Wow, Wuk Lamat is really single-handedly ruining the DT story...

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Originally Posted by Xendros

I've been around aviation my entire life so I can empathize with people who are scared to fly. I deal with them constantly. Unfortunately, my real world experience clouded my judgement during that cutscene. I hated myself after the fact because I fell into the writer's trap and agreed to hold her hand.

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Oh I can see how that scene could work from that perspective. You're very kind!
It's not an experience I had first hand, so my main focus was "I don't even know you. The WoL barely has any physical touch with my close friends Scions, and yet I'm supposed to feel bad for you and hold YOUR hand?"
And also...Erenville was right there. When you refuse and say "go ask Erenville" she is all "noo but he wouldn't understand!!!"...but aren't they supposed to be childhood friends? As much as Erenville acts like he doesn't care in the surface, we are only here BECAUSE he cares - it was him that introduced us to her, because he wanted to help her. Erenville doesn't even hear that anyway, so the scene ends there. Now that I'm thinking about it, I actually think the scene could've been a cute character moment if he was there, and then offered his hand to her!
Also at this point I was just over her being scared and sick everytime we had to take any kind of transportation.

I'm curious though, if you say yes, do you actually hold her hand in the cutscene?

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Originally Posted by chizLemons

I was actually VERY uncomfortable a little before that when she asked her to hold her hand because she was scared...uh, what? Excuse me? No, go away. I don't even know you. You barely ever asked about me as a person anyway, and I'm supposed to believe we're that close?! For how much time we were forced to spend with her, I don't feel like we got close AT ALL.
And then she also asks you to treat her like family? No, I refuse.

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Yeah for me that and the whole stay with her and family (with the scions at least there was development and Haurchefaunt went out of his way to beg his father to take us in) was also kind of too personal to quickly.
I don‘t mind the whole being close friends to family trope but there was no natural progress I felt. It seemed more forced as a kind of „look isn‘t she great? You are totally besties now forever and ever“.
I know I‘m not the norm and most people probably didn‘t mind but… maybe it would have been better to do that stuff at the end of the expansion or after the patches.

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Originally Posted by chizLemons

Oh I can see how that scene could work from that perspective. You're very kind!
It's not an experience I had first hand, so my main focus was "I don't even know you. The WoL barely has any physical touch with my close friends Scions, and yet I'm supposed to feel bad for you and hold YOUR hand?"
And also...Erenville was right there. When you refuse and say "go ask Erenville" she is all "noo but he wouldn't understand!!!"...but aren't they supposed to be childhood friends? As much as Erenville acts like he doesn't care in the surface, we are only here BECAUSE he cares - it was him that introduced us to her, because he wanted to help her. Erenville doesn't even hear that anyway, so the scene ends there. Now that I'm thinking about it, I actually think the scene could've been a cute character moment if he was there, and then offered his hand to her!
Also at this point I was just over her being scared and sick everytime we had to take any kind of transportation.

I'm curious though, if you say yes, do you actually hold her hand in the cutscene?

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Nah, it just fades to black like normal.

Wuk Lamat as a character is a bit averagely written... Like a Lyse 2.0... Didn't hate or love the character, just a bit underwhelming. Same goes for the VA, she did a decent enough job, a bit lacking during heightened emotion scenes but still a bit endearing during regular scenes. 5/10 MSQ middle of the road, let's see where it goes... 3.6 Roentgen, not great, not terrible.

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Originally Posted by RabendaShin

https://i.redd.it/72y47uv09w3d1.jpeg

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Basically Dawntrail

XIV has never had one NPC dominate screentime like this before and they decided the first one to do it should be Wuk Lamat? What were they thinking? Even if she had amazing writing and development it would have been too much.

The thing that makes me mad about Wuk Lamat is that she would have been a good character if she wasn't so overplayed. She's nice, wants to help everybody, not very different from your character in general. But the writting was so bad and so repetitive that it makes you get fed up with her.


She talks about feelings all the time. She sounds like she's always trying to discuss relationship. She wants to be friends with everybody even when she shouldn't. It makes her stand out as a big Mary Sue that's always right and always demanding attention just to show how understanding she is. It's incredibly annoying.



