What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

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Originally Posted by SieyaM

Maybe it's just me but I also feel like the prove yourself by combat trope is way overused in FFXIV. It seems like they want to set up a scenario for these battles to take place but can't think of anything good or fitting for the narrative so it's just a standard "prove yourself worthy" line.

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Completely agree. I brought up awhile back that Hydaelyn really had no reason to fight us to the death, she just does. Even if we had lost, what exactly would that prove? To some degree this can also apply to Zodiark as well, as Fandaniel only needed Zodiark dead, so why bother trying to kill us?

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Originally Posted by Skyborne

If we're talking about cringe, I hope we get fun cringe in the future and not just whatever EW was. Nomura/Ishikawa collab without any meddling when?

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I love how sincere every word that comes out of that man's mouth is lol. It's cringe, but I just can't bring myself to hate him.

Also, didn't he have a hand in the development of the Eden raids?

I have to say, I really enjoyed Endwalker. I assumed the worst at first, thinking that it was a very bad idea to wrap everything up in the base story and not flesh things out in the post quests. However, I was delightfully surprised by how well everything came together. Sure, it was not as good as Shadowbringers (My fav FF story I think) and I rolled my eyes at such things like “Oh look, one by one the Scions are sacrificing themselves for me in grand fashion. No way this is gonna be reset by a item I got earlier in the plot…” and it felt more… safe, in reflection of how Shadowbringers twisted a lot of the tropes we had come to know. But I really liked what twists we had regarding Amon, seeing Elpis and the Ancients in the flesh like that. I for one did a total 360 in regards to Hydaelyn/Venat. I was sure they would end up being the ultimate foe of the game, but she kinda turned into one of my favourite characters.

Anywho, I did think praise was mostly universal, so its been very interesting seeing peoples complaints and debate on the expansion and its themes. Opening my eyes to a few things I had not considered. I really wanna play the story again, perhaps from start to finish. It would be great to know more about the thought and writing proses that went into each expansion, what was layed out from the start and what was made up for each instalment (I kinda expect its the latter for most)

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Originally Posted by SieyaM

Maybe it's just me but I also feel like the prove yourself by combat trope is way overused in FFXIV. It seems like they want to set up a scenario for these battles to take place but can't think of anything good or fitting for the narrative so it's just a standard "prove yourself worthy" line.

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I do think you are right here. Many of the fights in the MSQ do feel like they are there just to inject some gameplay into the moment.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

I for one did a total 360 in regards to Hydaelyn/Venat. I was sure they would end up being the ultimate foe of the game, but she kinda turned into one of my favourite characters.

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it's funny how that happens, my experience was the complete polar opposite of yours :P. I went in not caring either way about Hydaelyn but not actually believing that she was a villain and came out feeling that she very much was an antagonist and she's now my least liked character in the entire game thus far.

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Originally Posted by Skyborne

Nomura/Ishikawa collab without any meddling when?
https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...770&height=400

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Oh lord, I'm Nomura. :P I still want to know what his original vision was for FFXV. I didn't end up liking any of the protagonists except for Ignis (Lunafreya is one of the worst female characters I've had the misfortune to come across) and Ardyn is close to tied to being my all time favorite antagonist next to Emet.

Left to my own devices, I'm a mercenary/anti-hero. I don't relate to 'goody-two-shoes' types and I'm a Fordola-level realist. If I had any choice in the matter Esteem would've taken over as the WoL and it would've been awesome. I only side with the villains if they're compelling.

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Originally Posted by PawPaw

I went in not caring either way about Hydaelyn but not actually believing that she was a villain and came out feeling that she very much was an antagonist and she's now my least liked character in the entire game thus far.

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I went in expecting nuance. I figured she'd be handled similarly to Emet. I did not expect her to evil. Instead, her actions were far worse than I anticipated (the sundering being intentional and with knowledge of the future) with gaslighting the likes I've never seen to try to convince me she wasn't a 'bad guy'. Someone on Reddit said she would've made an amazing villain if the writers/devs had the stones to depict her as such and I'd have to agree.

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Originally Posted by Rulakir

Oh lord, I'm Nomura. :P I still want to know what his original vision was for FFXV. I didn't end up liking any of the protagonists except for Ignis (Lunafreya is one of the worst female characters I've had the misfortune to come across)

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I'm actually impressed at how every single major female character in that game managed to out-waifu her. Even a character from a completely unrelated mobile game outshined her ass and had a far more compelling relationship with Noctis (Also more screen time somehow).

