Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

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Originally Posted by Nanchi

The second part of my message wasn't even adressed at you.
It's good to have discussions when they actually lead somewhere, its also okay to just state your opinion. Just like you, I can say some "demands" i've seen in this thread or on various other social media are very questionable at best.

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You quoted me before so i thought it was :s mb them.
I don't think we can go very far with "how viera should look like" aniway, from the start ppl said what they want to see. What should be done depends on the target that's all.
I didn't see the questionnable demands tbh i'm not reading everything but i agree that not every idea is acceptable. But it's better to know that it's there, better than "no one makes questionnable demands so everything is safe".

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

“Lore is weird.” So is all of the lore in this game. Pretty is subjective. I know people find female au ra’s pretty. I think they look like melted barbie dolls. Tastes are purely subjective.

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I'm not exactly sure why every single time I play and post as au ra, au ra just gets "mentioned" in reply to me, with having absolutely no relevance to my post nor the topic at hand, in my opinion. To me, it's odd, but I digress. Was I stating male viera don't look "pretty" as a fact? As I recall in my post I stated: "to me", as in: subjective, but I digress.

Anyway, unpopular opinion here, lore wise, female hrothgar should have been included to the game before female viera, and most definitely male viera. We have a femroe as a hrothgar queen due to this. It makes complete sense for female hrothgar to be a playable race. Less so for male viera, and they feel shoehorned into the game.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Anyway, unpopular opinion here, lore wise, female hrothgar should have been included to the game before female viera, and most definitely male viera. We have a femroe as a hrothgar queen due to this. It makes complete sense for female hrothgar to be a playable race. Less so for male viera, and they feel shoehorned into the game.

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i don‘t think it‘s an unpopular opinion! lore wise female hrothgar would have made more sense, since they could‘ve been connected to bozja.
the hard truth is tho female hrothgar was not going to happen. the graphics team started working on male viera in their free time (secretly), as it was mentioned in an interview. i don‘t want to sound harsh but the reality is, the only reason female hrothgar is going to happen is due to high demand for male viera. yoshi p said his stance about the genders didn‘t change (he didn‘t want them included), until the graphics team presented him their work i guess. and if you are going to complete one race, you can‘t just ignore the other.
even tho i probably won‘t play femhroth, i still would have continued asking for their inclusion. genderlockdd races just leave a bitter taste in my mouth.
so i think it‘s plausible viera came first, as the more demanded race in general.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

AuRa have some of the prettiest faces. Sadu doesn’t look like Barbie either. I think this is an exaggeration. Anyone can customize most the females in this game to resemble Barbie. I don’t understand the purpose of trying to insult AuRa characters to prove a point. Yes, beauty is subjective. It’s going to be how people customize their male viera that will determine if they end up being pretty or not.

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It’s my opinion. Purely subjective i don’t see how it was an insult considering it’s my opinion that people shouldn’t take to heart. You think they have some of the prettiest faces, i don’t. That’s fine. No need to take it as some personal insult or anything.

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Originally Posted by Fukuro

i don‘t think it‘s an unpopular opinion! lore wise female hrothgar would have made more sense, since they could‘ve been connected to bozja.
the hard truth is tho female hrothgar was not going to happen. the graphics team started working on male viera in their free time (secretly), as it was mentioned in an interview. i don‘t want to sound harsh but the reality is, the only reason female hrothgar is going to happen is due to high demand for male viera. yoshi p said his stance about the genders didn‘t change (he didn‘t want them included), until the graphics team presented him their work i guess. and if you are going to complete one race, you can‘t just ignore the other.
even tho i probably won‘t play femhroth, i still would continue to ask for their inclusion. and i think they wanted to avoid another shitstorm...
so i think it‘s plausible viera came first, as the more demanded race in general.

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I feel like parts of this story are abit.....off.
Male Viera and Female Hrothgar were a "Maybe" if they can get over some hurdle that money in itself wouldnt fix alone. Plus this is possibly the last time they could develop new races for the game because of the time and money it takes to make them and fit gear to them and all that jazz. So they wanted to fulfill a long time request of putting in Viera, and then do what THEY wanted and put in a Beast Race. One Female only, the other Male Only.
The fact they can make Male Viera now and have stated Female Hrothgar are happening, but instead of waiting to release them at the same time-they will release them one at a time as they are finished......tells me they figured out the hurdle.

