What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

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Originally Posted by Nekokaori

it has nothing to do with the name lol

and if u want to talk about marketing they said there would be a price to pay, but there wasnt

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I dunno, I paid $39.99

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Originally Posted by Theodric

What's meant to be wrong with liking Garlemald, exactly...? There were many ways in which it could have been handled without leading to its destruction, especially when it's people have long suffered as a consequence of the Sundering leaving them with the inability to manipulate aether in many cases as well as repeated attempts to subject them to genocide.

The development team outright admitted that Garlemald was set to have an expansion of its own, which suggests that the original plan wasn't to simply do away with the place entirely. Furthermore, it wasn't lacking for fans - even with a vocal subset of the community bizarrely and creepily attacking anyone who dared to mention it in a positive manner.

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Nothing is wrong with "liking" Garlemald per se, but you and Aveyond both do have a pretty strong romanticization of the country and its militarism that goes well beyond just a "villains are cool" viewpoint.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

What's meant to be wrong with liking Garlemald, exactly...? There were many ways in which it could have been handled without leading to its destruction, especially when it's people have long suffered as a consequence of the Sundering leaving them with the inability to manipulate aether in many cases as well as repeated attempts to subject them to genocide.

The development team outright admitted that Garlemald was set to have an expansion of its own, which suggests that the original plan wasn't to simply do away with the place entirely. Furthermore, it wasn't lacking for fans - even with a vocal subset of the community bizarrely and creepily attacking anyone who dared to mention it in a positive manner.

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I don't know, for me it's just weird that of all peoples and places in the story some would identify themselves with they choose an evil militaristic empire that kills people for fun, do countless atrocities and subjugate other nations and treat them terribly just because they're powerful and can... or for revenge I don't know if that's deeper. But I don't really care, it's just a game.

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Originally Posted by CrownySuccubus

Nothing is wrong with "liking" Garlemald per se, but you and Aveyond both do have a pretty strong romanticization of the country and its militarism that goes well beyond just a "villains are cool" viewpoint.

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It's a fictional nation and whether they're 'villains' is very much a matter of perspective. I'm not sure how liking the place equals 'romanticisation', either. I live in Europe, where much of the Roman's history can still be seen and touched to this very day and the Garleans are based directly off of the Romans with a bit of Russian influence thrown in for good measure.

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Originally Posted by Starshower

I don't know, for me it's just weird that of all peoples and places in the story some would identify themselves with they choose an evil militaristic empire that kills people for fun, do countless atrocities and subjugate other nations and treat them terribly just because they're powerful and can... or for revenge I don't know if that's deeper. But I don't really care, it's just a game.

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I'm not unused to people making sweeping comments implying 'concern' about someone liking or disliking the 'wrong' thing in a video game. It reminds me of the unhinged players who insisted that if someone played the Horde in World of Warcraft, they had to be a bad person. So bizarre!

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Originally Posted by Starshower

Sweetie, endwalker was about the end of the story and tying loose ends first and foremost. Why did you get the impression that the story would be mainly about the final days? I'm glad that the story touched on more than just that! Remember, they said in the fanfest and marketing materials that shadowbringers was about finally bringing an end to the garlean empire!


https://i.imgur.com/UUZNepO.png


Imagine being disappointed that shadowbringers wasn't about that at all, instead of what it actually was about! (that's you)


Stop limiting endwalker by what the final days could have been... that's all in your heads lol. You're basically mad it wasn't what was on the marketing material while shadowbringers had the same misleading over it. (and stormblood being advertised as the ala mhigo expansion, while omitting that the far east was even a thing until the last moment).


Edit: yeah, I know you garlemald lovers think a garlemald expansion would be all about keeping garlemald's honor... Look at that slide and let sink in what the devs intended since many years ago.

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The devs didn’t intend anything many years ago though. They themselves said they don’t plan in advance, they take everything as it comes. Considering what they’ve told us too, it seems there are constantly a lot of rewrites so who knows how the story would have turned out had we got a garlemald expansion. For example, originally Eden was meant to be the final boss in ShB and not Emet-Selch. So the story already would’ve been immensely different at that point.

People are disappointed because the expansion was advertised as the end of the Hydaelyn and Zodiark arc, yet both of them got the least amount of screentime and depth than most characters. People are disappointed because it was advertised the final days would actually be a threat and one that affected the world. Instead we only see the final days in full effect in two zones….

