How to Dragoon Per Second: A DPS Paradigm

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Neyka

snip

---

Just wondering if you are taking into account what you can get from food to help counter the acc loss? There's a few you can use, even the old stuff to help if you're not in need of other stats which may add further difficulty to your choices :)

On the topic of gear, i'm aiming to get everything Est Drg related anyway - based on my group learning AS1 currently and we're in desperate need of a caster (btw anyone interested/know anyone looking for a team please feel free to direct them my way :P ) So getting further than that for the time being will be slow going at best. I'm just going to wing it on a weekly basis depending on progress, acc cap and ss cap :3 Maths and I just don't compute so i'm not too fussed about ratings - if i can do top deeps for my group and they're happy with me then its all good ^^b Shouldn't need to rely solely on others with the number crunching prowess.

That's not saying it isn't helpful mind :) Just my own thoughts on the subject. Don't worry too much if you're not maxing everything - be the best you can be that make the people you play with and yourself happy! You'll all get the content down in your own times :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lucael_Shikaree

Can you tell me how much DPS you guys do on A1 Savage boss?

---

I got 978 on my clear with this; food was NQ Morel Salad and I popped two X-Pots (because I'm poor lel).

Well, after hovering in the 900s on dummy, I was able to get to 1150-1200 by precasting battle litany. My sks is at 635iirc, but I noticed that 22 is very very tight to pop Geirskogul. Also noticed that double weaving delays me especially botd.

I'm thinking still low for i189 with no buffs, but at least better than the comically low numbers I was getting

My static took our first stab at A1S last night. With 575 accuracy, I had 1 miss on Faust, most likely when the tank died and he turned to attack me. I don't think I missed at all from the flank.

Our best attempt got Faust down to 4% or so.

I was averaging around 1130 dps on Faust only, so I need to figure out how to step that up a bit. I did notice a few things however. I had previously been avoiding using double ogcd skills, but in a few situations it seems to make a big difference, so I need to get into the practice of using them more, especially with bfb and botd.

You really want to make sure that you're not casting botd at the start of the gcd cooldown time. After the second gk, you typically have less than 1 second left on your botd buff (and about 10-15 seconds left on cooldown) when it's time to refresh with FnC or WT. Casting your botd 1 or 1.5 seconds into the GCD cooldown is often the difference between keeping the buff up at that point, or having it fall off right as WT or FnC comes of gcd cooldown.

So basically, always try to either double cast IR with BOTD, or delay casting BOTD until halfway through the gcd cooldown.

Never use GK on combo 3. Delay it until the next combo, which gives you 24s remaining.

I'm working on another GK write up soon.

I like to delay a Geirskogul and reapply BotD in between the 3rd and 4th combo to give me a free 28-29 seconds and a guaranteed 2 geirskoguls back to back

So a quick question for the number crunchers out there but, if there are 2 DRGs in a party, would that affect the rotation at all for optimization? Like, could they work off each other's Disembowel debuff and improve their output at all or would it just be a wash?

That would be ~5% DPS lost. Chaos Thrust is just that good.

You should stagger Battle Litany, though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

How much acc is needed for Savage? I'm at nearly 700 now at i190.

---

My friend has about that and does fine, so I guess it's enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grieve

So a quick question for the number crunchers out there but, if there are 2 DRGs in a party, would that affect the rotation at all for optimization? Like, could they work off each other's Disembowel debuff and improve their output at all or would it just be a wash?

---

Hirose gave the number crunching above, but the logic is to just keep doing the rotation, Disembowel doesn't stack, but Chaos Thrust does, that's 250 potency from the rear, not counting the DoT potency.

I'd say it's a loss if you don't do the Chaos Thrust combo even when you have 2-3-4 DRG in the party.

But yesssss, don't use battle litany while the buff is still up, lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greyfrost

Hirose gave the number crunching above, but the logic is to just keep doing the rotation, Disembowel doesn't stack, but Chaos Thrust does, that's 250 potency from the rear, not counting the DoT potency.

I'd say it's a loss if you don't do the Chaos Thrust combo even when you have 2-3-4 DRG in the party.

