Cleric stance = Commendation

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

stuff said

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We had this discussion over and over on the healer forums.
Of course you don't DPS if you have healing to do, noone here stated to go all over and stop healing at any costs - it's called being aware of the situation.

And just because you encountered some bad healers doesn't mean you're right with "Cleric is a bad thing to use".

Just get over it, it's okay to not main healer and be a little more cautious when you play it - but if you are a self proclaimed learner, don't give tips here that are wrong and get into arguments with ppl that really do have experience.

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Originally Posted by Spoekes

We had this discussion over and over on the healer forums.
Of course you don't DPS if you have healing to do, noone here stated to go all over and stop healing at any costs - it's called being aware of the situation.

And just because you encountered some bad healers doesn't mean you're right with "Cleric is a bad thing to use".

Just get over it, it's okay to not main healer and be a little more cautious when you play it - but if you are a self proclaimed learner, don't give tips here that are wrong and get into arguments with ppl that really do have experience.

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Who was giving tips? I stated that I, being a DPS SPECIALIST and a Novice Healer do not use cleric stance because I find it risky. How is that Advise? That sounds like stating an opinion to me. All any of you have managed to change about my opinion is granting me the information that DoTs are, in fact, enhanced by damage potency buffs. That didn't change my stance on Cleric though, I still don't like it and when I tank I don't particularly like seeing healers using it. Seeing Cleric Stance when I'm a PLD makes it that much less likly that I'm going too pull more than two packs at a time lest you start spamming Holy and forget how to friggin heal right until AFTER we wipe. If I'm tanking and see cleric you can almost guarantee the DPS is going to get my com.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

Who was giving tips? I stated that I, being a DPS SPECIALIST and a Novice Healer do not use cleric stance because I find it risky. How is that Advise? That sounds like stating an opinion to me. All any of you have managed to change about my opinion is granting me the information that DoTs are, in fact, enhanced by damage potency buffs. That didn't change my stance on Cleric though, I still don't like it and when I tank I don't particularly like seeing healers using it. Seeing Cleric Stance when I'm a PLD makes it that much less likly that I'm going too pull more than two packs at a time lest you start spamming Holy and forget how to friggin heal right until AFTER we wipe. If I'm tanking and see cleric you can almost guarantee the DPS is going to get my com.

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ok we can argue semantics now.
I think if you promote your playstyle on Cleric stance and give reasons why, it can be called advice.

Give your coms to whom you want lol.

Your skill as a Healer should ultimately decide whether you're bouncing in and out of Cleric stance for DPS, or if you should just focus on heals. Having just gotten my WHM, I know personally that I'm not so good at the stance dance, so I usually just focus on healing. Unless a crucial mechanic is ignored, there will be no wipe. If the tank is good with his support skills and the DPS are actually dodging, then maybe I'll add some modest damage. That being said, I know the expectation endgame is that you have to be able to heal, dps, and god knows even tank as a healer.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

Who was giving tips? I stated that I, being a DPS SPECIALIST and a Novice Healer do not use cleric stance because I find it risky. How is that Advise? That sounds like stating an opinion to me. All any of you have managed to change about my opinion is granting me the information that DoTs are, in fact, enhanced by damage potency buffs. That didn't change my stance on Cleric though, I still don't like it and when I tank I don't particularly like seeing healers using it. Seeing Cleric Stance when I'm a PLD makes it that much less likly that I'm going too pull more than two packs at a time lest you start spamming Holy and forget how to friggin heal right until AFTER we wipe. If I'm tanking and see cleric you can almost guarantee the DPS is going to get my com.

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And that's where you got absolutely ridiculous. By the time WHM gets Holy, s/he gets Divine Seal and Presence of Mind, should be able to get Swiftcast. That is to say, that your healer's more than able to to get tank back from 15-20% HP to comfortable HP (which is 70-80% HP) in a matter of 3GCD. The situation does include all the incoming damage.

CS dance is a sign of a good healer or an eager-to-learn healer. It's fine to play safe and not shuffle stances - especially on your first runs through the dungeons, - you can even be a pretty good healer without it (one of my FC healers is amazing even though she rarely ever uses CS. Heck, she almost made it through all Expert roulette dungeons without wipes on the first try despite not knowing mechanics at all), but... you really need to re-think how you deal with your coms. Right now, you basically want your healers to lose half of their utility to the group.

When I first started healing, I was SCH. I almost never went into CS because...well, I was nervous. Especially those first few runs as a healer...ahaha wow.
Now I pretty much am constantly in CS and really only need to get out if big damage is coming (including some big pulls I'm not used to) or someone oops'd and got hit harder than they should've.

As a WHM however I'm still pretty bad so I rarely go into CS, maybe for a few Holys, but that's it. I'm still practicing healing timing and such with this job. If you aren't personally comfortable going into CS, then don't. That easy.

Anyway if I'm DPSing and not impressed by the tank or overly impressed by the healer, usually the comm will go to the healer (or an outstanding bard. gotta support good bards). If I'm tanking, if I'm not dead then the healer is doing their job, I don't care what they're doing in the meantime, whether it's DPSing or just standing there (but that must be so boring.....anyway). My comm will usually go to the healer if it isn't a friend (since I don't like to run as tank by myself... still pretty nervous).

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

Seeing Cleric Stance when I'm a PLD makes it that much less likly that I'm going too pull more than two packs at a time lest you start spamming Holy and forget how to friggin heal right until AFTER we wipe. If I'm tanking and see cleric you can almost guarantee the DPS is going to get my com.

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I mean if you're tanking you should be aware of what's happening but really just because a healer is in CS doesn't mean they aren't going to be healing you. It's sort of a silly judgement call.... for real if you wipe because the healer is DPSing two things are going to happen: one, next time they aren't going to be so don't worry about it or two, they really are terrible and telling them to stop isn't going to fix it anyway.

Also Holy has Stun. Stun is amazing.

Whoah! Holy is amazing. If I do a big pull, I am banking on holy coming out. With a bloodbath/berserk/steel cyclone/ spam OP, holy will burn the mobs down. If I don't see holy come out on a couple of initial pills I tend to be a lot more cautiou in pull size.

I love Cleric Stance, making things dead means less damage that I have to heal, and it makes the run go faster as a bonus. Considering that plenty of tanks are running around with 8k or more HP, there's a significant window where we can safely DPS, and an even bigger window if you're one to take calculated risk. I very rarely cause a wipe, but I'll be up front and apologize right away if it happens, and the run goes on. It's always nice to see my extra effort rewarded by a chat window full of commends, so keep them coming!

What I'm reading here is that not only are you a bad healer giving bad advice, you're also a bad tank who's afraid to use cooldowns because of some phobia when he sees Cleric Stance on his healer. Ok.

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Originally Posted by axemtitanium

What I'm reading here is that not only are you a bad healer giving bad advice, you're also a bad tank who's afraid to use cooldowns because of some phobia when he sees Cleric Stance on his healer. Ok.

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Uhm Now you're insulting my tanking skills? I understand now why over half of Balmung's "Elite" FCs disappeared in the 3 months I was on Adamantiois. You elitist and elitist wannabes need to go back to WoW and DDO if you have that much of a problem.

I was Tanking in AK Normal about an Hour ago helping an FC member that was new to endgame get her relic. And all the cool downs active at once didn't save me from a CLERIC STANCE HEALER DPSing instead of Healing. I'll be going now cause the ignorant elitism on the dungeon board is nauseating. So fair well and may the Dravanian's gnaw on your manaless corpses in 3.0.

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