What is wrong with this community?

Its the cross server duty system. Why would anyone show respect to someone they wont have to deal with on a daily basis.

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Originally Posted by Vix_Spellweaver

Its the cross server duty system. Why would anyone show respect to someone they wont have to deal with on a daily basis.

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Because they're a decent human being?

Do you go around wasting random people's time and trashing talking the hell out of them for nothing, in your day-to-day life? Common courtesy doesn't stop at the border of your keyboard. People seem to forget that there's actual people behind the character.

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Originally Posted by Reinheart

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The thing is, jerks are likely to stand out more then the more friendly and helpful people. Luckily, there are plenty of people who want to invest time to teach others how to run a dungeon or at least do not burst into a rage because of a wipe.

Yesterday I saw the following shout in Camp Revenant Toll: "Titan HM speed run and farming party 7/8 looking for white mage. Geared and experienced. No f**k ups tolerated!"

I didn't know people would actually say that when forming parties... It's sad really.

But, Reinheart, you can always call me if you need an extra hand with anything.

If there are any new players on Sargatanas who need help learning the first 3 dungeons, don't hesitate to ask for assistance. I love to help out in anyway I can. Having a good basis will help you on the long run.

Wait til you get to primals and get dressed down by some elitist d-bag, then he strips naked and starts MPKing the group to force someone to leave.

TBH I think I am done with Duty Finder, I just wish I could find a decent EU LS/FC :(

I wonder if the JP duty finder is this bad ?

It's an interesting problem, because it's not something I have yet to experience leveling up with the DF. However friends in my FC has reached 50 have confirmed for me that, at endgame it is apparently very toxic.

The one thing I would suggest, if it would be allowed would be for an independent party to start a "Wall of Shame" where you can report toxic or rude players (With screenshot evidence) and where others then look up their party to see if they have an offender. Now if everyone starts to refuse to play with these offenders then they will eventually quit or improve their behavior. This is something WE as a community could do to clean up, because I do believe we have a responsibility to try and make this a friendly environment that will be a pleasant experience for new and old players alike.

You should never take matters into your own hands (as an online community) and resort to publicly shaming people on a forum. The best thing you can do is report them via the in-game reporting channels (through the main menu -> Support Desk -> Contact Us -> Report Harassment).

It's not about shaming, it's about ostracizing these players so that they either realize the consequences of their actions or leave the game. We as a community should have an active role in cleansing this poison out.

It is hard to have a good community when everyone is out for themselves. It is questing solo (or do major lag fest FATES) and you really don't have to communicate with anyone if you didn't want to. It is all about grind grind grind to get to end game, once end game is around it is grind some more for your Elite gear.

What I miss the most is SWG where the community relied on each other. You depended on the smuggler to slice your weapons, the doctor and dancers for their buffs etc. And people used to gripe about waiting 10 minutes for the shuttle, but that is where I met so many great people. In this game, it is standing around the town until a FATE pops and zerging to it, or waiting for the duty finder to pop. I am feeling a little put off right now by some of the community's attitudes lately. It is a game, to be enjoyed, not something to make you have a heart attack over just because one person in the party never did the run before, or has sub par gear.

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Originally Posted by Vix_Spellweaver

Its the cross server duty system. Why would anyone show respect to someone they wont have to deal with on a daily basis.

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I've actually had a few people be rude and such believing they were not on my server, when in fact they were. It was kind of funny, but also kind of sad that our server had bad eggs like that. Does anyone know if blacklisting someone like that prevents you from getting into a duty finder party with that person again?

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Originally Posted by Feathery

It's not about shaming, it's about ostracizing these players so that they either realize the consequences of their actions or leave the game. We as a community should have an active role in cleansing this poison out.

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I understand where you are coming from, trust me... I do. But, like I mentioned before, the best way to do that is to report them via the official in-game channels, not by throwing it on the forums For everyone to see.

The FFXIV Special Task Force is there. Let the them handle it from there.

Yep, its official I will uncheck the "E" in duty finder or only go with my linkshell mates to avoid the speedrunners and me first people. I rather play the game how its intended or not at all. NA just lost another tank in duty finder.

I have played various online games on both pc and console over the last 15+ years, and never have i see such poor behaviour and the lack of general respect for people.

However i have managed to end up in some groups where there have been like minded people as myself.

