So, you mages....

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Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

@Echoica

I know exactly what you mean, I see this all the time when I am tanking ex roulette and it can be very frustrating.

I don't mind if a healer goes cleric stance and dpses as long as they are not slacking on their primary role. If my health is constantly dropping to around 10% in a fight and I'm having to pop all my defensive CD's to just stay alive during a trash pull, there is a problem.

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Why? There's no problem unless one of you die. Are you implying using your defensive cooldowns will slow down the run?

If the run ends with no casualties and no slow downs due to a healer's behavior then that is all that matters. Whether you dropped to 1% or stood at 100% all the time is irrelevant as long as no delays were introduced. As far as I know, using defensive cooldows won't introduce any delay.

It seems to me the rant is about you feeling uncomfortable and quite honestly, that's mostly your problem.

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Originally Posted by TouchandFeel

This also tends to lead to my favorite tanking situation, where I have a whm spamming holy and the two dps are single targeting different mobs, neither of which are the mob that I marked as he primary target to focus on.

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We still do that focus thing?

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On another note, I have a hard time understanding these arguments. The game has pretty much no situations where this is relevant. All roulette dungeons and trials are faceroll easy and the few hard challenges are beyond these petty complains.

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Originally Posted by Sartori

Whats the story with your heals and raises? Do you guys not have them on your bar or are you just not interested in healing or raising people?

Enlighten me:)

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You hit it on the head, I don't want to heal, and I don't have either raise spell available to me. If you want to see why, play as archer (not bard) for a while with Cure/Physick as one of your cross class skills and try to do some healing.

ps - if you are pulling hate while standing at a distance from the tank, I'm cheering for the mob to kill you anyway.

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Originally Posted by Sartori

Whats the story with your heals and raises? Do you guys not have them on your bar or are you just not interested in healing or raising people?

Enlighten me:)

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Stop pulling before the tank then I might give you a heal :3

As a black mage I'm too busy out dpsing you while properly maintaining my emnity level to waste MP and DPS uptime to heal anyone with a 513 physick spell cross classed.

If you are a DPS and you are dying to mechanics it's really not other peoples fault if you aren't raised quickly or not being healed if you are taking unnecessary damage. If you are a tank and not being healed enough during encounters then... Take that up with your healer, you really don't want a 500ish physick spell from a cross class job when you are potentially getting hit with attacks that do from 3-4K in some fights.

Give me a mount for randomly raising people not in FC/LS/Friends list. 500 raise

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Originally Posted by lyricmacabre

On a side note: I LOVE summoners that go out of their way to raise people.

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Getting my relic on smn involved me raising a healer in ifrit hm ( both were dead ). It IS an incredible bonus to have, but really, it's 9/10 times only gonna save the day in a forgiving situation, such as a hm primal. It's also easy peasy MP wise for a smn to raise, sure it will hurt his dps to use energy drain, but better a smn hurts his dps than a sch wastes aetherflow on energy drain to sort mp, and whm raising.....hurts xc

As for heal, if it gets that bad, it's pretty much wipe. It's like asking why paladins don't heal themselves. But I guess, if a healer was dead, and the other was up to his eyeballs healing tank and dps, the smn could help out by healing the healier a little or even himself.

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Originally Posted by Iriadysa

Why? There's no problem unless one of you die.

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And a tank running on the ragged edge of death for a fight is asking for a wipe. How dense can someone be?

A fully healed tank can pick up unexpected adds without worrying about the sudden boost to the damage they are taking, whereas a tank around 10% could be nearly insta-killed by those same adds.

Your logic fails to look beyond the "nothing unexpected will happen" attitude.

And I'm sure we're all glad everything for you is faceroll easy and never has hiccups or bumps to cope with. I'd be pretty bored if it were me, but if its how you like things, then I guess enjoy.

I main WHM, and my tanks stay healed, and, surprisingly... alive... even when shit happens due to something unexpected. If you're the healer, and dps'ing while the tank sits at 10-25% of his health, you've got no business being a healer imho. (and I'm betting plenty of tanks would agree).

Pull ahead of tank, afk, stand in every aoe, don't listen to marks and I suddenly forget how to heal you...

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Originally Posted by Maero

Ooh then i would get commendations? :)
I have raise on my hotbar as summoner and do raise players to help out

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Nope. You still wouldn't usually. if you want to commendate farm, use guildhests as a Scholar from the first guildhest up to more than a feeler. Scholars are super OP in low level.

@Iriadysa

Yes, me having to pop all my cooldowns in a single pull can slow down the run as a whole. I pace out my CD's to try to minimize the amount of healing necessary per pull which should then hopefully allow the healer to be able to maximize their dps, resulting in the mobs going down faster. If I am left with no CD's to use for 2-3 pulls that can potentially slow things down overall.

I also don't need my HP at 100% when I am tanking, even it hovering a bit below 50% most of the time is fine. When it is as low as 10% most of the time that leaves far too little flex room for a healer to react in most cases and get off a heal if something like a crit lands and yes this situation has resulted in me dying a number of times, to which the usual healer reaction has been something along the line of "lol, I forgot to heal".

Yes some people still do mark and I feel it is a good habit to be in when doing df or pug's since you don't know the skill level of the players you are being put with. By default I start with marking, if the group seems to know what they are doing I stop, otherwise I continue. It takes me no time to do since I mark while running to the next group so there is no good reason to not mark.

Yes, the roulette dungeons are super easy yet still I get put in parties that somehow manage to wipe in them because people do things that they shouldn't like aoe'ing the adds on the archer boss in Tam Tara HM, this has happened to me the last 2 times I have run the dungeon. So just because the dungeons are easy to those that know them, that still doesn't mean that people don't screw up in them or just plain don't know what they are doing even though they have said they do.

Lastly, calling my opinions on my recent experiences using the df as petty and insinuating that my statements are irrelevant and that I don't know what I am doing as a tank is completely uncalled for. These are my opinions based upon my experiences, just because you might have been more lucky and not dealt with stuff like this does not invalidate what I have said.