Honestly, considering what they did in ShB, it would have made more sense for them to just do what they originally wanted and intended...and finish the Hrothgar.
Cause now we are stuck with the weirdness that is a FemRoe as a Hrothgar Queen.

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Originally Posted by Fukuro

the graphics team started working on male viera in their free time (secretly), as it was mentioned in an interview.

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I feel like we have to nip this in the bud before we have another "devs working for free in their private time" situation. What he said was that they worked out the logistics of how best to go about this in their free time, which I'm seeing from multiple sources isn't actually private time but time between projects they're working on, not that they made the race secretly or on their own time.

Agreed on everything else though, full Hrothgar would've made a lot more sense story-wise but in the end they are still a business and popularity matters.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

I'm not exactly sure why every single time I play and post as au ra, au ra just gets "mentioned" in reply to me, with having absolutely no relevance to my post nor the topic at hand, in my opinion. To me, it's odd, but I digress. Was I stating male viera don't look "pretty" as a fact? As I recall in my post I stated: "to me", as in: subjective, but I digress.

Anyway, unpopular opinion here, lore wise, female hrothgar should have been included to the game before female viera, and most definitely male viera. We have a femroe as a hrothgar queen due to this. It makes complete sense for female hrothgar to be a playable race. Less so for male viera, and they feel shoehorned into the game.

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They at least made the femroe make sense in accordance to the story so i give them props for that. I think it’s a pretty obvious idea that they didn’t add female hrothgar because they know they wouldn’t be as popular, considering the play rate of femroes. Resources are better put to races that will get played by more players. This game is the very definition of shoehorning. Look at the male miqote showhorn they did after 1.0. They constantly add things to pander to the playerbase that don’t exactly make sense. Idk why people act like this is any different or is somehow worse. It makes sense for Male Viera to be a playable race just as much as female hroth so idk where that logic is coming from? As for the au ra comment, nothing to do with you. female au ra is just the one race/gender combo i find the least appealing personally. So i used it as an example. Nothing against you.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Are male viera even "pretty" though? To me they look kind of scuffed, frankly. Plus the lore is weird.

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Weird lore is interesting lore and can be a springboard to character concept development. How would they think about things compared to another culture? What's strange to us is normal to them and vice versa.

In any case all the weird bits are in backstory and not their current state. My own imagined Viera character is pretty unfussed by the whole gender thing because that's just what happens to everyone. Kits grow into men and women. He's a man now. That's all there is to it.

And yes I do think they look "pretty" to varying degrees – the main one shown in the trailer maybe less so, but the dark-haired Veena on the presentation slide certainly is.

(I use the term gender-neutrally – delicate features and often long hair. A little more flippant than calling them beautiful, perhaps. Personally I consider it a positive in any case, and nothing to do with their male-ness.)

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

So they wanted to fulfill a long time request of putting in Viera, and then do what THEY wanted and put in a Beast Race. One Female only, the other Male Only.

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I think they had said somewhere that they were doing Hrothgar first as a complete race and then decided to do the split race so they could fulfil the request for Viera, and the female Hrothgar were dropped at that point.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

I feel like we have to nip this in the bud before we have another "devs working for free in their private time" situation. What he said was that they worked out the logistics of how best to go about this in their free time, which I'm seeing from multiple sources isn't actually private time but time between projects they're working on, not that they made the race secretly or on their own time.

Agreed on everything else though, full Hrothgar would've made a lot more sense story-wise but in the end they are still a business and popularity matters.

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true i misinterpreted it! thanks for the clarification. the blog post on playstation kind of confused me. xD
especially this quote:

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To everyone’s surprise, Final Fantasy XIV will have a new playable race! You’ve mentioned the team worked on the race in secret. Can you give us more details as to how Male Viera (and in the future, Female Hrothgar) came to be?