I always ask if some one is new, explains strats. and never ask any one to skip their scenes. 5-10mins of cut scenes isn't going to make a difference in the grand scheme of things. They have paid the same amount of money as you! if you want a speed run then make a dedicated group don't use DF and then bully people.

Also am not sure why alot of people rage quit; or even try to win... this is like one of the most death friendly games i have ever played.

Today was in a DF party where the DDs didn't focus on an add. They were told to focus on an Add and we prepared to try again. Then the WHM left before we could.

Maybe he ran out of time? More than likely he gave up on the party after one try. I guess he was WHM so he could cue up again quickly, but still. I feel it's poor form that act like you never wipe and therefore no one else should either.

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Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

Today was in a DF party where the DDs didn't focus on an add. They were told to focus on an Add and we prepared to try again. Then the WHM left before we could.

Maybe he ran out of time? More than likely he gave up on the party after one try. I guess he was WHM so he could cue up again quickly, but still. I feel it's poor form that act like you never wipe and therefore no one else should either.

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Thats the kind of attitude I don't get; death in this game cost a bit of gil and some time; I never leave unless the group agrees they want to leave. Who cares at lvl50 death is to be expected! People make mistakes, the fun is trying to workaround those mistakes/limitations and succeed in accomplishing the goal.

I would rather deal with arrogant trash talkers than incessant whiners.

This is not hard to understand, you make a game easy, so easy that literally everyone is at endgame simply by hitting lvl50 and wonder why you get trash/little kids/people who throw tantrums. People think the FF community is/was the best because of FF11 yet people here fight against anything ff11 related, why would you ever expect the same community without the same environment, you all asked for a WoW-type game, enjoy your WoW-type community and the trash-finder you helped create.

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Originally Posted by Raxion

So I'm farming CM with a friend to help him finish getting his Darklight. I get into a group with a pull-happy tank that pulls the second boss and locks a couple people out. We wiped, then he starts trying to trash talk me (the other tank). Then AFKs when I talk back to him.

This is just one minor example of what running with random players has been like in this game. The online community has become nothing more than a cesspool of trash floating downhill to a sewage plant.

If this is the community I can expect to have to deal with, I'm not sure I'll stay. I just can't take being verbally assaulted in every other run for absolutely nothing.

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As much as i agree with you, this is a very common theme in all online games and in life as well. Not sure anything can be done about it just need to grow thicker skin i guess

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Originally Posted by Raxion

So I'm farming CM with a friend to help him finish getting his Darklight. I get into a group with a pull-happy tank that pulls the second boss and locks a couple people out. We wiped, then he starts trying to trash talk me (the other tank). Then AFKs when I talk back to him.

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Same case, more or less, when i ran mine. the other healer loved to run into mobs of 8 and spam Holy in the middle of them while no one else was near them and begins to spam "lol rez me." I, as the other healer, ended up just not healing/rez'ing him anymore. We finally get to the final boss, and we told everyone to "stay out of the fire." He does so, but not healing a single person at all other than himself. We wiped once, went wtf to him, and he just said "u gaiz told me 2 no b on fiya." in the end, i solo healed CM.

As soon as their subscription time starts you'll see them move on.

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Originally Posted by Riko_113

As soon as their subscription time starts you'll see them move on.

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Probably not, they're the kind of people you see in FFXI at end-game, just here they're more concentrated since XIV doesn't have such a varied end-game as XI used to have .. now XI is also concentrating the min/max jerks due to SE hacing obsoleted all previous end-game content with their latest addition so SOA.

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Originally Posted by TwerpTank

Every step I take towards endgame bums me out. Is this what I have to look forward to? I'm already having problems finding a group and I just now got to stone vigil. No one wants to run with a first time tank. Insert sad face.

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Honey, you have to own being a tank. Everyone is a rookie at some point. Don't let people crowd your style. One of our worst and best qualities is that we are all Divas. Every tank has his style and way of doing things that the others have to deal with.

Every new dungeon I say, "Bonjour, I'm a rookie here so let me know of anything crazy." If they say anything bad, just start marking and pulling. They will shut up once they see you can still, amazingly, be a great tank without running the thing a hundred times.

You're going to deal with hot heads, tough guys, posers, know-it-alls, and a-holes. Our job as a tank is to shut them up and set them straight.

I am coming in late here, but I finally got to 50 and ran CM for the first time.

