt surprise me if people had said WAR was OP for DPS at the start of ARR if they hadnt been so under powered. That is to say, if we had the fixed warrior at ARR launch, people would comment its doing so much damage.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

AFAIK it's never been enough for the truly high end DPS that do single target. For example, if you've got a BLM and a MNK... Yes, Flash spam on a large group will keep the AoE-spamming BLM from pulling any, but if the monk decides to demolish one at a time.... you aren't going to hold hate using only flash if he's decent.

Generally though, and for 99% of the time in DF.

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WTFDIJR

Sounds like a terrible PLD. No way a MNK/BLM combo would ever pose a hate threat to a decent PLD.