Advice on Graphics Cards

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Originally Posted by RowanLauron

Mine is a custom rig from the case up...built about 2 years ago, with no changes since then. I'm thinking my best upgrade option would be a new vid card considering I'm on a budget atm..

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Ya like Abriael said, the only thing you really need is a new video card. Whats your budget? If your budget is around $300+, then there are some more GPU options then a 660 but if your budget is $200, then 660 is your best bet, the one linked above is a nice card.

I personally like This one better. Its higher clocked for the same price and I personally prefer EVGA over Gigabyte. It gets a bit hot though so you need a well vented case.

Well, new power supply and graphics card for me. lol

I just hope I have enough to buy them after all my important expenses are taken care of when Iget my income tax check. Thanks everyone for all the awesome advice. I'll just have to buckle down and do it. And I guess I'll learn to install it as well. The only people I know who could do it for me are the people at Best Buy, and there's no way in hell I'm paying $50 for that. Nope, screw THAT.

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Originally Posted by SkyeWindbinder

Well, new power supply and graphics card for me. lol

I just hope I have enough to buy them after all my important expenses are taken care of when Iget my income tax check. Thanks everyone for all the awesome advice. I'll just have to buckle down and do it. And I guess I'll learn to install it as well. The only people I know who could do it for me are the people at Best Buy, and there's no way in hell I'm paying $50 for that. Nope, screw THAT.

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Ya don't pay them $50 for that, Its not that hard these days to PC upgrades. I'm sure you can find some youtube videos that show you how, just look up changing PSU and cable management and you should be good. If you still have trouble, i'm sure people on the forums can help.

Thanks for the replies! I'll research the options you guys suggested. Thanks again :)

I had a friend recommend this one.

He knows my budget so this is what I would be able to afford atm...and for some reason when I built my rig I bought a smaller case so it's a tad bit cramped in there...may cause some heating issues.

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Originally Posted by Shura

Ya like Abriael said, the only thing you really need is a new video card. Whats your budget? If your budget is around $300+, then there are some more GPU options then a 660 but if your budget is $200, then 660 is your best bet, the one linked above is a nice card.

I personally like This one better. Its higher clocked for the same price and I personally prefer EVGA over Gigabyte. It gets a bit hot though so you need a well vented case.

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That's my problem with EVGA's cards. Their cooling solutions are always pretty meh, which in turn doesn't leave much allowance for further clocking.

I'm currently running my Gigabyte at 1083/1148 6308 (which is quite a bit more than the EVGA) and the fans don't even need to go over 70% to keep it nice and cool.

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Originally Posted by RowanLauron

Thanks for the replies! I'll research the options you guys suggested. Thanks again :)

I had a friend recommend this one.

He knows my budget so this is what I would be able to afford atm...and for some reason when I built my rig I bought a smaller case so it's a tad bit cramped in there...may cause some heating issues.

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Thats the same card i had linked, just on a different site, and a bit cheaper from the looks of it. Would help to know what case you have but if your worried about heating issues, the one Abriael recommended has better cooling.

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Originally Posted by Shura

Thats the same card i had linked, just on a different site, and a bit cheaper from the looks of it. Would help to know what case you have but if your worried about heating issues, the one Abriael recommended has better cooling.

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I can't even remember the name of it, but I can easily maneuver around everything when I clean it so it's not THAT small I guess. And I guess I didn't pay attention to what you linked. I'm half asleep with a headache so the words are getting blurry :(

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Originally Posted by RowanLauron

I can't even remember the name of it, but I can easily maneuver around everything when I clean it so it's not THAT small I guess. And I guess I didn't pay attention to what you linked. I'm half asleep with a headache so the words are getting blurry :(

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Ya cable management will help with cooling. The thing is the EVGA card does run a bit hot, and this is in cases that are well vented so it might not be the best solution depending on your case. Maybe you can post a pic of your case or something. Hope you feel better.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

That's my problem with EVGA's cards. Their cooling solutions are always pretty meh, which in turn doesn't leave much allowance for further clocking.

I'm currently running my Gigabyte at 1083/1148 6308 (which is quite a bit more than the EVGA) and the fans don't even need to go over 70% to keep it nice and cool.