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Originally Posted by PawPaw

it's funny how that happens, my experience was the complete polar opposite of yours :P. I went in not caring either way about Hydaelyn but not actually believing that she was a villain and came out feeling that she very much was an antagonist and she's now my least liked character in the entire game thus far.

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Same... But seeing as she can use Armiger, all will be forgiven once they add Kingsglaive as a job. Make it happen SQUARE!!!

A lot of you said what I thought and felt myself, so I won't go into much detail. Played straight from ARR to the current patch after my friend talked me into playing a few months ago, and I enjoyed the story throughout the patches, Heavensward and Shadowbringers being my favorites. But then Endwalker happened. The narrative took a complete shift from Shadowbringer with light and dark neither bad nor good, being able to sympathize with the Ancients and given dialogue choices to show it or telling them to fuck off. Yet in Endwalker it was just a complete sucking off of Hydaelyn and how she did no wrong but everything right. Nobody questioned her, not even your character. Only dialogue options you had were to agree or agree harder, besides the shade on the moon.
All they had to do was have the narrative stay gray and not blatantly suck her off yet they didn't and that ruined the game for me. I havn't been this mad at a game since Tales of Graces F. I gave 6.1 a chance to see if they would change the narrative, instead they double downed and sucked off Hydaelyn even harder in the codex. They even had Y'shtola summon 2 familiars as guinea pigs to enter the void, but no worries she's a Scion and a good guy! Unlike the evil Ancients who created familiars to see if they would help the planet and environment, her using them as test subjects and subjecting one to pain was totally A OK!!.
I decided to let my sub end in a few days, which is a shame because I enjoyed this game from when I first started and found the gameplay fun. I'll still keep up with later patches and see if they do anything to change the narrative, but I'm not holding my breathe. I only lurked and never posted, but decided I should make a post to show that the "silent minority" is bigger than people seem to realize. Hope you all still enjoy playing and enjoy your time with the game.

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Originally Posted by Krithas

They even had Y'shtola summon 2 familiars as guinea pigs to enter the void, but no worries she's a Scion and a good guy! Unlike the evil Ancients who created familiars to see if they would help the planet and environment, her using them as test subjects and subjecting one to pain was totally A OK!!

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Yeah I've noticed things like that more and more the "rules for thee but not for me." I definitely raised an eyebrow during the reaper quests too. And now the thought of traveling to different shards to "liberate" or bring our own version of morality to any already established civilizations there just feels kind of nauseating to me. I never wanted to be part of a group that obviously knows what's best for the entire world and has taken upon itself the "duty" to offer its "help" to other unsuspecting civilizations lol. It's just so cringe to me, especially as someone who tends to like a more chaotic neutral or anti hero character. If someone is not right in front of me attempting to hurt me, I have no reason to go out of my way to fix anything, nor do I have a reason to blindly follow orders from someone I just met, yet I've been doing it since ARR.

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Originally Posted by Krithas

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Thanks for chiming in, it's ruined the game for me also so I can relate 100%. I found myself more often than not rolling my eyes and muttering things like "SHOCKER" AND "YOU DON'T SAY!" throughout the entirety of 6.1. I'm pretty over it and hadn't fully realized it until then, but now I have. It's both baffling and sad because I've been in love with this story since 2013 and all it took was one EP to undo that completely. I'm in the process of decorating my FC's new house (we got lucky) and when that's finished I'll probably unsub as well.

Yeah, we all had a good laugh at Y'shtola's abuse of familiars being totally acceptable because Scion but when the Ancients do things with familiars they are evil and "scary".

Endwalker certainly killed a lot of my enthusiasm for the game. I'd have removed my subscription as well if not for being lucky enough to own a mansion. I did remove all my bonus retainers and I didn't bother buying any of the new merchandise. Usually I get anything with a bonus code but I just don't care about the game enough anymore to spend anything but the absolute bare minimum.

It simply isn't the same game that I fell in love with. I do have some vague hope that maybe things will course correct but 6.1 simply doubled down on a lot of the things that irritated me about Endwalker.

I'm not even convinced that it's being written to appeal to those of us who invested in the ongoing story so much as those who just care about the Scions first and foremost.

While I do like the direction the story has been going in so far, I really hope they don't decide to have us go galivanting off to another shard in 7.0 for the sake of "subverting expectations" when they've spent years gradually fleshing out the remaining continents we've yet to visit back on the Source.