But yesssss, don't use battle litany while the buff is still up, lol.

---

Okay, I maybe I didn't explain it well, but I was thinking that if you have 2 dragoons you might be able to get away with deviating from the current rotation and go to a "HT -> IDC4 -> Phb -> TTT4 -> HT -> TTT4 -> Phb -> IDC4 -> HT -> TTT4 -> Phb -> TTT4 -> repeat" or the old combo with the added fourth attacks. The idea would be that one DRG would start with the IDC4 combo and the other would start with a TTT4 combo and move into the IDC4. The idea would be to allow less overlap on Disembowel while letting your own Chaos Thrust tick the whole way through.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grieve

Okay, I maybe I didn't explain it well, but I was thinking that if you have 2 dragoons you might be able to get away with deviating from the current rotation and go to a "HT -> IDC4 -> Phb -> TTT4 -> HT -> TTT4 -> Phb -> IDC4 -> HT -> TTT4 -> Phb -> TTT4 -> repeat" or the old combo with the added fourth attacks. The idea would be that one DRG would start with the IDC4 combo and the other would start with a TTT4 combo and move into the IDC4. The idea would be to allow less overlap on Disembowel while letting your own Chaos Thrust tick the whole way through.

---

I don't think that's going to work out favorably because CT is still that much stronger than FT

Simply put.. 600, 360, 360 vs 530, 360, 530

Not even including ID,Dis being stronger than TT,VT

Edit: more accurately, I think, would be 600,360,360 (x2) and 530,360 (x3), plus 50 potency (x2, one lines up) for ID/Dis difference

2640 vs 2770

If my math is in the ballpark at least.. Which is around 5% as Sunny said..

Edit 2: Because I'm bored at the moment.. Did I do something wrong?

http://i1072.photobucket.com/albums/...psopiiuxms.png

Barely 1% difference

Quick question !

I'm aiming towards Dervy's recommended 625-642 Accuracy build for progression sake and have been relinquishing slaying drops to my groups monk. However, I grew rather concern about my rotation for having less than 590 skillspeed. So my question is, how big of a deal is it to be under the recommended skillspeed ?

An answer would be much appreciated, and sorry if this has been answered before !
Thanks in advance !

rough numbers for eso wep - 1315 dps 17% crit at i184 (had to switch mains recently ;_; ) over 3:20 with black truffle/xpot/party

first parse i did so i have no idea if it's cherry picked or not haha

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jin_Asanagi

Quick question !

I'm aiming towards Dervy's recommended 625-642 Accuracy build for progression sake and have been relinquishing slaying drops to my groups monk. However, I grew rather concern about my rotation for having less than 590 skillspeed. So my question is, how big of a deal is it to be under the recommended skillspeed ?

An answer would be much appreciated, and sorry if this has been answered before !
Thanks in advance !

---

There were 2 sets posted.

http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/R6NH

I'm slowly going through the OP now anyway sorting things out, changing format and adding new info

What is a "4th tier combo?"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Woots

What is a "4th tier combo?"

---

With Blood the Dragon active, once you acquire Fang and Claw, you will "proc" Sharper Fang and Claw after completing one of the following combos:
- True Thrust -> Vorpal Thrust -> Full Thrust (Sharper Fang and Claw OR Enhanced Wheeling Thrust procs)
- Impulse Drive -> Disembowel -> Chaos Thrust (Sharper Fang and Claw OR Enhanced Wheeling Thrust procs)

...which allows you to use Fang and Claw, a new GCD. When you get Wheeling Thrust, you have a chance to proc Enhanced Wheeling Thrust instead of Sharper Fang and Claw, enabling use of Wheeling Thrust instead. Because they proc after a "3rd tier combo" (a combo comprised of 3 moves), the new procs allow for a "4th tier combo."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by spelley

With Blood the Dragon active, once you acquire Fang and Claw, you will "proc" Sharper Fang and Claw after completing one of the following combos:
- True Thrust -> Vorpal Thrust -> Full Thrust (Sharper Fang and Claw OR Enhanced Wheeling Thrust procs)
- Impulse Drive -> Disembowel -> Chaos Thrust (Sharper Fang and Claw OR Enhanced Wheeling Thrust procs)

...which allows you to use Fang and Claw, a new GCD. When you get Wheeling Thrust, you have a chance to proc Enhanced Wheeling Thrust instead of Sharper Fang and Claw, enabling use of Wheeling Thrust instead. Because they proc after a "3rd tier combo" (a combo comprised of 3 moves), the new procs allow for a "4th tier combo."