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Abriael a question for you, I'm semi good with PC"s but have a quick question since you seem to have a lot of knowledge, I'm changing my video card gtx 480 OC to a 680GTX. My mother board appears to have some built in vram I think, that is what I was told two years ago when I had it built, currently when I go to dxdiag under display tab, it says gtx 480 total memory 4048. I know the gtx480 has 1500 memory, so for it to say 4048 might mean that the mother board does in deed have memory support towards video?

I guess my question is, if I upgrade to the GTX 680 would I need to change any options in bios to use this extra memory? or just un-install drivers, power down swap cards and install new drivers and I'm good to go?

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Originally Posted by AdorraEloom

Abriael a question for you, I'm semi good with PC"s but have a quick question since you seem to have a lot of knowledge, I'm changing my video card gtx 480 OC to a 680GTX. My mother board appears to have some built in vram I think, that is what I was told two years ago when I had it built, currently when I go to dxdiag under display tab, it says gtx 480 total memory 4048. I know the gtx480 has 1500 memory, so for it to say 4048 might mean that the mother board does in deed have memory support towards video?

I guess my question is, if I upgrade to the GTX 680 would I need to change any options in bios to use this extra memory? or just un-install drivers, power down swap cards and install new drivers and I'm good to go?

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Dxdiag misrepresents video memory quite often. Mine for instance reports 3786 for a card that has 2048. Don't worry about it.

here's a relevant article that explains it:
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=2026022

If your motherboard has a built in integrated video card just disable it via bios to avoid conflicts.

I wouldn't bother getting a new video card with that system its a waste of money that CPU will just bottle neck anything that is good. Unless you want to buy a new motherboard and cpu probably not worth upgrading.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

That's my problem with EVGA's cards. Their cooling solutions are always pretty meh, which in turn doesn't leave much allowance for further clocking.

I'm currently running my Gigabyte at 1083/1148 6308 (which is quite a bit more than the EVGA) and the fans don't even need to go over 70% to keep it nice and cool.

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So i never understood what the different from getting a normal 660 and a OC version? Beside the fact that the company itself OC it? I mean can't you get a normal version and OC it yourself or is there something special about the company OC version?

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

So i never understood what the different from getting a normal 660 and a OC version? Beside the fact that the company itself OC it? I mean can't you get a normal version and OC it yourself or is there something special about the company OC version?

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Yep, all you're getting (in the vast majority of cases) is a regular card, factory OCed. Generally they're better for people who are uncomfortable overclocking. If you're brave enough to overclock yourself then getting a normal version and overclocking that is a fine strategy and should give you similar results.

Another thing to look at is the cooling solution on a particular card. Reference coolers (the ones that are based on the original design spec of the card from either NVidia or ATI) are nowadays pretty good but still not as good as a custom fan like you'd find on an MSI Lightning or ASUS DC2 or something. You could conceivably get better overclocking results on one of those simply because the temps will be a little lower.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

I wouldn't bother getting a new video card with that system its a waste of money that CPU will just bottle neck anything that is good. Unless you want to buy a new motherboard and cpu probably not worth upgrading.

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It's definitely worth upgrading, and if she wants to fully upgrade she doesn't even need a new motherboard, as her socket AM3 can host some definitely good processors and RAM.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

So i never understood what the different from getting a normal 660 and a OC version? Beside the fact that the company itself OC it? I mean can't you get a normal version and OC it yourself or is there something special about the company OC version?

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Biggest difference is that if you overclock a card yourself you void the warranty. A card that has been factory overclocked is covered by warranty for the overclock it comes with.

The second difference is that often factory overclocked cards have a much better cooling solution than the stock one, as they are actually designed to withstand higher voltage and heat.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

<snip>
Coincidentally, I have a scythe mugen 2 too. Faulty processors don't necessarily crash, some just heat up way too much. It may also be a case of badly applied thermal paste (or a very bad thermal paste I guess).

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Oh you actually bothered :D
Well, now I'm kinda bummed out :(
Should try to get rid of it since I now have an AM3+ board... so could go for an upgrade I guess.

edit: thermal paste is the one that was shipped with the cooler, applied thinly so that it covers the heatspreader but it's still "visible" under it... at least that's how I thought it's done.