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Source: https://www.google.ch/amp/s/blog.pla...oshida-qa/amp/

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

The fact they can make Male Viera now and have stated Female Hrothgar are happening, but instead of waiting to release them at the same time-they will release them one at a time as they are finished......tells me they figured out the hurdle.

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it‘s just what i got from the sony blogpost

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They spent over half a year using what free time they had in between their normal work on the patches to consider ways to add another playable race. From this they concluded that we could probably squeeze in just one more at this time. Of course, by adding male Viera now, we anticipated people may be vocal about the absence of female Hrothgar and want to know what the situation was. Rather than waiting until (hypothetically) 7.0 to add two playable races at the same time, we realized we could actually ease the impact on our resources if we implemented these one at a time.

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seems like their plan was to squeeze in male viera, but as a result they looked at ways to implement both genders.

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Rather than waiting until (hypothetically) 7.0 to add two playable races at the same time, we realized we could actually ease the impact on our resources if we implemented these one at a time. Ultimately, I decided we should then move forward with implementing one playable race at a time, and I will make sure to explain that to our players: that’s what we did for this upcoming expansion.

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i‘m just hopeful female hrothgar indeed get added in 6.x, since many seem to be way to certain about that xD

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

They at least made the femroe make sense in accordance to the story so i give them props for that. I think it’s a pretty obvious idea that they didn’t add female hrothgar because they know they wouldn’t be as popular, considering the play rate of femroes. Resources are better put to races that will get played by more players. This game is the very definition of shoehorning. Look at the male miqote showhorn they did after 1.0. They constantly add things to pander to the playerbase that don’t exactly make sense. Idk why people act like this is any different or is somehow worse. It makes sense for Male Viera to be a playable race just as much as female hroth so idk where that logic is coming from? As for the au ra comment, nothing to do with you. female au ra is just the one race/gender combo i find the least appealing personally. So i used it as an example. Nothing against you.

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Personally, I don't really see why we needed male viera so much more than female hrothgar. It's a novelty. The concept of feminine males was already filled with that addition of male miqo'te, and male miqo'te will still be quite a bit more popular in general. Mooncat male miqo'te even fill that certain* niche or whatever I think was being talked about yesterday.. So, to be frank, female hrothgar would have simply been the better choice. In ever possible aspect. They would have added much more to the game. If a race has to be limited, at least there is some justification with hrothgar - with their high quality animal heads! Male viera just have what looks like glued on ears to me, and just that makes them limited!

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Originally Posted by HollowedDoll

Male Viera aren't even really part of the society

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That's not exactly true. They are a part of society, they just don't follow traditions we, as humanity, are used to. Same goes for Miqo'te or even Au Ra to a certain extend, given some of their tribes's customs.

In FF12 Viera didn't even need to be physically close to each other because the Forest would tell them where their kin is. We know that from scene where Fran asks where her sister went.

We don't know if Forest talks to them in FF14 (there is a hint to that in the Fanow, but it's not clear about The Source), but we do know from Dramaturge that one Viera told to him the next: “When I was younger and far more the fool than I am now, I asked a Viera if she did not find her tribe’s ways awkward. Was it not within the natural order for males and females of a species to coexist? The woman answered me thus: ‘The value of coexistence will not be found ‘neath a loincloth. Long has our kind endured understanding that the distance 'twixt two bodies does not dictate the distance 'twixt two souls.’” This dialogue is available at Prima Vista up to this day.

They may not share same roof, but it doesn't mean they aren't close, as it doesn't mean that they aren't the parts of one same society, because they very much are in their own ways.

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Originally Posted by Halivel

‘The value of coexistence will not be found ‘neath a loincloth. Long has our kind endured understanding that the distance 'twixt two bodies does not dictate the distance 'twixt two souls.’” This dialogue is available at Prima Vista up to this day.

They may not share same roof, but it doesn't mean they aren't close, as it doesn't mean that they aren't the parts of one same society, because they very much are in their own ways.

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Please.. I teared up for a bit there.. such a beautiful quote. Thank you for that, anyway! It's very sad to see viera of all kinds abandon their pact with nature just to go on an adventure trip, I would have loved to see them done in the game - in their full glory - prior to their inclusion (if they really had to be). Ah, what could have been.