---

Ah I see. Thank you.

Just a quick update to the guide.

I've shifted a few of the contents in the pages "up" once, so it leaves me room to discuss a lot more advanced rotational tips, cooldown alignment and other things. I also do not know if I should shift the experienced Life-Surge usage (where you use LS on the nearest possible 4th/FT) down to the advanced section.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post3036772

If you have any tips and other things that should be there, or wish for me to discuss, now's the chance to say so, as I'm working on the write-up.

How's everyone spending their tomes for the next few weeks? We got weapon this week - what order should we be following assuming we want to do Savage?

Hello Dervy i was wondering if you can give me some advice. I love your rotation but i play on console with a controller and i was wondering if you know the best way to set up my cross bar to fit this new rotation ?

Thank you for your time

I messaged you on YouTube already! Hahaha

Hello Dervy !
I'm trying to improve myself as a Dragoon, but I can't fit 3 Geirskoguls following your rotation ( H -> [BL+BFB] -> ID -> [IR+BOTD] -> DI -> [DRAC-POT] -> CT -> [PS+ LEGS] -> 4TH -> [JUMP] -> P -> [SSD] -> TT -> [DFD] -> VP -> [LIFES + GK] -> FT -> 4TH ).
Am I doing something wrong ? Can you show me a step by step rotation with two BotD application please ?

I've got 610 in Skillspeed by the way. Maybe it's not enough with my latency :x

Thanks a lot for your work ! =)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Woots

What is a "4th tier combo?"

---

Surprised you don''t know considering your DRG is 51 and presumably you're using the new HW rotation, albeit must be a combo of new/old until you get your new skills?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Calista

Hello Dervy !
I'm trying to improve myself as a Dragoon, but I can't fit 3 Geirskoguls following your rotation ( H -> [BL+BFB] -> ID -> [IR+BOTD] -> DI -> [DRAC-POT] -> CT -> [PS+ LEGS] -> 4TH -> [JUMP] -> P -> [SSD] -> TT -> [DFD] -> VP -> [LIFES + GK] -> FT -> 4TH ).
Am I doing something wrong ? Can you show me a step by step rotation with two BotD application please ?

I've got 610 in Skillspeed by the way. Maybe it's not enough with my latency :x

Thanks a lot for your work ! =)

---

Then you're using Geirskogul somewhere, where your BotD timer is below 21s when you've used one of your "4th" Abilities. That's the only possibility. The guide even states you should only ever use Geirskogul once you've reached 21s.

Also, never use Geirskogul between "Combos" (either IDC4/TTT4) 3-4.

If you need a visual explanation, somewhere in this video I discuss how to use GK. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjnOKg56N60

EDIT: Remember, I'm reworking the OP, so hopefully everything, including Geirskogul, will be much more clearer to understand and read.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by T2teddy

Surprised you don''t know considering your DRG is 51 and presumably you're using the new HW rotation, albeit must be a combo of new/old until you get your new skills?

---

You don't get any fourth combo hit until level 56.

I would posit that the question will continue to arise because the terminology "4th tier combo" is wildly off-target.

I'm gonna add a proper glossary for the terminology used in this thread to avoid confusion like this, because that's a pretty... Popular question.