She should have more flaws and grow more as a character as the quest progress. She should hate more, even if it's to change her opinion later. She should play more on the dumb warrior stereotype that's good intentioned but then actually has to confront the plight of the people and grow up to be a ruler. But it's like someone was too afraid of making her suck, afraid that people wouldn't like her otherwise. How ironic.


Also, the voice over is horrendous. Not just Wuk Lamat's, but she has more than twice voice lines than everyone else so it's pretty obvious on her. It's very, very, very, very hard to just sit there and listen her mumble, especially when she's meant to be screaming or shouting. I may permanently switch to japanese voices just so I can get some energy in the voice delivery. Which is sad, the voice actors are competent. With some better voice direction, I don't think people would hate the expansion so much.



I feel really depressed knowing that they will never fix this. They will never rewrite the character and replace the voiceovers for the characters in this expansion. It's bad forever. Gameplay is nice, music is great, but it's a Final Fantasy so bad story really kills the mood.

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Originally Posted by Alenonimo

She should have more flaws and grow more as a character as the quest progress. She should hate more, even if it's to change her opinion later. She should play more on the dumb warrior stereotype that's good intentioned but then actually has to confront the plight of the people and grow up to be a ruler. But it's like someone was too afraid of making her suck, afraid that people wouldn't like her otherwise. How ironic.

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I would have preferred her as more of a wild child, who gets out often. She is well meaning, but also ignorant to other people's ways, but it's part of her journey. She shouldn't act completely surprised each time she sees something new, like it's her first time. I really didn't like the approach of the sheltered Warrior princess.

She should have also been a more capable warrior, so her sudden powers ups don't come out of knowhere. But she should have been more of an offensive fighter who really doesn't think things through, while Zoraal Ja is the more tactical mind. And eventually she learns to fight smarter, not harder. Like Zoraal Ja, when he ended the fight againt Bakool Ja Ja with a kidney shot. Now if they had shown in a cutscene how she eventually disarms him and goes after his weak points, then I could accept the win against Bakool Ja Ja. But she essentially just powers through, has enough energy to take on his goons and after everything is done, doesn't show a single sign of exhaustion.

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Originally Posted by Aurumis

They did dirty Arenvald, so why not do Wuk Lamat dirty? I would love for them to kill her off screen.
Arenvald was one of the best NPCs poor guy.

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Man, I would laugh if they did a JJK 236 to Wuk Lamat and

7.1 MSQ starts with Wuk Lamat's funeral or something, and it's revealed that Wuk actually died in a single hit while trying to fight Sphene and the very last bits of the trial and MSQ was just a fever dream before she died

We just cut back to the trial and our character is looking at Wuk Lamat dumbfounded at what just happened

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Originally Posted by KurenXIV

You're drawing a false parallel. Reviewers and gamers alike who played Wind Waker lauded the game. It had incredibly high review scores and those who played it generally said favorably things about the game.

Sure, those who were turned off by the art style didn't want to even play the game so they could call it whatever they want (trash or otherwise); and yes over time people who may have skipped the original launch have gone back and enjoyed the game for what it is; but that's not what is happening here.

You don't have people saying "Yuck! Look at these elements of Dawntrail! I don't want to play it!", you have people who bought the game, played through it and did not care for it.

It's not as though years from now the people who didn't enjoy it will look back and say "boy I sure was wrong about DT, it had a really great story line at launch".

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Wasn’t drawing a direct parallel. Was just giving an anecdote on why I don’t put a lot of stock into early reactions. I also wasn’t talking about review scores as people didnt really care about those back then since they were mainly in magazines. Tired of people misconstruing what I said for upvotes

Just finished the last trial. The moment Wuk Lamat appeared I was fuming.

Wuk single handedly destroyed the intensity of the final battle with her awful monotone voice acting. Please recast her or better yet just have her never appear again.

Wuk Lamat XIV
......Online.......

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Originally Posted by Aurumis

They did dirty Arenvald, so why not do Wuk Lamat dirty? I would love for them to kill her off screen.
Arenvald was one of the best NPCs poor guy.

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Before the DT announcement when we were all still under the impression that the scions were going to take a back seat for a bit while other npcs got a shot in the spotlight, I was hoping beyond hope that Arenvald was going to be one of the new major npcs of the game. I was hoping he would fill a Tataru role and we would have a ton of interactions with him. Have him regain some use of his legs and have him pick up spellcasting so he could still have a place in battle when the story called for it. Anything would have been good. But instead we got another annoying cat.