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Originally Posted by Fukuro

i don‘t think it‘s an unpopular opinion! lore wise female hrothgar would have made more sense, since they could‘ve been connected to bozja.
the hard truth is tho female hrothgar was not going to happen. the graphics team started working on male viera in their free time (secretly), as it was mentioned in an interview. i don‘t want to sound harsh but the reality is, the only reason female hrothgar is going to happen is due to high demand for male viera. yoshi p said his stance about the genders didn‘t change (he didn‘t want them included), until the graphics team presented him their work i guess. and if you are going to complete one race, you can‘t just ignore the other.
even tho i probably won‘t play femhroth, i still would have continued asking for their inclusion. genderlockdd races just leave a bitter taste in my mouth.
so i think it‘s plausible viera came first, as the more demanded race in general.

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Thank you! Being a long time female hrothgar supporter, I was saddened to see viera chosen yet again over them. A race that adds very little to the game in comparison, in my opinion. SE will probably soon be between a rock and a hard place with their addition as well. I doubt the addition of male viera will be enough for many players. I just don't think they really appeal to any specific niche. They will probably be too tall, for players who are used to their catboys, and too feminine - and short - for players who wanted a conventionally handsome male addition. Speaking of that, while being quite feminine, in my opinion, they aren't androgynous. You can tell they are males - so that niche isn't filled either! ON TOP of being a limited race, so players will probably not be able to use hats, nor any of their collected hairstyles! I just don't see the novelty of 'male viera' lasting more than a few weeks for many players, and they will simply switch right back to whatever they were prior!

At least with the inclusion of female hrothgar, we could have gotten a strong female race, that would have made the story more coherent, in my opinion, and been quite exciting to see them in action in Bozja! I would have not only loved to see an actual hrothgar queen, but I would have also loved to see female hrothgar participating in the actual liberation of their homeland! Like, why would they be on the sidelines, during such a crucial moment?!

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Please.. I teared up for a bit there.. such a beautiful quote. It's very sad to see viera of all kinds abandon their pact with nature just to go on an adventure trip, I would have loved to see them done in the game - in their full glory - prior to their inclusion. Ah, what could have been.

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yeah i always read it with frans voice in my head, with that typical islandic accent! reminds me of frans departure in ff xii, brought me to tears seeing her leaving her sisters and tribe.
https://youtu.be/rB9wIXEQeNo

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Originally Posted by Fukuro

yeah i always read it with frans voice in my head, with that typical islandic accent! reminds me of frans departure in ff xii, brought me to tears seeing her leaving her sisters and tribe.
https://youtu.be/rB9wIXEQeNo

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God.. the feels! I'm actually sobbing right now. I wish SE could have done something like that in this game. A proper send off for the addition of male viera! They were done too early! Me saying I wanted hrothgar first, doesn't mean I don't think the addition of viera could have been so much better, rather than being seemingly shoehorned, in my opinion. Sigh..

Anyone know when the benchmark will be released? I wanna create bun boi.

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Originally Posted by Laerune

Anyone know when the benchmark will be released? I wanna create bun boi.

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It is most likely gonna be released around September following old expansion trends.
Also wonder when they will start releasing small teasers and pics on social media like they did with shadowbringers?

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Originally Posted by zeylos

It is most likely gonna be released around September following old expansion trends.
Also wonder when they will start releasing small teasers and pics on social media like they did with shadowbringers?

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I hope soon.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Personally, I don't really see why we needed male viera so much more than female hrothgar. It's a novelty. The concept of feminine males was already filled with that addition of male miqo'te, and male miqo'te will still be quite a bit more popular in general. Mooncat male miqo'te even fill that certain* niche or whatever I think was being talked about yesterday.. So, to be frank, female hrothgar would have simply been the better choice. In ever possible aspect. They would have added much more to the game. If a race has to be limited, at least there is some justification with hrothgar - with their high quality animal heads! Male viera just have what looks like glued on ears to me, and just that makes them limited!