Since this thread has become pretty general, how about an AM3+ CPU recommendation?

Not to be rude but you really need to upgrade everything... Your CPU and your gpu are very dated. I would suggest saving up and just buying a new computer... You should go i7 and Nvidia in terms of cpu and gpu.... Currently I have an i7 3770k and a Asus Nvidia GTX 570 and I got 9k on my benchmark with everything maxed. The 570 is fairly cheap now... I believe around 150....

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

Oh you actually bothered :D
Well, now I'm kinda bummed out :(
Should try to get rid of it since I now have an AM3+ board... so could go for an upgrade I guess.

edit: thermal paste is the one that was shipped with the cooler, applied thinly so that it covers the heatspreader but it's still "visible" under it... at least that's how I thought it's done.

Since this thread has become pretty general, how about an AM3+ CPU recommendation?

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Considering your on the 965 BC, should go with either the FX-8150 or FX-8350 chips, or if your looking for something cheaper the FX-6200 to see any real difference. Would help a little better if you can let us know what your budget is. I would recommend one of the 8000 chips though, about $30 difference in price for each of the listed chips.

Not sure what paste that cooler has as stock but i would get something like Shin-Etsu.

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Originally Posted by Guyjin37

Yep, all you're getting (in the vast majority of cases) is a regular card, factory OCed. Generally they're better for people who are uncomfortable overclocking. If you're brave enough to overclock yourself then getting a normal version and overclocking that is a fine strategy and should give you similar results.

Another thing to look at is the cooling solution on a particular card. Reference coolers (the ones that are based on the original design spec of the card from either NVidia or ATI) are nowadays pretty good but still not as good as a custom fan like you'd find on an MSI Lightning or ASUS DC2 or something. You could conceivably get better overclocking results on one of those simply because the temps will be a little lower.

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ya that what i thought thank you

@abriael

Thanks that even more info did not know about the warranty thanks :)

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

edit: thermal paste is the one that was shipped with the cooler, applied thinly so that it covers the heatspreader but it's still "visible" under it... at least that's how I thought it's done.

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The method sounds right, but I honestly have no idea of what thermal paste was shipped with the cooler. I immediately threw it away. I actually must have thrown it away so fast that I don't even remember there was thermal paste in the box ^_^;

I never trust thermal paste shipped with anything, as it's normally very low quality, and you simply don't know what its physical and thermal characteristics are. Every thermal paste is slightly (or majorly) different, and some even require different application techniques. If you don't know what thermal paste you're using, you may very well doing it wrong.

At the moment my favorite is this one.

As for CPU recommendations, what Shura said.

I doubt the thermal paste can change the temps by ~15°C, but might look into it. Does the paste lose it's features over time? I used the paste provided with the cooler this time, but before that it was arctic silver. Didn't really change the temps.

Wrote to AMD to see if they will be willing to do anything, if not, then I guess I will be looking around for a different CPU. My budget is as low as it gets atm, I'm usually aiming for best bang for the buck though.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

It's definitely worth upgrading, and if she wants to fully upgrade she doesn't even need a new motherboard, as her socket AM3 can host some definitely good processors and RAM.

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You act like everyone knows how to upgrade their CPU/Motherboard like its no big deal. It is a big deal for a lot of people and they are going to run into issues - whether it is with cabling/drivers/mismatched components. So pairing a GTX 660 with a dual core athlon2 because they 'might' upgrade in the future is a terrible idea. Better to buy a properly matched card like a 6670 and then just buy a complete new system pre-configured at a later date. That is the advise you should be giving people.

Link1

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

I doubt the thermal paste can change the temps by ~15°C, but might look into it. Does the paste lose it's features over time? I used the paste provided with the cooler this time, but before that it was arctic silver. Didn't really change the temps.

Wrote to AMD to see if they will be willing to do anything, if not, then I guess I will be looking around for a different CPU. My budget is as low as it gets atm, I'm usually aiming for best bang for the buck though.

