Maybe it's time for a casual "strike" if not complete departure.

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Originally Posted by Erzaa

Why must I do content I've no interest in, just because you decide so?

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This is so funny. Why do you feel like we're forcing you to do anything?

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Originally Posted by Erzaa

I have given it a try, that's how I know I don't like it. I don't need to repeat more of them to know I still won't like it. I tried the SB EX, I tried Savage, I tried a DT EX with some raider friends too and I didn't like it.


You might be annoyed, and I'll give you, you have the right to get annoyed at people trying to say remove the content from the game.

I don't want them to remove the content from the game. But there's definitely not enough casual content in the game, for the ratio of casual to hardcore players that exist in the game. And in that regard, we're completely right in complaining. And I can't unsub can I? I have an FC, submarines, houses and friends I socialise with, in the game. I'd still like to have more stuff to do, and not just chores like beast tribes and IS, actual fun activities. Why is that so hard for people to accept?


Focus on hardcore content, you lose subs, you can't focus on 20% of your player base and expect the other 80% to be happy about it. And casual content is going to be done by all of the player base regardless. The raiders have tons to do, they need to put resources back into the team to also give everyone else tons to do.

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I would LOVE for there to be more casual "chore-ish" activities that are fun and I accept that the chores are that, chores, like weapon grinding or tomestones. However I don't think it should take precedence over hardcore/battle content being released. Do you have a source for the 20/80? Obviously I know the numbers are exaggerated to make a point, but I would like to see something that backs your point, because surely if that were the case they would have started making casual content the main appeal long ago.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

This is so funny. Why do you feel like we're forcing you to do anything?

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Well, let's see now.

First you misrepresent me by stating I'm misrepresenting Dark Souls, when all I said is I don't care about Dark Souls, after someone brought up Dark Souls, not me.

Secondly, you assume I've not tried EX or Savage and somehow would enjoy it if I do, when I've literally said I've no interest in it.

Someone else is telling me I'm playing the wrong game and genre, after I've spent 4,5 years having done everything else in the bloody game.

And for some reason, all these raiders can't understand the possibility that someone else might not enjoy the same things they do, and might possibly want something else for themselves to do and take is as a personal affront.

I don't care if you like hardcore raiding, go for it. I don't want them to remove hardcore raiding, have fun with it. But, I would like to also get my money's worth and have some activities to do in the damn game. Is that so bad?

I appreciate that we've finally departed from this nonsensical 'neurobiology dictates that only 1% of people have the theoretical potential to clear savage' and arrived at the real limiting factor: finding something fun or not.

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Originally Posted by Erzaa

Well, thank you for telling me, the last 4,5 years I've been playing the wrong game and genre. Truly, an enlightening comment. I'm curious, how is it I was able to have fun for 4,5 years, but suddenly it's the wrong game and genre?

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No problem, sis. I'm always here for you.

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Originally Posted by LateNightSuki

I would LOVE for there to be more casual "chore-ish" activities that are fun and I accept that the chores are that, chores, like weapon grinding or tomestones. However I don't think it should take precedence over hardcore/battle content being released. Do you have a source for the 20/80? Obviously I know the numbers are exaggerated to make a point, but I would like to see something that backs your point, because surely if that were the case they would have started making casual content the main appeal long ago.

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No, I don't have a source, like you said, hyperbole to explain the point.

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Originally Posted by LateNightSuki

I would LOVE for there to be more casual "chore-ish" activities that are fun and I accept that the chores are that, chores, like weapon grinding or tomestones. However I don't think it should take precedence over hardcore/battle content being released. Do you have a source for the 20/80? Obviously I know the numbers are exaggerated to make a point, but I would like to see something that backs your point, because surely if that were the case they would have started making casual content the main appeal long ago.

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These numbers usually come from Lucky Bancho. Lucky Bancho uses Lodestones publicly available achievements to gauge an estimate of the games population and their progress in the game. Unfortunately, I don't have a link for that at hand, its fairly well known resource.

According to the current Lucky Bancho, ~20-25% of players allowed to enter Savage (Character at level 100, have cleared Arcadion 4 Normal) have cleared the last floor. This has been, at least to my knowledge, fairly constant over the course of this games life. (That of course does not say how many people attempt at it, or how many people actually play the content, even if unsuccessfully)

ETA: looks like it has been answered above too, was Hyperbole. Will keep that post here up though.