It was the single worst experience I have had with this game yet. In every single other Duty Finder event I have done, you need only say "hey I am new, what do I need to know?" and everyone is cool about it and helps you out as needed.

But enter CM, and expect very simple things like an explanation of mechanics or to simply watch the cutscenes, and I am yelled at, called a noob, left behind, etc. If there were a vote kick mechanic, it would be severely abused by these people.

I think I read that SE is planning to fix this dungeon, and I hope they are planning to do it soon.

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Originally Posted by Synra

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One problem I see with vote kick in this situation though, say if I or you were the first timer and everyone else (should say most) are speed runners and don't like helping new people, when they see that vote kick option, they might turn around and use it on us for being the first timer.

Just to be clear, I haven't cleared CM after my first run as stated in my previous post on this thread. I just worry this is what's going to happen next.

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Originally Posted by Reinheart

One problem I see with vote kick in this situation though, say if I or you were the first timer and everyone else (should say most) are speed runners and don't like helping new people, when they see that vote kick option, they might turn around and use it on us for being the first timer.

Just to be clear, I haven't cleared CM after my first run as stated in my previous post on this thread. I just worry this is what's going to happen next.

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I think the FATE system and Duty Finder just haven't done their due purpose, and have instead encouraged the "dehumanization" of the MMO community. Having no real content that involves more than 8 players doesn't help the atmosphere is LSes and FCs either.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

I think the FATE system and Duty Finder just haven't done their due purpose, and have instead encouraged the "dehumanization" of the MMO community. Having no real content that involves more than 8 players doesn't help the atmosphere is LSes and FCs either.

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I guess for F.A.T.E.s although I personally don't like the idea of F.A.T.E. spamming, it's alright.
Also YoshiP mentioned in a JP interview yesterday that it was their intention to have the game setup the way it is so people would be forced to wanting to build their own community or join a community to continue on in their journey. Lot's of stuff that would help with the community is going to be introduced in patch 2.1.

Translation of the article I did yesterday here : http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post1290186

I don't run DF much, mostly all people from my server via a few Linkshells and the FC. But in my experience, if you are the tank, no one talks crap to you much because they don't want you to leave and make them wait hours for a que again, and getting a tank replacement on a run is likely not going to happen because they uncheck "runs in progress". As such a lot of tanks abuse their staying power and act like complete $%#@. I am not one such tank, but yeah.

Personally I take Duty Finder with a grain of salt. It's a luxury feature of the game and you shouldn't depend on it. It is really easy to form a linkshell for level 50 only players and get runs for castrum together with the duty finder because everyone needs to farm castrum.

In fact when I made my linkshell and shouted for level 50 members for CM and AK farming, I had 30 members in less than 10 minutes and in castrum 10 minutes later. Now we've done chimera, hydra, ak a ton, castrum, HM Ifrit, etc etc.

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Originally Posted by Kallera

I think the FATE system and Duty Finder just haven't done their due purpose, and have instead encouraged the "dehumanization" of the MMO community. Having no real content that involves more than 8 players doesn't help the atmosphere is LSes and FCs either.

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I totally agree with this.

It's worse than making you view other players as solely a means to an end, though. Since the game is such a mad march to funnel you to level 50, you don't even learn to play your job appropriately with a group. All these fresh 50s are getting dropped into groups with more "hardcore" players, trying to get their goods and get out, and it's causing a lot of contention.

I don't even think the design appropriately encourages you to do things like level other jobs for specific spells and abilities. There is a disturbing amount of WHM and SCH who don't seem to realize how useful Swiftcast is, and it's not their fault. The game doesn't give them any opportunity to learn why until they're suddenly being yelled at by other people.

It could be worse. It could be the Ultimate Ninja Storm 3 community.

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Originally Posted by redisdrunk

I don't even think the design appropriately encourages you to do things like level other jobs for specific spells and abilities. There is a disturbing amount of WHM and SCH who don't seem to realize how useful Swiftcast is, and it's not their fault. The game doesn't give them any opportunity to learn why until they're suddenly being yelled at by other people.

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How about when your in AK and the tank is a war without provoke because they didn't level gladiator past 15 and wipes on wall 15 times because they can't pick up the flies efficiently.