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Originally Posted by mihai899

Just finished the last trial. The moment Wuk Lamat appeared I was fuming.

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Yeah, I just finished last night and that was absolutely infuriating. I don't dislike the character, mostly thought there needed to be 30% less of her...but at that moment, I would have been happy if I never saw her again for the life of the game and now I do not wish to do that trial ever again, despite the fact that I was enjoying it so much until she showed up.

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Originally Posted by Dogempire

Man, I would laugh if they did a JJK 236 to Wuk Lamat and

7.1 MSQ starts with Wuk Lamat's funeral or something, and it's revealed that Wuk actually died in a single hit while trying to fight Sphene and the very last bits of the trial and MSQ was just a fever dream before she died

We just cut back to the trial and our character is looking at Wuk Lamat dumbfounded at what just happened

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I had the idea of everything was just a fever dream and we were still fighting Meteion at the edge of the universe. 6.1-7.0 simply never happened and the story reveals us to have woken up from the brink of death to pursue Meteion.

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Originally Posted by mihai899

Just finished the last trial. The moment Wuk Lamat appeared I was fuming.

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That's how I felt when Zenos appeared in the last fight, I hated him. I guess they copied the moment but with a different character, hah! Rehash.

On that note, I don't think Wuk Lamat ruined the story, the WRITERS did.

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Originally Posted by Hallarem

That's how I felt when Zenos appeared in the last fight, I hated him. I guess they copied the moment but with a different character, hah! Rehash.

On that note, I don't think Wuk Lamat ruined the story, the WRITERS did.

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I didn’t even hate the fact that Zenos appeared (I got used to it, after 3 expansions, whatever), but the fact that he even offered me to ignore him and leave, which i would rather have done, while the game forced me to stay instead and have that ‘climax’ over the one which was actually story relevant - really angered me and tainted my whole satisfaction over the ending.
These fake choices which are there with “yes” and “yes!” have been present since ShB actually. Probably I should not be too surprised with how everything just doubled down on it in DT.

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Originally Posted by Aurumis

They did dirty Arenvald, so why not do Wuk Lamat dirty? I would love for them to kill her off screen.
Arenvald was one of the best NPCs poor guy.

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What did they do to Arenvald? as far as I know he's still alive.

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Originally Posted by Kathryn

MSQ genuinely start off fine I wasnt too fussed but im tired of her now and I want my alone time with Graha who has had no screen time *angry auri noises*

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I feel you. I watched the backs of Alisae and G'raha run off into the Wuk Lamat-less distance and something inside of me died a little.

Another sacrifice was G'raha!Jonathan Bailey. The only reason I play FFXIV in Eng dub, when I am always opting for Japanese dub anywhere else, is because of the voice acting in Shadowbringers. And by that, I mean G'raha and Emet-Selch's voice actors. Actual legends. I am now just a number of the crowd that bailed for the Japanese dub after losing patience with most things in this expansion in English.

Thanks Wuk Lamat, for bringing nothing with your expansion and taking away instead.

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Originally Posted by AnimaAnimus

Before the DT announcement when we were all still under the impression that the scions were going to take a back seat for a bit while other npcs got a shot in the spotlight, I was hoping beyond hope that Arenvald was going to be one of the new major npcs of the game. I was hoping he would fill a Tataru role and we would have a ton of interactions with him. Have him regain some use of his legs and have him pick up spellcasting so he could still have a place in battle when the story called for it. Anything would have been good. But instead we got another annoying cat.

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Arenvald (Warroir of Darkness) is not from Eorzea and long dead in his world. Arenvald was the counterpart of the playercharacter in his world. In Eorzea we are "Arenvald", that why we see him in all the Addon-Intros. Arenvald is how the default Warrior of light in FF14 looks like.

In other words you where hoping for adventures with yourself^^

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Originally Posted by Ath192

What did they do to Arenvald? as far as I know he's still alive.

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Arenvald the warrior of darkness is long dead. "Arenvald" the Warrior of light in eozea is still alife in person of the playercharacter. "Arenvald" is the default Hero in FF14.

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Originally Posted by Silberzerox

Arenvald (Warroir of Darkness) is not from Eorzea and long dead in his world. Arenvald was the counterpart of the playercharacter in his world. In Eorzea we are "Arenvald", that why we see him in all the Addon-Intros. Arenvald is how the default Warrior of light in FF14 looks like.