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Originally Posted by LateNightSuki

I would LOVE for there to be more casual "chore-ish" activities that are fun and I accept that the chores are that, chores, like weapon grinding or tomestones. However I don't think it should take precedence over hardcore/battle content being released. Do you have a source for the 20/80? Obviously I know the numbers are exaggerated to make a point, but I would like to see something that backs your point, because surely if that were the case they would have started making casual content the main appeal long ago.

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No content should take precedent over the other, frankly. But the developers do not really make an effort to try and please both groups of players simultaneously. Instead they just yoyo between the two.

That being said if we look at publicly available achievement data according to XIVCollect, there are 237,890 characters with public achievements. Of those, 84% (200,634) have the achievement for Completing the Main Scenario Quest "Vows of Virtue, Deeds of Cruelty) 61% (145,532) has discovered every location at the southern front. 53% (128,202) have cleared Delubrum Reginae at least once. 42% (101,397) have discovered every location in Zadnor,. 39% (94,441) have cleared Dalriada at least once. Keep in mind this is only players with public achievement data, and this is probably the closest data you'll get for casual content unless Lucky Bancho reports on it.

Obviously the 20-80 is hypoerbole, and I do want to emphasis that I don't think either content should take precedence over the other. But the fact is that SE in the long-term actually gives both equal precedence.. But yes you would at least figure they would try and introduce this content sooner.

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Originally Posted by ovIm

These numbers usually come from Lucky Bancho. Lucky Bancho uses Lodestones publicly available achievements to gauge an estimate of the games population and their progress in the game. Unfortunately, I don't have a link for that at hand, its fairly well known resource.

According to the current Lucky Bancho, ~20-25% of players allowed to enter Savage (Character at level 100, have cleared Arcadion 4 Normal) have cleared the last floor. This has been, at least to my knowledge, fairly constant over the course of this games life. (That of course does not say how many people attempt at it, or how many people actually play the content, even if unsuccessfully)

ETA: looks like it has been answered above too, was Hyperbole. Will keep that post here up though.

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Thanks, I do appreciate something that is somewhat a source (I'm very much interested in the statistics). As you said, it's not a reliable number, how many people have attempted, have kept trying, etc. Also not counting private lodestones. I myself have not cleared a final tier of a raid since Coil but have cleared the other fights, and still thoroughly enjoy raiding, as I am sure there's many a number of other people out there like me (vouching for pretty much my entire friend group and people I've spoken to as well as raided with.)

Either way, these numbers aren't concerning SE enough to change the main appeal of the game and the main content the produce for the game.

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Originally Posted by Erzaa

Well, let's see now.

First you misrepresent me by stating I'm misrepresenting Dark Souls, when all I said is I don't care about Dark Souls, after someone brought up Dark Souls, not me.

Secondly, you assume I've not tried EX or Savage and somehow would enjoy it if I do, when I've literally said I've no interest in it.

Someone else is telling me I'm playing the wrong game and genre, after I've spent 4,5 years having done everything else in the bloody game.

And for some reason, all these raiders can't understand the possibility that someone else might not enjoy the same things they do, and might possibly want something else for themselves to do and take is as a personal affront.

I don't care if you like hardcore raiding, go for it. I don't want them to remove hardcore raiding, have fun with it. But, I would like to also get my money's worth and have some activities to do in the damn game. Is that so bad?

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I didn't assume anything. The Dark Souls analogy is there so you understand why people like raiding and that it has nothing to do with "flexing online". This isn't me forcing you to play content you don't like, you're getting upset over nothing.

Also, flip this over. I love raiding content, and I exhaust it pretty fast because there's so little of it. It's not fair for me to suddenly demand they stop adding content for housing so we can have more savage content, Chaotic Raids was added to no detriment of the way they release content.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

I appreciate that we've finally departed from this nonsensical 'neurobiology dictates that only 1% of people have the theoretical potential to clear savage' and arrived at the real limiting factor: finding something fun or not.

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The neurobiology argument almost broke me.