Well, as long as the term used literally means that there are three other combos, you're always going to get that question.

hi

in H -> [BL+BFB] -> ID -> [IR+BOTD] -> DI -> [DRAC-POT] -> CT -> [PS+ LEGS] -> 4TH -> [JUMP] -> P -> [SSD] -> TT -> [DFD] -> VP -> [LIFES + GK] -> FT -> 4TH -> Repeat

what do you mean ( [DRAC-POT] )

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Saud

hi

in H -> [BL+BFB] -> ID -> [IR+BOTD] -> DI -> [DRAC-POT] -> CT -> [PS+ LEGS] -> 4TH -> [JUMP] -> P -> [SSD] -> TT -> [DFD] -> VP -> [LIFES + GK] -> FT -> 4TH -> Repeat

what do you mean ( [DRAC-POT] )

---

http://xivdb.com/?item/12622/Draconi...on-of-Strength

Very expensive to make, most people use X-Pots to raid unless they're going for a progression clear.

let me tell you about the 130mil i spent so far on this raid tier

Is battle litany+15% to your actual crit chance? Or is it +15% to the same crit hit stat found on gear?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

Is battle litany+15% to your actual crit chance? Or is it +15% to the same crit hit stat found on gear?

---

15% actual crit chance, it doesn't impact your CHR, including crit damage.

Hi !

Concerning the Advanced Opener, since I can't afford Drac Pot beacause they are quite expensive on Moogle and I'm poor, what oGCD should I use instead of it before Chaos Thrust ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tetsuya

@Dervy:
Am I overlooking something? Sorry to bring this up on you, but can you at least tell me how to calculate the total amount of stat weights on a Gear Set, like you did on the Set\\'s you provided on the front page?
Since nobody else seemed to care to answer or didn\\'t know the answer at least. Kinda frustrated now and thought I\\'d ask you directly instead, though I hate to trouble you more than you already might be...

---

It's literally just multiplying the amount of a secondary stat you have by its weight; not hard.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sekundessounet

Hi !

Concerning the Advanced Opener, since I can't afford Drac Pot beacause they are quite expensive on Moogle and I'm poor, what oGCD should I use instead of it before Chaos Thrust ?

---

NQ Drac Pots or X-Pots.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sekundessounet

Hi !

Concerning the Advanced Opener, since I can't afford Drac Pot beacause they are quite expensive on Moogle and I'm poor, what oGCD should I use instead of it before Chaos Thrust ?

---

Then replace it with an X-Potion.

Thanks for your answer !
I saw that you reworked the OP and now with your explanation of the new rotation :

HT - ID - [BOTD] - DI - CT - 4TH - PH - TT - VP - FT - [GK] - 4TH

--- DO NOT USE GEIRSKOGUL HERE
HT - ||| ID - DI - CT - 4TH - PH ||| - TT - VP - FT - 4TH - [GK]

HT - ID - DI - CT - 4TH - [GK] - PH - TT - VP - [BOTD] - FT - 4TH

I can fit the 3 GK, sometimes with 1s left on BOTD but it works :p

So, after the new application of BOTD, do you follow with :

HT - ID - DI - CT - 4TH - [GK] - PH - TT - VP - [BOTD] - FT - 4TH <---- last line of your step by step
HT - ID - DI - CT - 4TH - [GK] - PH - TT - VP - FT - 4TH
HT - ID - DI - CT - 4TH - [GK] - PH - TT - VP - FT - 4TH - [GK] (END of BOTD)

Also, I have a question, for oGCD buffs like internal release, do you use them when they're up or do you wait to start a new rotation and use them at the same pattern that the opener ?

Nope.

So on the second BoTD, I delay Gierskogul for an additional combo and save it for Blood For Blood. You'll eventually get 30s on BoTD, but, this will allow you to get x2 Gks per Blood for Blood from this point onwards, and still allow you to get 3 GKs per BoTD. The image just underneath it shows you, visually, how it kinda works.

Still working on the write up, just adding it slowly, bit by bit. I'll be uploading a video of me doing it also.

In other news, any confirmation on Front accuracy on A2S? Updated BiS sets on OP for the turns now, so they're not just random "Ranges" of accuracy. Not including A4S, as its unfair for progression groups going for World 1st. Don't want to give anything away.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dervy

Then replace it with an X-Potion.

---

Thanks you :3

By the way, why don't you choose Brionac while building the BiS ? Does the weapon suck or is the Gordian Trident just too good ? D:

It's not me who builds them. It's Excel! Blame Microsoft!! But nah, nothing will beat a Crit/Det weapon.