History repeats itself: Time for the Great Archer Nerf of 2011

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

Another archer!
"the most balanced job in the game"...aka the overpowered one that I chose to play because it's overpowered.

Lots of rangers said this right before they got their nerfs. Square Enix may not want to nerf you all, but they will be nerfing you all regardless because they have to.

Add archer to yet another mistake that this team clearly did not learn from FFXI. Well, no matter. You will see, and they will sit in the disaster they allowed if they don't fix it now. It's only going to get worse. It's already bad enough.

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They won't be nerfing us because there is no need to, arc is hardly overpowered, if you actually PLAYED the job at all for any determinate amount of time, you would know that. And seriously, "Another archer"? Are you going to resort to the fallacy of assassinating my character just to prove your point? You've already lost the argument and you don't even realize it.

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Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

I've said it earlier in this thread and I'll say it again. ARC has to buy arrows and that HAS to count for something, rather certain people want to admit it or not. Unless you've spent millions of gil on arrows like I have, YOU JUST DON'T KNOW. Sure, I can buy the 2 gil each warped arrows and then my DPS would drop closer to the other DD's (Arrows also affect acc and crit. hit rate). But I don't. I use the arrows that are optimal for my rank when there is a party or NM hunt run going on so that I can further help that party/linkshell/etc.

And to those that want to say "But ARC can attack from a far, safe distance", they are also the weakest to attacks out of all of the other DD's and with that you also have to consider the very high Enmity that an ARC's abilties/attacks create.

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the reward for you buying arrows is that you can do damage without taking damage, what was the reward for ninjas buying elemental magic tools? debuffing the mob and doing damage from a distance. Your best arrows shouldnt put you above other DD, they should keep you close to other DD, it really is a fact that if you manage your hate you can attack with no risk, that is simply not an option for other DD, almost every mob in the game has close range aoes, most of multiple types.

A charachter who attacks by throwing money at the mob should not be the most hax job in the game, all your saying is that you should be able to buy your way to being the best DD in this game.

Every DD can attack from range for money too, it just costs more, does less damage, and we cant use any attack based tp skills with it. Basically archer gets way more bang for thier buck with ranged attacks. Look at it as savings.

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Originally Posted by Physic

the reward for you buying arrows is that you can do damage without taking damage, what was the reward for ninjas buying elemental magic tools? debuffing the mob and doing damage from a distance. Your best arrows shouldnt put you above other DD, they should keep you close to other DD, it really is a fact that if you manage your hate you can attack with no risk, that is simply not an option for other DD, almost every mob in the game has close range aoes, most of multiple types.

A charachter who attacks by throwing money at the mob should not be the most hax job in the game, all your saying is that you should be able to buy your way to being the best DD in this game.

Every DD can attack from range for money too, it just costs more, does less damage, and we cant use any attack based tp skills with it. Basically archer gets way more bang for thier buck with ranged attacks. Look at it as savings.

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1.) Many of those mobs with those aoe tp moves you mentioned are cone shaped. Meaning, the melee DD can avoid them also. I don't see the Melee DD having to pay gil for each swing/attack they do against those kinds of mobs!

2.) Like I mentioned in the second paragraph you quoted of mine, there is a counter to the high DPS of ARC. They kill faster, but they also die faster.

3.) ARC getting a bang for their buck is by higher DPS.

t

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Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

1.) Many of those mobs with those aoe tp moves you mentioned are cone shaped. Meaning, the melee DD can avoid them also. I don't see the Melee DD having to pay gil for each swing/attack they do against those kinds of mobs!

2.) Like I mentioned in the second paragraph you quoted of mine, there is a counter to the high DPS of ARC. They kill faster, but they also die faster.

3.) ARC getting a bang for their buck is by higher DPS.

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they die faster is irrelevant with a tank, in fact, with a tank, and hate management, they are the last to die.

You pay so that you are the last to die

Even mobs with conal aoe, also have circlular aoe, most of the mobs have this, some even have special traits, like raptors where if you dont stand in front and take thier conal aoe, you can get hit by the tail in a huge aoe. all this while the archer laughs it up in the background like HAHA i killed you all.

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Originally Posted by Physic

Even mobs with conal aoe, also have circlular aoe, most of the mobs have this, some even have special traits, like raptors where if you dont stand in front and take thier conal aoe, you can get hit by the tail in a huge aoe. all this while the archer laughs it up in the background like HAHA i killed you all.

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Or you can stand to the side of the raptor, and dodge both Fire and Tail.

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Originally Posted by Physic

they die faster is irrelevant with a tank, in fact, with a tank, and hate management, they are the last to die.

You pay so that you are the last to die

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Not True.
And since we're back to tank parties....if the tank dies, who do you think the mob is going to go after first? The ARC with its very high enmity generation and weakness toward attacks or one of the melee DD's who can actually hold their own against the mob?

Answer: ARC


Please see Ayerc's comment about the raptor's aoe's. So I say again....

1.) Many of those mobs with those aoe tp moves you mentioned are cone shaped. Meaning, the melee DD can avoid them also. I don't see the Melee DD having to pay gil for each swing/attack they do against those kinds of mobs!

BTW, there are mobs that only have cone aoe tp moves.

This thread is still going woah. Chill out people Tana...yoshida is already on top of this ARC/THM nerf already coming he just hasn't had the time to post his thoughts yet :D

What I think several people fail to realize is that Archers in any context of any game are designed TO SUPPORT THEIR GROUP BY SUPPLYING LARGE AMOUNTS OF DAMAGE. Tank or none, an archer's means of survival is to dish out as much damage as they possibly can, or run to safety. While all martial classes are capable of some form of what we call "tanking". If the Archer puts out more damage than your PUG or LNC, chances are that it's doing it's job right. Marauders are a different case because of their overly-underwhelming accuracy. The object of party play is to cover one another's weak points, and the DoW jobs cover the Archer's... So what's so wrong about that? I could see Archers becoming over-powered in the future, if they don't slow down a few hairs, but as it is, they are doing their job.

I'm pretty sure no one read my post and just went on arguing blindly.

its pretty much pointless, Ranged Melees are always broken because of the damage calculation between closed melee and ranged are different, and now we have players are determined that archers should be best DD in game because they got the taste and now they don't want anything to change.

All i can say is from experience, is that a job that is given priority in lots of situation over others jobs, a job that does the impossible(there should always be challenge, but not like how it is), a job that is level'd by a large player base over other jobs will always be adjusted somehow in the future, whether you like it or not.