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The main reason is the obvious one. A large majority of the playerbase asked for it. As sad as it is, again, they know female hrothgar wouldn’t be played nearly as much as male viera. In female hroth’s case it would be a waste of resources right now to invest in them as opposed to male viera who were both much more popular but also probably easier to make seeing their similarities to the already implemented female viera. So female hroth wouldn’t have been the best choice in the grand scheme of things. I don’t see how feminine males really fits miqote at all. Sure some players can make them look like that but that goes for all races in general. Male miqo in both lore and actual appearance aren’t inherently feminine at all lol. I mean just look at the nunh’s. I disagree with them looking like glued on bunny ears but that’s your opinion. I think they did a really good job considering this is quite literally the first time male viera have ever been created visually. Much better than when they implemented hrothgar which is supposed to be from X yet...they somehow got everything wrong model wise. This isn’t a hit at hrothgar players, love you the most, but looking at X ronso and their stature and seeing what you guys got...i feel for you.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

God.. the feels! I'm actually sobbing right now. I wish SE could have done something like that in this game. A proper send off for the addition of male viera! They were done too early! Me saying I wanted hrothgar first, doesn't mean I don't think the addition of viera could have been so much better, rather than being seemingly shoehorned, in my opinion. Sigh..

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to be honest, female viera from xiv didn‘t give me that feeling either. i loved the village shown, but i expected the vieras there to be more traditional looking (white hair, darker skin). they only colour their hair when they leave the forest and take on a new name as far as i remember. i also don‘t like that they have chosen frans attire as their racial gear. these things kind of pulled down the immersion level for me at least. but still, ff xiv is not the same as in xii! (i need to keep reminding myself! ;)
as to male viera, yoshi p said their lore is going to be explored on on a later time. let‘s see what it brings go the table!

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Originally Posted by Halivel

That's not exactly true. They are a part of society, they just don't follow traditions we, as humanity, are used to. Same goes for Miqo'te or even Au Ra to a certain extend, given some of their tribes's customs.

In FF12 Viera didn't even need to be physically close to each other because the Forest would tell them where their kin is. We know that from scene where Fran asks where her sister went.

We don't know if Forest talks to them in FF14 (there is a hint to that in the Fanow, but it's not clear about The Source), but we do know from Dramaturge that one Viera told to him the next: “When I was younger and far more the fool than I am now, I asked a Viera if she did not find her tribe’s ways awkward. Was it not within the natural order for males and females of a species to coexist? The woman answered me thus: ‘The value of coexistence will not be found ‘neath a loincloth. Long has our kind endured understanding that the distance 'twixt two bodies does not dictate the distance 'twixt two souls.’” This dialogue is available at Prima Vista up to this day.

They may not share same roof, but it doesn't mean they aren't close, as it doesn't mean that they aren't the parts of one same society, because they very much are in their own ways.

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I suppose it depends on which definition you use, but they definitely don't live together even with each other.

Unpopular opinion: Instead of adding male Viera, they should focus on the existing races.

For example adding more options (Au Ra: dyeable scales, horns and faces separeted, Miqo: stribes on their bodies, Hyur: elezen ears, etc) or fixing stuff for female Viera (wearing hats, using additional hairstyles, etc).

Thats one of the biggest problem in FFXIV: Instead of improving/fixing old systems, they keep adding stuff almost nobody asked for.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

Unpopular opinion: Instead of adding male Viera, they should focus on the existing races.

For example adding more options (Au Ra: dyeable scales, horns and faces separeted, Miqo: stribes on their bodies, Hyur: elezen ears, etc) or fixing stuff for female Viera (wearing hats, using additional hairstyles, etc).

Thats one of the biggest problem in FFXIV: Instead of improving/fixing old systems, they keep adding stuff almost nobody asked for.

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Too true. The races prior definitely could have used a touching up before male viera, considering the limitations. They've been needing one for quite awhile too.

I just don't think they can add those sort of things without totally restructuring character data and how the rest of the game reads it.

Adding an entirely new race, on the other hand, is just using the existing template to be assembled according to the same instructions, so it slots into the rest of the game far more easily.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

Thats one of the biggest problem in FFXIV: Instead of improving/fixing old systems, they keep adding stuff almost nobody asked for.