In other words you where hoping for adventures with yourself^^

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You're thinking of Ardbert, not Arenvald. Arenvald is a male Highlander that's been around since ARR.

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Originally Posted by Silberzerox

Arenvald (Warroir of Darkness) is not from Eorzea and long dead in his world. Arenvald was the counterpart of the playercharacter in his world. In Eorzea we are "Arenvald", that why we see him in all the Addon-Intros. Arenvald is how the default Warrior of light in FF14 looks like.

In other words you where hoping for adventures with yourself^^

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I believe you are thinking of Ardbert. Arenvald was a Scion and was the one travelling with Fordola and was crippled while protecting her.

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Originally Posted by Mecia

Ahh, quality time with Erenville now that the succession is over. Im actually smiling and excited.

Surely nothing will go wrong.

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I love Erenville. He's a fun, different personality to be around and I adore his English voice actor. I was giddy when Erenville asked to go on further adventures with us.

And then immediately Wuk Lamat said "ME TOO!!" and I lost hope.

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Originally Posted by mouse_marple

XIV has never had one NPC dominate screentime like this before and they decided the first one to do it should be Wuk Lamat? What were they thinking? Even if she had amazing writing and development it would have been too much.

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Even if Emet selch himself had that much screentime, it would get droning.
No character, no matter how charismatic or interesting can be on screen that long without becomig annoying

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Originally Posted by Tsumdere

I love Erenville. He's a fun, different personality to be around and I adore his English voice actor. I was giddy when Erenville asked to go on further adventures with us.

And then immediately Wuk Lamat said "ME TOO!!" and I lost hope.

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Also don't forget the whole thing with the bracelet... even if you're NOT around Llama Tea, the game sure as hell loves beating you over the head to keep reminding you of her existence.

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Originally Posted by AlucaDragonheart

Also don't forget the whole thing with the bracelet... even if you're NOT around Llama Tea, the game sure as hell loves beating you over the head to keep reminding you of her existence.

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It felt so jarring. FINALLY you get to go into a new zone, without Wuk Lamat. Not even 5 minutes later attention is dragged back to the Third Promise. Then they have the gall to use that wetnurse character again to drive home the plot in BOTH Heritage Found and Living Memory, completely undermining any development for other characters such as Spene, Erenville, or gods forbid - Krile. They get margin notes compared to the ten part encyclopedia devoted to Wuk Lamat.

Well, while i still have posting privelegies.
Wuk Lamat did single handedly ruin DT experience for me to the point i quit expansion midway.
I won't list all the issues with it, since all of that was covered in this thread by multiple people multiple times. She is a textbook Mary Sue, and i have no idea how this was approved, but here we are.
What actually completely killed all the engagement i had with the story is when out of nowhere Wuk Lamat just easily soloed not only Bakool Ja Ja but also ~30 of his henchmen, while my WoL just stood there. And then Wuk wasn't even out of breath after the fact. While she was easily overpowered by him not too long ago. But hey, power of freindship and all that.
After reading what happens afterwards, and that there's even more focus on Wuk in the second half of the story i am glad that i quit when i did.
Hope you all are having fun.

I’ve been thinking about this a bit. It’s clear that the promises are intended to embody some aspect of galool jaja. First and most obvious there’s the head of reason, koala is the only candidate here. This aspect seems to be the lynchpin of the throne, capable of stratagems for both times of peace and war. Second is the head of resolve, embodying the combat prowess and might - again this can only have parallels drawn to zorool ja. This aspect however seems to be more vestigial during the time of the story, shining brightest when presented with a threat such as valiangalamana and with GJJ primarily carrying out the orders of reason and resorting to diplomantic sparring matches for entertainment. There is mention that the sheer might of GJJ is what facilitated the formation of the nation alongside his other aspects - binding valigama foremost but I seem to recall that he beat up the mamool and furries at the same time too. Finally - and as proven to exist by zorool ja - there is the head of love, which corresponds nicely with wuk lamat. This is another fundamental aspect of GJJ’s empire, however the desire for peace is enforced by the other two while being motivation in of itself. The stick and the carrot if you like.

