BLM Fire II incredibly lack luster

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Originally Posted by Taemek

You are doing more DPS because you are hitting more mobs....../facepalm

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Yeah, that's the point of using your AoE skills. You do more DPS because you hit multiple mobs.

No one has said using an AoE skill is better for ST DPS in this thread, at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Taemek

Let us use the OP's numbers.

320 divide by 3 = 106.6 DPS per mob for Blizzard II.
260 divide by 1 = 260 DPS per mob for Fire/Blizz rotation combo rotation.

Over a period of 10 seconds:

1066 DPS for Blizzard II spam on 3 mobs
2600 DPS for Fire/Blizz combo on single target, hence the only time AoE becomes efficient is when there is more then 5 mobs as smashing down 3 mobs with single target DPS is more efficient and faster then AoEing.

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You literally started with this.
"Oh, it does 106 DPS per mob."
"On 3 mobs it does 106 DPS."


WAT

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kevee

Yeah, that's the point of using your AoE skills. You do more DPS because you hit multiple mobs.

No one has said using an AoE skill is better for ST DPS in this thread, at all.


You literally started with this.
"Oh, it does 106 DPS per mob."
"On 3 mobs it does 106 DPS."


WAT

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Anyone who can read or has a strong reading comprehension skill level knows you have an issue understanding this entire equation and concept.

As I said, it is your account, play it how you want.

First off, I want to point out that this was not a test to compare what rotations should be done, or situationality of abilities, it was purely a dps test for sustained AOE damage from Blizzard 2 compared to sustained damage in a myriad of fire 2 rotations. Discussion about efficiency and optimal rotations really don't apply. The only thing I wanted to bring attention to is that the cost and cast time for fire 2 make it less efficient in most situations. Situations where it should be used it can be foregone for a weaker spell that actually works better and requires less thought to use. I certainly don't know where the debate started about using aoes all the time rather than single target dps, since the entire point of my post was how fire 2 compares to blizzard 2.

The only reason my tests involved 3 targets is because I only know of one location where there are three striking dummies close enough to continuously AOE on.

With several phases in turn 4 and the emergence of wanderer's palace mass pulls aoe damage rotations are increasingly important. And maximizing dps should be a concern. Whether it should be the only concern is again, not a point I was discussing here.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ferth

snip

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My apologies. I'm at work, and got carried away for..Almost 3 pages.

Regarding Sleigh's post on the first page, would you do another/a few Fire III->Fire IIxX->Blizzard II->Repeat? The huge disparity in your tests, compared to theirs, is something that needs to be looked at.

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Originally Posted by Taemek

I just realized this is where you are misunderstanding what eDPS is.

A pack of mobs do not share anything, period. 3 x 10k hp = 30k hp.

So if we use your example:

320 dps across the collective which is 30k hp = 30'000hp collectively / 320 dps = 93.75 seconds.

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Except that you're damaging them all at the same time
So the groups effective hp remains 10,000

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Originally Posted by faceroll

Except that you're damaging them all at the same time
So the groups effective hp remains 10,000

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Correct, however that wasn't the point that was being made and I never used a collective amount of HP to measure anything. That was something someone else used. I was simply pointing out that 10khp per mob or 30khp across 3 mobs makes no difference, the time spent in combat is the same. As shown:

320 dps across the collective which is 30k hp = 30'000hp collectively / 320 dps = 93.75 seconds.

320dps / 3 mobs = 106.6dps per mob = 10'000hp per mob / 106.6dps = 93.8 seconds.

Anyways, we have gone on for 3 pages about it. Sorry Ferth for slightly derailing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Taemek

Correct, however that wasn't the point that was being made and I never used a collective amount of HP to measure anything. That was something someone else used. I was simply pointing out that 10khp per mob or 30khp across 3 mobs makes no difference, the time spent in combat is the same. As shown:

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Incorrect
you're calculating the DPS
you're not calculating how fast the group dies.
the groups effective hp is 10,000, so they die faster.
:)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kevee

My apologies. I'm at work, and got carried away for..Almost 3 pages.

Regarding Sleigh's post on the first page, would you do another/a few Fire III->Fire IIxX->Blizzard II->Repeat? The huge disparity in your tests, compared to theirs, is something that needs to be looked at.

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I absolutely can, I was very confused by their results as well. The main thing I noticed about fire2 is that with full stacks of astral fire it has a rather long cast time, which prompted me to see how just blizzard 2 spam compared.

Still trying to find out why Taemek is talking about single target dps when all the numbers given in this thread were for AoE DPS. I guess if he actually leveled BLM he would know fire 2 is AoE. He'd also know it is impossible to run out of mp spamming blizzard 2.

Fire 2 and blizz 2 have different role, fire 2 allows to do AoE without take risk far from the group, when blizz 2 make you go into the melee.
if the monster don't have AoE Blizz 2 is better, if they have AoE around them Fire 2 is the trick.


if you allows me one second for come back to AoE vs 1 target, he is right, when your parseer give you the dps, is the damage done to all the target while x time... more target means more dps, but the hp pool stay the same, since you hit all the target at the same time.
like it was said, the break point for make the AoE be better is 4-5 monster, below is not worth... only summoner can deal AoE damage efficiently, since it spreads him dot.
finally, don't forget you are in a team, sometimes you will need to think as a team more than a DD, if you do AoE, means the healer will need to use more mana for keep the tank up, means the tank may need to use CD or make it jobs a pain like chain flash/overpower burning either them mana or tp for kill the pack without loose the hate.

a good DD do damage without take hate and without die ^^

but that another subject ^^