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Except a majority have asked for Male Viera for a long time. People act like it’s something only a few people want. Considering that this thread has 1481 pages, that’s more than proof enough lol.As for things for the existing races, those are things they'd have to look at the engine for. They've said its the engine that limits them a lot from doing things like that while also they'd have to look at the overall structure of each of those races' data. As difficult as it may be to believe, adding a new race is technically less work than applying changes like that.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Except a majority have asked for Male Viera for a long time. People act like it’s something only a few people want. Considering that this thread has 1481 pages, that’s more than proof enough lol.

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I dont think that "a majority" really asked for it. That would mean, that 51% of the entire playerbase would be a male Viera with the release of Endwalker.
The most popular races in FFXIV are Miqote, Au Ra and Lalafell. 1481 pages doesnt prove anything. You can push threads like this.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I just don't think they can add those sort of things without totally restructuring character data and how the rest of the game reads it.

Adding an entirely new race, on the other hand, is just using the existing template to be assembled according to the same instructions, so it slots into the rest of the game far more easily.

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You mean, besides the fact to add new models, animations and other stuff when adding a new race/gender? Tell existing Viera players about how the feel when new hairstyles coming out. Or wearing helmets/hats. I rather would like to have a totally new (finished) race instead of an unfinished race "everybody" asked for. Especially for... reasons...

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

They've said its the engine that limits them a lot from doing things like that while also they'd have to look at the overall structure of each of those races' data. As difficult as it may be to believe, adding a new race is technically less work than applying changes like that.

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Like the servers/engine limiting inventory/storage space. But if you re willing to extra pay for it, its surprisingly possible. I think the Devs focusing to much on new stuff instead of working hard to improve existing stuff. Because its easier. I mean, you cant even put a glamour dresser in your house. Or multi-select in your inventory. Or just having 13 accessories (12 umbrellas, 1 wing), but still being limited in your actions... . Blaming the system for something is a lazy excuse in my opinion.


Dont get me wrong. I dont blame players who wants male Vieras. Absolutely understandable. I blame SE's way to keep adding stuff, when they should fixing their old stuff first! Even when 51% of players get their male Vieras, 49% of all other players get nothing in return.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I just don't think they can add those sort of things without totally restructuring character data and how the rest of the game reads it.

Adding an entirely new race, on the other hand, is just using the existing template to be assembled according to the same instructions, so it slots into the rest of the game far more easily.

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This unfortunately is true. It's why I don't see customization expanding unless we get more playable clans/tribes which, honestly, I'd be down for.

My perfect world has us getting male viera and female hrothgar then them putting a stop to new races so they can get hair/hats working on the new ones and overhauling customization completely but that is probably a bigger lift than most people would suspect for this particular game.

It may not be a literal majority but the amount of people pushing for male viera happened to be significant enough for the development team to move ahead with adding them to the game. I don't doubt that they'll be a popular choice.

The amount of likes present on the first post of this thread is also more than I've seen anywhere else on this site and although this forum only represents a small portion of the overall playerbase, it's not as if there hasn't been a lot of talk about male viera elsewhere.

I do hope to see an expansion or rebuilding of the character creation system in the future, though. Mostly because I think that would have appealed to a greater number of players in the long run.

I do agree with giving existing races more options, but thinking almost 2000 likes and a thread as big as this isn't indicative of how requested this is seems..odd? It may not be the majority, but clearly a significant portion of the player base asked for it. If you don't play Male characters, you may not see it or care. Yes, female characters are the majority, but male character players aren't too far behind afaik. If we're going to go the "why add em" route, why did they add F!Viera and Hrothgar in the first place? Aura, Miquote and Lala are the most played afterall. I also think its kinda unfair to play the "x got nothing game". Its just something that will happen.* Some of us have been waiting for a tall handsome tall option that doesn't have an noticeable drawback factor in it. For some people Male Viera is it. Some of us have been waiting for a beastly female option that isn't just a borinv human with animal ears and tails put on. Some of us have been waiting for more masculine hairstyles and glamor for their Male characters and found wanting. Not everyone gets what they want all the time.