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Ignore the FX-6200 and FX-8150 i recommended earlier and go with FX-6300 and FX-8320, same price as the first 2 but newer and better performance. I would recommend the FX-8320, if that's to much go with the FX-6300 and if your willing to spend more then go with the FX-8350.

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Originally Posted by Quesse

You act like everyone knows how to upgrade their CPU/Motherboard like its no big deal. It is a big deal for a lot of people and they are going to run into issues - whether it is with cabling/drivers/mismatched components. So pairing a GTX 660 with a dual core athlon2 because they 'might' upgrade in the future is a terrible idea. Better to buy a properly matched card like a 6670 and then just buy a complete new system pre-configured at a later date. That is the advise you should be giving people.
Link1

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I think the reason he saying that if you going to upgrade later like 5-8month or 1year you have the card 660. But buying the 6670 then wasting the money for 660 would cost more.

I think that it's point

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Originally Posted by Quesse

You act like everyone knows how to upgrade their CPU/Motherboard like its no big deal. It is a big deal for a lot of people and they are going to run into issues - whether it is with cabling/drivers/mismatched components. So pairing a GTX 660 with a dual core athlon2 because they 'might' upgrade in the future is a terrible idea. Better to buy a properly matched card like a 6670 and then just buy a complete new system pre-configured at a later date. That is the advise you should be giving people.

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I give people the advice I know works well and optimizes their budget, not the advice you want me to give for some mysterious reason.

Your solution is simply not money efficient. Buying something only to throw it away in a few months is a waste of money.

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

I doubt the thermal paste can change the temps by ~15°C, but might look into it. Does the paste lose it's features over time? I used the paste provided with the cooler this time, but before that it was arctic silver. Didn't really change the temps.

Wrote to AMD to see if they will be willing to do anything, if not, then I guess I will be looking around for a different CPU. My budget is as low as it gets atm, I'm usually aiming for best bang for the buck though.

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Good paste doesn't deteriorate for several years if at all, so I wouldn't think that's the cause. At the moment I'm simply thinking about a defective CPU, unless your case ventilation is REALLY horrible. But even in that case it shouldn't be that bad.

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Originally Posted by Shura

Ignore the FX-6200 and FX-8150 i recommended earlier and go with FX-6300 and FX-8320, same price as the first 2 but newer and better performance. I would recommend the FX-8320, if that's to much go with the FX-6300 and if your willing to spend more then go with the FX-8350.

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Thanks, I will look into that. I read some people saying the FX series underperformed compared to same spec phenom II (some saying to go for a 965BE instead of a FX-6200), what's your stance on that?

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Good paste doesn't deteriorate for several years if at all, so I wouldn't think that's the cause. At the moment I'm simply thinking about a defective CPU, unless your case ventilation is REALLY horrible. But even in that case it shouldn't be that bad.

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I have the cooler master 690 II, with most of the fans installed, air pulled from front+bottom and exhausted from top+back, so that shouldn't be the cause either.

Still waiting for a reply from AMD, but not really holding my breath.

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

Thanks, I will look into that. I read some people saying the FX series underperformed compared to same spec phenom II (some saying to go for a 965BE instead of a FX-6200), what's your stance on that?

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Your right, a FX-6200 is not really an upgrade from 965BE, the FX is just newer technology. If you were building a new PC, i would say go with the FX-6200 but if you were upgrading from a 965BE, normally i would tell you to stay with the 965BE and save up for a FX-8320 or FX-8350.

In your case though, your CPU seems defective and also forget the FX-6200, that was a mistake on my part. If you need to change go with the FX-6300 instead which does performs better then the 965BE for the same price. If you think the 965BE can hold for a while longer though, then i would say, save up for a FX-8320, which is a better investment overall; if you must change now and need a cheaper solution, then go with a FX-6300.

Here is a comparison between the 965BE vs FX-6300. You can change the selected CPU to a FX-8320 to see how that compares to the first 2 too.

Thanks. I will probably have to keep this CPU till it dies anyway and from what I see, there isn't that much of a difference between them anyway. I've read an extensive review of the Vishera based FX models here and it seems that AMD CPUs are pretty damn good in multithreaded tasks, but Intel is way ahead of them when it comes to single-threaded performance. Reading more about this (same site), it seems that CPU intensive games, especially MMOs will underperform on AMD systems... causing bottlenecks. Not that I expect my CPU to bottleneck my dated 260GTX...