This being said, it is unfortunate that WL took the title of “Head of Resolve” rather than the more fitting “Head of Richard”, I think acknowledging her strengths and forging a path suited to her skill set rather than emulating an aspect she’s clearly unfit for.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

Even if Emet selch himself had that much screentime, it would get droning.
No character, no matter how charismatic or interesting can be on screen that long without becomig annoying

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somehow this remind me of Ardbert when he told us he didn't tailing WoL all the time because he respect our 'privacy'
stark contrast in character indeed

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Originally Posted by Bellybell

somehow this remind me of Ardbert when he told us he didn't tailing WoL all the time because he respect our 'privacy'
stark contrast in character indeed

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Ardbert was so good.

But Ardbert was us, so he understood the need for privacy. I'm now imagining a ghostly shard-self of Wuk Lamat's constantly hovering around her and never giving her a moment of peace. Karmic justice.

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Originally Posted by PaleYonder

Ardbert was so good.

But Ardbert was us, so he understood the need for privacy. I'm now imagining a ghostly shard-self of Wuk Lamat's constantly hovering around her and never giving her a moment of peace. Karmic justice.
This now

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I wonder how many murder fantasies Frey has right now regarding Wuk Lamat.

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Originally Posted by PaleYonder

I'm now imagining a ghostly shard-self of Wuk Lamat's constantly hovering around her and never giving her a moment of peace. Karmic justice. This now

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And constantly asking for validation... Maybe BeneG. will do someting along those lines ;)

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Originally Posted by Voidmage

I wonder how many murder fantasies Frey has right now regarding Wuk Lamat.

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Probably the same as the player. It truly boggles my mind how Yoshi P thought we'd actually like this dumpster fire of a character. People, myself included, kept comparing her to Lyse, but I realized something. Even Lyse had the courtesy to stay out of our boss fight with Shinryu. Wok Lmao had to go out of her way to remind us, yet again, that she is a Mary Sue and the Main Character.

So done with this ass cancer of an expansion. If I had been playing on my own, and hadn't committed to running Savage this tier with a group of friends, this would be the last I played of Final Fanfiction XIV. But I don't want to let them down.

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Originally Posted by AlucaDragonheart

Llama Tea

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I like that, I'm stealing that. LOL

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Originally Posted by PaleYonder

Ardbert was so good.

But Ardbert was us, so he understood the need for privacy. I'm now imagining a ghostly shard-self of Wuk Lamat's constantly hovering around her and never giving her a moment of peace. Karmic justice.

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Another thing about Ardbert was he was actually suffering too. Pretty much every scene he was in I was like holy fuck give this guy a break, despite how much he suffers and how much he has given up he still is decent to us even though we were enemies once.
Perfect expansion character leaving us wanting more instead of less.

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Originally Posted by Isala

It truly boggles my mind how Yoshi P thought we'd actually like this dumpster fire of a character.

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Copium makes me want to believe that this has to be on purpose. Maybe Yoshi and his team went out of their way to make this character intentionally bad for some future 4D chess reason. Hell, in the 6.5 during her introduce quest the collogibi even told WuK to "shut up, you're annoying!", maybe that's a easter egg of the character. They have to be aware. Otherwise it really boggle the mind how they can create a character this bad.

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Originally Posted by Ramiee

Another thing about Ardbert was he was actually suffering too. Pretty much every scene he was in I was like holy fuck give this guy a break, despite how much he suffers and how much he has given up he still is decent to us even though we were enemies once.
Perfect expansion character leaving us wanting more instead of less.

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Not to mention his last scene with us right before we delivery the last blow to Emer Sech, I actually welled up a bit. Comparing that to Wuk's last scene with us and it's like ... yeah, I don't know which emotion I had, but whatever it is I'm 100% sure it's not a good one. It's amazing they set up the same stage and follow the same script (we can also add Zeno and EndWalker scene to it too). But instead third time is the charm, it's third time is the ****.

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Originally Posted by AlucaDragonheart

Also don't forget the whole thing with the bracelet... even if you're NOT around Llama Tea, the game sure as hell loves beating you over the head to keep reminding you of her existence.

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Man as soon as I got to that part of the story I was so excited. Wow Wuk actually leaving us alone !! We can finally breathe!! And spend some time bonding with Erenville aswell!! Yeah!!!
Glammed on my cowboy hat and set forth for a good old fashioned adventure. And then BOOM literally 2nd quest in and its already about Wuk again. I wanted to uninstall.