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Originally Posted by CherryCola

I do agree with giving existing races more options, but thinking almost 2000 likes and a thread as big as this isn't indicative of how requested this is seems..odd? It may not be the majority, but clearly a significant portion of the player base asked for it. If you don't play Male characters, you may not see it or care. Yes, female characters are the majority, but male character players aren't too far behind afaik. If we're going to go the "why add em" route, why did they add F!Viera and Hrothgar in the first place? Aura, Miquote and Lala are the most played afterall. I also think its kinda unfair to play the "x got nothing game". Its just something that will happen.* Some of us have been waiting for a tall handsome tall option that doesn't have an noticeable drawback factor in it. For some people Male Viera is it. Some of us have been waiting for a beastly female option that isn't just a borinv human with animal ears and tails put on. Some of us have been waiting for more masculine hairstyles and glamor for their Male characters and found wanting. Not everyone gets what they want all the time.

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This so much. I hate when people use the argument of “x gets nothing.” Welcome to the world of a male character. We had to deal with not getting a male alternative to the 2b coffer. We’ve had to deal with getting feminine and androgynous hairstyles. We’ve had to deal with a fair amount of our glams being very feminine-esque. All of a sudden we get something big for us:Male Viera, and it’s a huge loss to resources and it isn’t fair to people who get nothing. I don’t see people saying this when they waste resources on Mahjong, or Triple Triad, or Parasols or Gpose Stickers. Let us have this lmao.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

Thats one of the biggest problem in FFXIV: Instead of improving/fixing old systems, they keep adding stuff almost nobody asked for.

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You're correct in general on this. Existing races need more customization options, and a whole host of implemented content could do with additions or incentives. Chocobo racing comes to mind.

I'd disagree that nobody asked for male Viera, or female Hrothgar for that matter. You're posting in a nearly 1500 page thread about it. We could quibble on what percentage of players don't want gender-locked races but it's obviously significant. Maybe they will eventually get around to adding customization to existing races once we're over this hurdle of male Viera and female Hrothgar being implemented.

As it is, they opened this can of worms by introducing Viera and Hrothgar the way they did, after already correcting a similar issue between Roegadyn and Miqote in ARR. So for now I'd prioritize parity over catgirls with stripes.

I don’t understand why it’s so hard to make new sub races.

Take off viera ears and add horns
Glowy eyes and a tail. New tall thin Au Ra.

Add elf ears to humans. Half elezen

Add wolf ears to miqote maybe increase the higher slider dog folks

Give lalas miqote ears.

Then just give them there own little face customization! Boom! New races/sub races

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

We had to deal with not getting a male alternative to the 2b coffer. We’ve had to deal with getting feminine and androgynous hairstyles. We’ve had to deal with a fair amount of our glams being very feminine-esque. All of a sudden we get something big for us:Male Viera, and it’s a huge loss to resources and it isn’t fair to people.

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You think a unfinished male copy-paste from the female Viera would make a bigger difference than having better hairstyles, character creator options, glamours, s.o.? I mean, you will get it, but the rest wont change.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

You mean, besides the fact to add new models, animations and other stuff when adding a new race/gender? Tell existing Viera players about how the feel when new hairstyles coming out. Or wearing helmets/hats. I rather would like to have a totally new (finished) race instead of an unfinished race "everybody" asked for. Especially for... reasons...

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Hats are a separate issue again, but adding more types of customisation is a different kind of work to adding another race. It's not just about making new models, but reprogramming whatever it is that needs to read the information and assemble it into your character as instructed.

Plus every additional bit of information is another thing that needs to be transmitted to and from every single player in the same zone as each other so it can build all the characters on every player's screen, so adding any more customisable elements has a cumulative effect on how much data needs to be handled by your connection and by the servers.

On the other hand, once a race is built, there isn't any more data that needs to be sent about it than about any of the other races. The template of instructions is the same, just with a different number in the "character race" box.

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Originally Posted by Caitlyn

You think a unfinished male copy-paste from the female Viera would make a bigger difference than having better hairstyles, character creator options, glamours, s.o.? I mean, you will get it, but the rest wont change.