Also, a lot of loose ends they didn’t even tie up. They just either dropped them or didn’t explain them whatsoever during the story and had to actually just say it during an interview LOL. Important things like how the the 3 unsundered escaped the sundering, what Azem was doing during the final days etc. We didn’t even learn anything about the 3rd set of sacrifices or venat’s followers.

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Originally Posted by Starshower

I don't know, for me it's just weird that of all peoples and places in the story some would identify themselves with they choose an evil militaristic empire that kills people for fun, do countless atrocities and subjugate other nations and treat them terribly just because they're powerful and can... or for revenge I don't know if that's deeper. But I don't really care, it's just a game.

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Curious how any of this is different from people identifying themselves with say...a place that promotes and indulges in slavery and committed mass genocide for fun (Uldah), or identfying with a place that promotes and indulges in sex trafficking for fun(Kugane), or a place that revolves around piracy, assassinations, mass slaughtering a beast tribe and taking their land etc(Limsa.)

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Originally Posted by Starshower

Really? You don't think an expansion about encroaching despair and doom would also involve hope and finding happiness in the little moments? The 2 obviously go together very well. You can't have one without the other. I'm glad that for the end of the saga, it ended in a bright note where everyone came together and hope overcame despair. What an awful end it would be if everyone just died lol.

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everyone didnt need to die but we should have lost atleast 2 people and honestly we should have lost y'stola but yet again for the 4th time she pays no price for basicly living again AGAIN she is pulled out of the flames ..

yes she went blind but big deal she came out more op than all of us so what if she is "blind" but can see better than rest of us

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I'm not unused to people making sweeping comments implying 'concern' about someone liking or disliking the 'wrong' thing in a video game. It reminds me of the unhinged players who insisted that if someone played the Horde in World of Warcraft, they had to be a bad person. So bizarre!

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I for one love the horde! They have the hottest races!

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Originally Posted by Nekokaori

everyone didnt need to die but we should have lost atleast 2 people and honestly we should have lost y'stola but yet again for the 4th time she pays no price for basicly living again AGAIN she is pulled out of the flames ..

yes she went blind but big deal she came out more op than all of us so what if she is "blind" but can see better than rest of us

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I agree completely, I think it's been too long since someone major died last time it was in heavensward!! I was really hoping thancred would die personally, never liked the fella.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It's a fictional nation and whether they're 'villains' is very much a matter of perspective. I'm not sure how liking the place equals 'romanticisation', either. I live in Europe, where much of the Roman's history can still be seen and touched to this very day and the Garleans are based directly off of the Romans with a bit of Russian influence thrown in for good measure.

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They're a military dictatorship that invaded other countries, enslaved and/or oppressed its citizens, respected nothing but military might, and held complete contempt for the beliefs and way of life for those of outsiders. Given what we've seen them do throughout these expansions. calling their villainy a "matter of perspective" is quite romantic, to say the least.

As I also mentioned before, the only thing the Garleans have in common with Romans is their name. Unlike the Romans, the Garleans were not content to simply conquer a place and collect taxes from it. They were a colonial power focused on outright destroying other cultures due to their hatred for religion and outright contempt for anything outside of military strength. They were closer to 20th Century Fascists than they were to the Romans.

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Originally Posted by CrownySuccubus

They're a military dictatorship that invaded other countries, enslaved and/or oppressed its citizens, respected nothing but military might, and held complete contempt for the beliefs and way of life for those of outsiders. Given what we've seen them do throughout these expansions. calling their villainy a "matter of perspective" is quite romantic, to say the least.

As I also mentioned before, the only thing the Garleans have in common with Romans is their name. Unlike the Romans, the Garleans were not content to simply conquer a place and collect taxes from it. They were a colonial power focused on outright destroying other cultures due to their hatred for religion and outright contempt for anything outside of military strength. They were closer to 20th Century Fascists than they were to the Romans.

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Again, i ask, how is this any different from Uldah that still participated in slavery to this day, their mass genocide of Sildih and zombifying them, the mass slaughter of kobolds done by limsans and their acts of piracy and assassinations, or the place that promotes sex trafficking. There’s an interesting double standard here i have to say. Either way though, it’s a fictional race, fictional countries, fictional people.