Get rid of SAM Limit break gimmick already (FL)

Well, may as well revive this thread since Patch 6.4 has seen the buffing of SAM LB, and the nerfing of NIN LB and nerfing of MCH Chainsaw.

And yes, in FL SAM LB received the same nerf as NIN LB.

What bothers me the most about these kinds of conversations is that it misses the raw Maths of these abilities. None of these abilities are absolute one-shot attacks, they all do dmg based on the state of the target. Let's put the raw numbers onto paper:

SAM LB (Zan): 24k AoE pierces guard or up to 63k if target attacked you in last 3 seconds

NIN LB (Seiton): 10k or up to 31.499k and pierces guard if target below 50%

MCH Chainsaw (Not a LB, part of rotation): 12k or up to 59.850k 3% of the time

Which of these attacks does the most dmg? Which attack hits multiple targets? Which attack ignores guard?

Well, regardless of the communities opinions, SE has kind of made it clear they think Zan is an important part of the SAM class and that NIN is just too powerful. And also any other class having a near one shot attack, even at 3%, is just too powerful.

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Originally Posted by DesdemonaVae

Well, may as well revive this thread since Patch 6.4 has seen the buffing of SAM LB, and the nerfing of NIN LB and nerfing of MCH Chainsaw.

And yes, in FL SAM LB received the same nerf as NIN LB.

What bothers me the most about these kinds of conversations is that it misses the raw Maths of these abilities. None of these abilities are absolute one-shot attacks, they all do dmg based on the state of the target. Let's put the raw numbers onto paper:

SAM LB (Zan): 24k AoE pierces guard or up to 63k if target attacked you in last 3 seconds

NIN LB (Seiton): 10k or up to 31.499k and pierces guard if target below 50%

MCH Chainsaw (Not a LB, part of rotation): 12k or up to 59.850k 3% of the time

Which of these attacks does the most dmg? Which attack hits multiple targets? Which attack ignores guard?

Well, regardless of the communities opinions, SE has kind of made it clear they think Zan is an important part of the SAM class and that NIN is just too powerful. And also any other class having a near one shot attack, even at 3%, is just too powerful.

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of course but i dont see samurai live to use their lb often.

What typically happens is Sam uses its LB, gets yoinked by warrior and dies. Or people see them pop the LB, and they get focused down and die. Or... The samurai LB's someone who is out of line, out fighting in the middle of nowhere, where the person dying to the LB probably benefitted being given the oppurtunity to consider playing with the rest of their team. I consider DRK/SMN/WHM/DRG/SCH to be more of a threat.

Its been 3 years, nothing had change. Id say this, it is not that I cannot counter sam's lb in fl, or that sam'lb is ez to pull off. It is not and It comes with risk.
However : its not FUN to play against it. Sam lb mechanic is anit-fun. I want to lost in the flow of combat without having to pay attention to that one thing that will oneshot me if I keep attacking.
I think the exist of sam lb made fl 50% less fun, because everytime I see a sam, I have to change my mindset. Its like the rules of the game had changed the moment I saw a Sam. It is just not fun to play against a sam.
Tbf I still think that fl is just meme game mod, its not fun and that is fine.

So… are you not ignoring the HG paladins or Living dead dark knights or the viper in snake scales or the gnb with nebula and rampart.

Like, Sam LB should be functionally useless to those paying attention

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

So… are you not ignoring the HG paladins or Living dead dark knights or the viper in snake scales or the gnb with nebula and rampart.

Like, Sam LB should be functionally useless to those paying attention

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to be fair, there is nothing so infuriating as using an AOE in a crowd of 5+ and hitting the SAM on the fringe, at the back, and getting one-shotted. like... WTF I WASN'T EVEN LOOKING AT YOU, RANDOM SAM!

I can aoe them or hit them by accident, doing so will waste my damage output, that is a fair punishment.
You know what I mean, Sam lb is not one of those

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Originally Posted by NevaehQuest

Its been 3 years, nothing had change. Id say this, it is not that I cannot counter sam's lb in fl, or that sam'lb is ez to pull off. It is not and It comes with risk.
However : its not FUN to play against it. Sam lb mechanic is anit-fun. I want to lost in the flow of combat without having to pay attention to that one thing that will oneshot me if I keep attacking.
I think the exist of sam lb made fl 50% less fun, because everytime I see a sam, I have to change my mindset. Its like the rules of the game had changed the moment I saw a Sam. It is just not fun to play against a sam.
Tbf I still think that fl is just meme game mod, its not fun and that is fine.

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I can see your point. Personally I have the same issue vs Seiton or Meteodrive which both feel pretty much like "guess I die" and move on.
On the other hand I find it extremely funny to counter Zantetsuken with shields, but there is no in between.
Also FLs is a gigantic gamble since you have no enemy list to see the Chiten buff, and the SAM also doesn't have one either to see your Kuzushi debuff so it's kind of a dice roll every time.

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Originally Posted by ChrysOCE

to be fair, there is nothing so infuriating as using an AOE in a crowd of 5+ and hitting the SAM on the fringe, at the back, and getting one-shotted. like... WTF I WASN'T EVEN LOOKING AT YOU, RANDOM SAM!

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Even funnier since they changed the hit registration, when the sam conveniently moved or dashed in out of nowhere after you actually used your AoE skill.

Yeah ur so right, let just say , what if you saw like 6 sam on the enemies team at the beginning of the match. Its just an unpleasant feeling to start the match...
I remember inviting a new player to play fl. They got oneshot by a sam cause they hit em with an aoe by accident. He die randomly with full health far away from the enemies group. He was so confused and said this game mod not for him. Now he only do fl for exp, just like everyone.
Because stuff like this made fl looks unpolished and chaotic.
Fl will remain this way sadly.

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Originally Posted by Valence

I can see your point. Personally I have the same issue vs Seiton or Meteodrive which both feel pretty much like "guess I die" and move on.
On the other hand I find it extremely funny to counter Zantetsuken with shields, but there is no in between.
Also FLs is a gigantic gamble since you have no enemy list to see the Chiten buff, and the SAM also doesn't have one either to see your Kuzushi debuff so it's kind of a dice roll every time.



Even funnier since they changed the hit registration, when the sam conveniently moved or dashed in out of nowhere after you actually used your AoE skill.

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And yeah Meteodrive in fl while being marked is also the guess I will die moment... well the thing is that if u have a healer theres a chance u can survive... Sam lb however is way faster... for some job you really have no chance to fight back. Jobs like drg, if you hit a sam with your horrid roar by accident ur just dead , it really is the guess I will just die moment ...since Drg dosent have shield.