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I’m saying that even if we hadn’t gotten Male Viera, it doesn’t mean we’d have better character customization instead. Look at stormblood. Didn’t add any new races yet there were no character customization changes. It’s because there’s much more work to be put in over character customization for each race than there is to implement a gender of an already existing race. My entire point is that people whine that Male Viera are taking resources away or that it isn’t fair that “X benefits from this but x doesn’t.” Male characters have constantly been excluded from things, and now we finally get something a large group has wanted for a long time, and people still try to take the joy away because they don’t get something out of it. When it’s been that way for us for a long time.

To be fair, they waste alot of resources that they could be funneling to raiding (the best content in the game). Instead we get stupid cosmetic crap and board games, and catbois mk.2. Smh, atleast they could give us better textures.

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Originally Posted by HollowedDoll

I suppose it depends on which definition you use, but they definitely don't live together even with each other.

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Which doesn't stop them from being a part of the same society because, again, being together 24/7 isn't what they value in their relationships as shown in above quote. Not to mention that they live easily for 240 years and even longer, and in this scenario seeing each other every 3-5 years (according to dramaturge) isn't even that rare tbh, especially given that we don't know for how long they stay in the village when they come back. /shrug

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Originally Posted by Halivel

Which doesn't stop them from being a part of the same society because, again, being together 24/7 isn't what they value in their relationships as shown in above quote. Not to mention that they live easily for 240 years and even longer, and in this scenario seeing each other every 3-5 years (according to dramaturge) isn't even that rare tbh, especially given that we don't know for how long they stay in the village when they come back. /shrug

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5 years is a long time without interactions, just saying.
not to mention that they're separated by tribes too
having a common belief/goal does not equal a society

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Originally Posted by zeylos

It is most likely gonna be released around September following old expansion trends.
Also wonder when they will start releasing small teasers and pics on social media like they did with shadowbringers?

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Benchmark normally was coming out 1,5 month prior the expansion release, which means that we will get one in October if they are to follow their old schedule.

Teasers arts usually were started being dropped 2 weeks before expansion release, if that's what you're wondering about.

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Originally Posted by HollowedDoll

5 years is a long time without interactions, just saying.
not to mention that they're separated by tribes too
having a common belief/goal does not equal a society

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You percieve 5 years as being long because our average life lasts for 70 years combined with the fact we live in a capitalistic societies that teach us that "time is money" so we end up always rushing. It's not the same for Viera who, first, live at least 3 times longer and, second, don't have the same society structure as ours. And in case if FF14's forest talks to them the same way FF12's one did, then the time apart would mean even less for them as they can know their kin wellbeing without the need to see them in person.

That said, percieving Viera's culture from the perspective of ours won't work, because it simply doesn't fit in it (and isn't supposed to fit).

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Originally Posted by artypartytime

I don’t understand why it’s so hard to make new sub races.

Take off viera ears and add horns
Glowy eyes and a tail. New tall thin Au Ra.

Add elf ears to humans. Half elezen

Add wolf ears to miqote maybe increase the higher slider dog folks

Give lalas miqote ears.

Then just give them there own little face customization! Boom! New races/sub races

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I guess today I'm the devil's advocate.

Let me quote my man Barry Schwartz on the Paradox of Overchoice :
"... it's easy to imagine that you could've made a different choice that would've been better. And what happens is, this imagined alternative induces you to regret the decision you made, and this regret subtracts from the satisfaction you get out of the decision you made, even if it was a good decision. The more options there are, the easier it is to regret anything at all that is disappointing about the option that you chose."

When we start putting in these extra legoland mix and match races, what we get are all these alternatives.
The more attractive alternatives you have, generally the more your satisfaction with your own choice goes down as well.
It's a reason why waifu races probably generate the most fantasias (good on you SE !) They are literally mix and match smol human females.

Also, it would probably put a sizeable dent in the worldbuilding of XIV and fully remove our veil of disbelief.
Note: imho, there is nothing wrong with adding more options/customization with the current world. Subraces are just beyond the necessary and immediate scope.