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Originally Posted by Jeronlmo

This is not hard to understand, you make a game easy, so easy that literally everyone is at endgame simply by hitting lvl50 and wonder why you get trash/little kids/people who throw tantrums. People think the FF community is/was the best because of FF11 yet people here fight against anything ff11 related, why would you ever expect the same community without the same environment, you all asked for a WoW-type game, enjoy your WoW-type community and the trash-finder you helped create.

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too funny.

I swear wherever i go, cupgirl on leviathan trolls me. If i say something in /shout she/he start's being a troll. i understand the mmo community, but i will admit there are more "Elitist" "Troll's" in this game than the others i have played.

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Originally Posted by Roaman

Bogus Alpha-male nonsense.

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This fake alpha-male post right here is the reason most of you frat-boys are held in such contempt in this community. What the hell is "soft" about acting like you have some sense in an online game? If you tried talking crazy like you just did in any major city, you'd likely get your behind kicked from one end of the street to the other.

I'll say it again for the thinking-impaired cave-dwellers: You're playing a GAME! Act like you have some damn sense!

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Originally Posted by Haoma

It could be worse. It could be the Ultimate Ninja Storm 3 community.

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That was a really great game

This is a general response to the handful of people who have said; "Grow a thicker skin" or "toughen up!".

For a lot of people, this is part of growing a thicker skin. Well the message boards are often more toxic (I have other, less board friendly words for it) than the in-game community; it's also the place you can go and realize you aren't alone in your issue. And that helps.

It worries me, though, that a surprisingly large chunk of people on the boards react to the slightest complaint or concern, even if it's something incredibly reasonable, with such vile rebuttal. If a piece of the game isn't quite working, and you say that it isn't, it's not half a page into the thread before the "Quit the game then!". And it usually just gets worse from there.

The vast majority of people who are voicing a complaint or concern are doing it because they genuinely enjoy, even love, the game they're playing and they only want to see it improve. Shouting those people down not only chases away the long term potential for the game, but you're also hurting the game itself. A complacent community is one with a stale product.

Be optimistic, but don't mistake optimism for zealotry. Allow people to have an opinion that differs from yours. If you truly think it's a horrendous idea? Then the developers likely will too. You don't need to try and pillory the person for simply stating what they think. You can explain a differing opinion without having to try and make the other person smaller, or tear them down.

TLDR: We all love the game. Be like, cool to one another, you know?

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Originally Posted by Starcore

I swear wherever i go, cupgirl on leviathan trolls me. If i say something in /shout she/he start's being a troll. i understand the mmo community, but i will admit there are more "Elitist" "Troll's" in this game than the others i have played.

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That's definitely harassment. I would report them if I were you.

I hate to lament the community to the community but so many people in DF have just been terrible. I haven't encountered so many rude people since I went back to WoW briefly at the start of Cataclysm. The was the reason I quit WoW for good, dungeon finder destroyed peoples' social skills and decency.

Then I come here and see more and more stories about the people I can expect to meet at endgame and I almost don't want to level.

However, being in a French or German group is a completely different experience.

i have to agree with the OP, using final fantasy 11 as an example, or even EQ, it was far more seldom to see people act like idiots, because they would get popular very fast, and since ff11 and eq were *gasp* community-centric, those bad and nasty players would get marooned from progressing content, buuut since mmorpgs are now based on being spoonfed like a big whiny baby, pretty much nothing matters anymore
:/

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Originally Posted by DwightParkman

i have to agree with the OP, using final fantasy 11 as an example, or even EQ, it was far more seldom to see people act like idiots, because they would get popular very fast, and since ff11 and eq were *gasp* community-centric, those bad and nasty players would get marooned from progressing content, buuut since mmorpgs are now based on being spoonfed like a big whiny baby, pretty much nothing matters anymore
:/

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Using those games as an example isn't really quite fair, much smaller community base so of course there would be situations like that. With the toxic players in mind i do agree that its a major problem since there is no way to punish said Toxic individuals (No vote kick etc) and of course if there is no punishment for acting like a total jackass a lot of people will.

It's easier to be negative than to contribute constructively.

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Originally Posted by LoLo

Yep, its official I will uncheck the "E" in duty finder or only go with my linkshell mates to avoid the speedrunners and me first people. I rather play the game how its intended or not at all. NA just lost another tank in duty finder.

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I think I just might do this as well. I'd rather run with people that don't speak the same language, than people who do, at this point. I'm going to do the content the way I want to do it. If there's a way to avoid having to deal with rude people, so be it. Let the queue times get longer for all I care.