If u know how or if u do know someone who got experience, u can Overclock the 965BE.
Its a pretty good CPU if it comes to overclocking, as i heard.

I stay with my 965BE for a few more months too and i think about getting it to 3,8 / 3,9 GHz.

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Originally Posted by Alegis

If u know how or if u do know someone who got experience, u can Overclock the 965BE.
Its a pretty good CPU if it comes to overclocking, as i heard.

I stay with my 965BE for a few more months too and i think about getting it to 3,8 / 3,9 GHz.

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Overclocking a 965 BE is very easy (you really need to raise the multiplier and the vCore a bit until it's stable and doesn't heat up too much), mine is running easy at 3.8 ghz, and I could probably push it to 4 with no problems, but Soukyuu is already suffering from overheating problems, so overclocking is probably not a good idea.

He should get a new cooler then. Its less expensive than a new CPU.
I get a new one before too, still have the boxed one...

But i wait till my new GPU arrives (tomorrow or the day after i think) and look how it increases my performance on the Benchmark.

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Originally Posted by Alegis

He should get a new cooler then. Its less expensive than a new CPU.
I get a new one before too, still have the boxed one...

But i wait till my new GPU arrives (tomorrow or the day after i think) and look how it increases my performance on the Benchmark.

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I have the same cooler Abriael has and my CPU is overheating while his isn't. His CPU runs at lower temps overclocked than mine on default clocks. Overclocking in not possible because it crashes once I go a few MHz away from stock clocks, no matter if I over- or underclock it. It's definitely defective, I wish I would just have found it out earlier.

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

I have the same cooler Abriael has and my CPU is overheating while his isn't. His CPU runs at lower temps overclocked than mine on default clocks. Overclocking in not possible because it crashes once I go a few MHz away from stock clocks, no matter if I over- or underclock it. It's definitely defective, I wish I would just have found it out earlier.

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Ok, that sucks...

Hello there!
May I sneak in and ask for your opinions too?
I am running a PC with the following specs:
Win 7 Professional
Asus M4A77T
AMD Phenom II X4 955
PowerColor Radeon HD 6850
630W PSU
8GB RAM
(Nothing overclocked if this might be important.)
(Always had AMD/ATI Cards!)

Well, since a while my Graphics card sometimes is showing issues right after boot when my PC was off over night. Usually in my browser some nice checkboard patterns show up. They disappear after a while and when I hover with my mouse over them. My colleague at work said it might be a heating problem.

Long story short...
I want to get a new card but can't decide. Around 200€ is what I want to spent and the cards I checked out at that german Online Store I use to order at, offer them around that price.
Checked them both out on Newegg too if this helps xD


ASUS GTX660
http://www.mindfactory.de/product_in...--Retail-.html

http://newegg.com/Product/index?item...82E16814121660

(Hopefully I found the right models. Not sure which of them at Newegg is the OC version and also not sure if I need an OC card.)


ASUS HD 7870
http://www.mindfactory.de/product_in...--Retail-.html

http://newegg.com/Product/index?item...82E16814121649


Newegg links used to be mobile links. Just removed the m. I hope they still work.
Thanks in advance!

If youre interested in free download codes for Bioshock Infinite and Tomb Raider (never settle reloaded program from AMD available at mindfactory, caseking.de and alternate.de), get the 7870.

http://forum.chip.de/grafikkarten-so...a-1696517.html

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Originally Posted by Alegis

If youre interested in free download codes for Bioshock Infinite and Tomb Raider (never settle reloaded program from AMD available at mindfactory, caseking.de and alternate.de), get the 7870.

http://forum.chip.de/grafikkarten-so...a-1696517.html

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Not THAT much interested in those codes (maybe Tomb Raider) ^^
Is this the only reason why you would go with the 7870? Just curious.

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Originally Posted by Coris

Not THAT much interested in those codes (maybe Tomb Raider) ^^
Is this the only reason why you would go with the 7870? Just curious.

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Check the link i posted ;)

If u speak german (i think u do, because u mentioned on of our online shops) it could help u to decide which card to choose from a technical point.

I for myself just would prefer it because i use ATI/AMD cards for years and their price/performance level is, from my experience, way higher than the Nvidia one.

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Originally Posted by Alegis

Check the link i posted ;)

If u speak german (i think u do, because u mentioned on of our online shops) it could help u to decide which card to choose from a technical point.

I for myself just would prefer it because i use ATI/AMD cards for years and their price/performance level is, from my experience, way higher than the Nvidia one.

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TY TY I just did :)
The 7870 was the first one I found (at the beginning I 'just' wanted a 7850 but the price difference is not that big and I thought I could get a bit more power for 20-30€ more.)

Ja, stimmt. Ich bin nicht ganz sicher und verzeih mir falls ich falsch liege, aber ich glaube wir hatten mal eine Diskussion über Mille und Mio xD


One thing that annoys me a bit concerning the 7870 is that (just?) the ASUS model needs 2x 6 Pin plugs and uses around 175W.
(Mindfactory says the 660 needs 140W and just 1 6pin)

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Originally Posted by Coris

TY TY I just did :)
The 7870 was the first one I found (at the beginning I 'just' wanted a 7850 but the price difference is not that big and I thought I could get a bit more power for 20-30€ more.)

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80€ more and u get a 7950 ;) just kidding

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Originally Posted by Coris

Ja, stimmt. Ich bin nicht ganz sicher und verzeih mir falls ich falsch liege, aber ich glaube wir hatten mal eine Diskussion über Mille und Mio xD

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Kann gut sein ;) Wenn jemand Millionen mit Mille abkürzt, bin ich bei folgender diskussion immer gern ganz vorn dabei^^

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Originally Posted by Coris

One thing that annoys me a bit concerning the 7870 is that (just?) the ASUS model needs 2x 6 Pin plugs and uses around 175W.
(Mindfactory says the 660 needs 140W and just 1 6pin)

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Atleast all the higher radeon cards do have 2x6 or 1x6+1x8 pins and use about 180W at full load.
But that shouldnt be a real problem unless your Power Supply dont got enough Watt left to feed the radeon.

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Originally Posted by Alegis

80€ more and u get a 7950 ;) just kidding

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No thanks xD I'm an Azubi after all xD
Also I think that might be a bit too much for the rest of my setup? :/

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Kann gut sein ;) Wenn jemand Millionen mit Mille abkürzt, bin ich bei folgender diskussion immer gern ganz vorn dabei^^

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Na dann kommts hin xD

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Atleast all the higher radeon cards do have 2x6 or 1x6+1x8 pins and use about 180W at full load.
But that shouldnt be a real problem unless your Power Supply dont got enough Watt left to feed the radeon.

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(Following data from manufacturer's websites)
CPU needs 125W
HDD 6.80W
No clue about Motherboard, RAM and the like...
Plus the 175W it shod be alright?
Got a modular PSU and a PCIE cable left and the one my 6850 uses atm has another 6pin added to it. Just unsure if this will be a pain to add xD My cable management could be waaaay better and using the 2nd cable would be annoying to put aside in my case.
By the way, length of the card shouldn't be a problem. My case got the option to remove a HDD cage for more space.

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Originally Posted by Coris

No clue about Motherboard, RAM and the like...

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If u know model-names u can check the specifications online.
Ram usually uses up to 1,2W, nothing u cant handle

If u got a 450 - 500W PSU, u should be fine.

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Originally Posted by Coris

Got a modular PSU and a PCIE cable left and the one my 6850 uses atm has another 6pin added to it. Just unsure if this will be a pain to add xD My cable management could be waaaay better and using the 2nd cable would be annoying to put aside in my case.
By the way, length of the card shouldn't be a problem. My case got the option to remove a HDD cage for more space.

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Shouldnt be a pain. If u got enough space for bigger cards, there should be space left to manage an additional cable as well :p


Edit: Zur not, wenns garnicht klappt mit dem zweiten kabel oder dem Netzteil, hast du bei Onlinekäufen ja ein 14 tägiges Rückgaberecht ohne angabe von gründen.